Politics - Quarantine Thread

[MorrisonHiker]

But that's not fuel for the panels! LOL

True...but I'll be saving up sunlight onsite.

 

[Moderatefan]

when you make some partisan attack

I like to think I make personal attacks rather than partisan. What I do enjoy is that such disagreements remain mostly in a civil channel (that is before Trump ) and are solved via peaceful voting, which is one of the greatest things about America. When you start going after your opponents that's where things get real ugly really fast. Many other countries serve as examples.

 

[ℬête Noire]

The whole point is that storing 90 days of fuel onsite doesn't make the grid more resilient. The order was just an excuse to subsidize coal plants.

I suspect it was more-so to subsidize coal mine sales. Set a high number to encourage more stockpiling, even a little higher than most coal gen plants do now, to boost coal orders. Splitting the difference between making coal gen cheaper and coal sales higher.

 

[McRat]

I saw the distress that the massive tax cut to the wealthy caused. The middle class tax cut is practically a rounding error (and one that expires, no less).

Not the wealthy in my state. By capping the state tax deduction, most the rich here are pissed. Sure it stings a little. But saying it's peanuts to the working class is dishonest and self-serving. Only the rich are claiming the tax break in unfair.

For the median family of 4 in California who do not itemize:

Gross income $61,300 (median family income statewide)
Standard deduction (married) $24,000
Mortgage interest deduction $12,000
Charitable donations $1,000
State and local income and/or property tax deduction $5,000
Taxable income $37,300
Brackets

$19,050 x 10% $1,905
$18,250 x 12% $2,190
$0 x 22% $0
$0 x 24% $0
$0 x 32% $0
$0 x 35% $0
$0 x 37% $0
Total $4,095
By paying $4,095 in taxes, you are taxed at 11.0%.

Credits
Federal taxes $4,095
Child Tax Credit ($2,000) x 2 $4,000
Family Tax Credit ($500) x 0 $0
Refundable Tax Credit ($1,400) x 2 - Not eligible
Taxes owed $95

The Trump tax calculator — will you pay more or less?

 

[Runt8]

Not the wealthy in my state. By capping the state tax deduction, most the rich here are pissed. Sure it stings a little. But saying it's peanuts to the working class is dishonest and self-serving. Only the rich are claiming the tax break in unfair.

For the median family of 4 in California who do not itemize:

Gross income $61,300 (median family income statewide)
Standard deduction (married) $24,000
Mortgage interest deduction $12,000
Charitable donations $1,000
State and local income and/or property tax deduction $5,000
Taxable income $37,300
Brackets

$19,050 x 10% $1,905
$18,250 x 12% $2,190
$0 x 22% $0
$0 x 24% $0
$0 x 32% $0
$0 x 35% $0
$0 x 37% $0
Total $4,095
By paying $4,095 in taxes, you are taxed at 11.0%.

Credits
Federal taxes $4,095
Child Tax Credit ($2,000) x 2 $4,000
Family Tax Credit ($500) x 0 $0
Refundable Tax Credit ($1,400) x 2 - Not eligible
Taxes owed $95

Who wins and who loses from the tax bill?

 

[McRat]

Who wins and who loses from the tax bill?

"About half of the households filing returns had incomes below $50,000, according to the Joint Committee on Taxation, but they collectively get just 6.6 percent of the tax gains in the bill."

Uh... they normally aren't paying federal taxes. How can they get gains at all? Doesn't that strike you as odd, that they claim folk who don't pay federal taxes are being harmed?

 

[Runt8]

"About half of the households filing returns had incomes below $50,000, according to the Joint Committee on Taxation, but they collectively get just 6.6 percent of the tax gains in the bill."

Uh... they normally aren't paying federal taxes. How can they get gains at all? Doesn't that strike you as odd, that they claim folk who don't pay federal taxes are being harmed?

It strikes me as odd that you think people making under $50,000 don't pay federal taxes.

