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No. It is likely re-estimating NFP, balancing, etc. Even batteries below the capacity threshold can show this behavior, I think.Charged my M3 to 100% just before a long trip today and at 100% it still said it had 35 min remaining. Any thoughts on this? Perhaps this is the "hidden" capacity that is optically locked?
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@AAKEE @AlanSubie4Life @eivissa
Yes, you were correct. It went from 100% down to 99% very shortly after leaving work. Or 353 rated miles down to 351 quickly. I toggle back-and-forth.No. It is likely re-estimating NFP, balancing, etc. Even batteries below the capacity threshold can show this behavior, I think.
If it were the "optical lock," and there were actually a large buffer above 100%, then you would logically expect to have to drive for some time before seeing a reduction in rated miles, or %. But you'll see the miles start to tick off nearly right away.
But you can confirm! After charging to 100%, and waiting for it to complete, start driving right away (can't lose any unmetered energy), and keep an eye on the trip meter. You'll drop about 1% when you've used up about 0.5-1kWh. Or if you switch to rated miles, you'll see miles start to tick off once your trip meter shows 0.2-0.4kWh of use. These are rough numbers - in reality I think it is possible to charge up to 101% or something (I've seen this reported in some SMT captures (the UI will not exceed 100%) but not sure the significance), but no more than that.
If it were a large upper buffer (and we're talking about as much as 2-3kWh here for an 80-81kWh battery with a 77.8kWh degradation threshold), then you would see that much on the trip meter consumption before seeing a decrement in the miles. (You won't see this, I don't think.)
But you should check and let us know. If you actually meter out 2-3kWh of use before seeing a drop in your rated miles, I'd have to change my understanding of the framework. That would be completely inconsistent with my understanding of how it works.
Changing to rated miles (Energy Display -> Distance) makes it easiest to do this experiment.
Again, my current understanding is simply that the energy content of each rated mile is expanded right now. They'll gradually reduce in size over the coming year (or whatever) until you hit the degradation threshold, whereupon their energy content will become constant.
y I think it is possible to charge up to 101% or something
Yes, SMT calculates SOC as Usable Remaining/(NFP-Buffer) and reports with 3 significant figures, as far as I can tell, which would be (Nominal Remaining - Buffer)/(NFP-Buffer), which would be 65.9kWh/(68.6kWh-3.1kWh) = 100.6%, or 101%.My Model 3 LR ( September 2019 ) is losing Kwh like a crazy in last months.
Last week was at 68.6 Kwh.
I have tried to charge it to 100% and leave to that for the night to force BMS to recalibrate.
At some point it showed 101% , LOL.
Next morning nominal full pack was up to 69.4 Kwh.
Now i'm discharging 10% every day and in 2-3 days i'll reach 60% and then i'll go up again at 100%.
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Haven't charged this car to 100% in 4 months. Was going to see what the difference is between chill and sport mode, but the estimator is all funky which doesn't help.In my experience, calibration doesn’t help. I normally charge to 90% which gets me around 240 miles of reported range. If I slide the charge % to 100 in the Tesla app, it will estimate/show around 260-270 miles as the resulting range. My original range limit was 310 miles.
So, if you’re still getting 280 miles at 90%, then you’re probably doing better than most, especially with a 2018 model. So, be happy and just enjoy the vehicle!!
I concur, thought it mattered on long trips, but it really doesn't. Once I finally took a long trip, realized my butt/legs needed a break before the car needed charging.Yeah, I no longer stress/care about what the vehicle reports for the range. Has zero impact on my driving habits, even on longer trips. Sure, I’d love to see my vehicle report 310 as the available miles when I move the slider to 100%. But, I’m also OK with seeing 260-270 miles.
I never charge to 100% period. There are zero real world situations where the additional mileage at 100% makes any difference in my drive/trip, compared to charging it to just 90%. So, why even bother charging it to 100% (and risk potentially harming/degrading the battery pack)?… is my philosophy.
M3 has lost % more in 3 years than my MS in 7 years lol.Yeah, I no longer stress/care about what the vehicle reports for the range. Has zero impact on my driving habits, even on longer trips. Sure, I’d love to see my vehicle report 310 as the available miles when I move the slider to 100%. But, I’m also OK with seeing 260-270 miles.
I never charge to 100% period. There are zero real world situations where the additional mileage at 100% makes any difference in my drive/trip, compared to charging it to just 90%. So, why even bother charging it to 100% (and risk potentially harming/degrading the battery pack)?… is my philosophy.
Will make no difference. The miles are a display of energy, they have nothing to do with modes - the only thing that changes miles is on 2020 LR AWD Performance (and maybe regular...can't remember) vehicles where 18"/19"/20" wheels affect the constant but it's just bookkeeping and makes no difference to the energy.Was going to see what the difference is between chill and sport mode
Haha. Different cells. Not clear how much lower the degradation threshold was than the original capacity for Model S, either. That could in theory hide a lot of initial capacity loss and you'd never know it (without SMT, or calculating your current capacity and comparing to likely initial starting capacity based on other user captures and/or the EPA test results). (But it may well be the cell difference - the 2170L cells arguably are doing better so far, but the data is very very limited. So the 18650s may have been more robust for some reason.)M3 has lost % more in 3 years than my MS in 7 years lol.
Fun little experiment to try:
My projected range had been trending down over the summer, to around 278. I generally finish my daily driving between 6:00 - 8:00 PM, and have been immediately charging to 90%. Recently, I had a new low where my range had shown 275. I then changed my charge level to 80% and enabled scheduled charging to start at 3:00 AM every day, and within a few days it bounced back up to ~290 miles.
For context, my projected range has had various fluctuations of about +/- 5 miles over the past 2 years (the period I’ve been using TeslaFi), with the average being about 285. I’ve used various charging methods, but typically have been charging to 90% daily on a Tesla Wall Charger.
Sounds like a 2020, so it started at 250. Maybe 2019. 2019 started at 240.I bought my car used about a year ago. From what I’ve read it should have had around 260 mile range originally. I don’t remember ever seeing the total range being higher than 235 miles since I’ve owned it? Has it degraded that much?