 

[ℬête Noire]

"About half of the households filing returns had incomes below $50,000, according to the Joint Committee on Taxation, but they collectively get just 6.6 percent of the tax gains in the bill."

Uh... they normally aren't paying federal taxes. How can they get gains at all? Doesn't that strike you as odd, that they claim folk who don't pay federal taxes are being harmed?

It's getting dangerously off-topic but sure they pay income tax. Even Federal Income Tax, plus of course FICA.

 

[LCR1]

Who wins and who loses from the tax bill?

.5% of 1 Million is 5,000. 1% of 50,000 is 500. So of course you can say oh look the top is keeping 10x more money, while I'd say the middle got twice the tax break

It strikes me as odd that you think people making under $50,000 don't pay federal taxes.

I make under $50k, single, and have no kids. I'm getting back close to 100% if not 100%, haven't finished entering in all my stuff.

 

[McRat]

It's getting dangerously off-topic but sure they pay income tax. Even Federal Income Tax, plus of course FICA.

A normal family of four who has a mortgage and makes $50k pays no federal income tax.
Social Security is not supposed to be a tax. It's a mandatory savings account for retirement.

 

[ℬête Noire]

....while I'd say the middle got twice the tax break.

That's one of sillier things I've read in a LONG time....and I'm on Twitter.

== == ==

Anyway, this thread seems to be off the rails. Bye, all.

 

[LCR1]

That's one of sillier things I've read in a LONG time....and I'm on Twitter.

== == ==

Anyway, this thread seems to be off the rails. Bye, all.

is 1% not twice the amount of .5%? My calculator shows .5*2=1

 

[ℬête Noire]

Social Security is not supposed to be a tax. It's a mandatory savings account for retirement.

You may want to talk to Ephram Nestor about that.

 

[Moderatefan]

We'll soon be installing solar and Powerwalls and will have at least a week's worth of solar in reserve.

In reserve? Are you sure? I believe 1 battery is 13.5 kwh, which is probably less than a daily consumption, i.e. you'd need at least 7. More likely, you expect a sunny weather to recharge the batteries daily.

 

[McRat]

You may want to talk to Ephram Nestor about that.

And your Social Security Number is only to be used for SSA purposes only. And we all know what happened there.

 

[LCR1]

In reserve? Are you sure? I believe 1 battery is 13.5 kwh, which is probably less than a daily consumption, i.e. you'd need at least 7. More likely, you expect a sunny weather to recharge the batteries daily.

Less than daily?

I'd burn through that in about 2 hours at my house

I am a special case though, carry on

 

[McRat]

Exactly, you have to have a tax liability of $7,500 in order to claim all of it anyways. A single person with no dependents would need to have an income for about 47K AFTER all other deductions at accounted for. This would put most single, no dependent people into the 60s for gross income. In all but a select few states/ cities that makes you well to do.

I'll pay significantly more Fed tax next year, but I'll also take another EV credit to take some sting out of it. My state has heavy state taxes, so any 'savings for the rich' I'm supposedly getting are imaginary. Maybe MSNBC or Nancy Pelosi will give me their crumbs?

 

[mjp462]

What's the big fuss? We've known for weeks that the ramp (5000 cars/wk target) has been pushed back 6 months from late Q4 2017 to late Q2 2018. So of course, the standard battery option would also get pushed back 6 months from "Early 2018" to "Mid 2018". This isn't Tesla being deceptive. It's just math (+6 months).

When did Tesla move their 5k goal? When did they move my SR estimate from Early 2018 to Late 2018?
As a consumer, if you don't feel Tesla has been less than honest, you either haven't been paying attention or you are as blind as a Trump Supporter.

 

[FlatSix911]

Sloppy is different than misleading.

Are we discussing Tesla fabric options or a certain email server?

 

[kbM3]

Yeah they are crazy, the Republican party has been doing nothing but winning the last 8 years. Some 1000 seats of government have flipped and now the presidency and many, many justices.

Every republican presidential candidate said they do not believe in evolution except Jeb Bush. But even he said Creationism should be taught alongside it.