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Should I be concerned
- Thread starter Nexeus
- Start date
You are talking about your extremely high end expensive finnicky sports car from the first couple of years of a brand new car manufacturer. That is a certain set of conditions, which will make it expensive to own. That's fine. That's your choice, but it's not average middle priced cars as they are now in 2023. This is a pretty grasping kind of red herring to try to use this as an example.
A little bit more expensive in up-front sticker price now, which then has a reasonable crossover point within several years.
No, I got what your point was. It's just blatantly dishonest and not realistic. This isn't my "perspective"; I'm just calling out the B.S.
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K.I.T.T.23
Member
@dwbv I would quote you, but it seems others have taken care of that quite well. I did the math back in 2019 (when I bought my first Tesla) and I saved a lot of $$. I traded in a Tacoma (nice truck, loved it) for a model 3 SR+ thinking that if I ever needed a truck I would just rent one from Home Depot. Theory worked, I had to rent a truck roughly twice a year... cost me about $100 a year so not bad. The fuel savings was insane. In Florida (where I lived at the time) electricity was 7.5 cents per KWH... some of the cheapest in the nation I believe. You are buying into propaganda my friend, hopefully you will understand some day; though you may be in the part of the population that will drive their ICE cars into the sunset!
@Nexeus Man, your thread got hijacked! I apologize. So back to your question: a new Model S P85 should have gotten ~265 miles new. It was probably closer to 250 I would think... so if 9 years later you are seeing 222 that is really good IMHO. If I purchased a Model S that was a decade old I would be sure to have ~$10k in the bank to cover a new battery. Just be ready in case of failure. My philosophy has always been to either have $$ in the bank and buy used, or buy new with a warranty. Used is a bit of a gamble but it can really pay off!
Good luck on your purchase @Nexeus man, and welcome to the Tesla life where all the ladies be swooning over our cars.... lol na... but at least they are smart and fast! Hopefully your dates are too! ... Unless you are married then.. well, just make those other ladies jealous.
@Nexeus Man, your thread got hijacked! I apologize. So back to your question: a new Model S P85 should have gotten ~265 miles new. It was probably closer to 250 I would think... so if 9 years later you are seeing 222 that is really good IMHO. If I purchased a Model S that was a decade old I would be sure to have ~$10k in the bank to cover a new battery. Just be ready in case of failure. My philosophy has always been to either have $$ in the bank and buy used, or buy new with a warranty. Used is a bit of a gamble but it can really pay off!
Good luck on your purchase @Nexeus man, and welcome to the Tesla life where all the ladies be swooning over our cars.... lol na... but at least they are smart and fast! Hopefully your dates are too! ... Unless you are married then.. well, just make those other ladies jealous.
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No propaganda being followed. I'm just realistic that EVs are not going to replace ICE anytime soon. Plus, I will most likely always have an ICE until I die. My P85D is nothing but a "toy" at this point. Still hanging onto my A8 and not letting go anytime soon. The luxury amenities and build quality in that thing will trump any MS all day long.
@Nexeus I do apologize for contributing to your thread being hijacked. I think you should whole-heartedly experience what it feels like to own a Tesla EV. I don't think you will be disappointed. Just keep in mind what you're getting into and enjoy it for what it is for as long as it lasts. Good luck!
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Electric700
Active Member
@wk057 Today, is $5k about right for main battery repair service with a warranty that you include? I thought it was. If there is special transport involved then it might be closer to $7k?
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Electric700
Active Member
Don't forget that there is a net good environmental impact for EVs, which have zero CO2 emissions. And time saved too since there are fewer things to maintain. Tesla's Supercharger network is powered either directly or indirectly with renewables like wind and solar energy now, thankfully.
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He doesn't have one general price quote on an unknown vehicle.
Vendor - Tesla Model S Battery Extended Service Plans from 057 Technology
@wk057 If/when I get your service for my 2015 P85D And the battery needs replacement within your warranty, could I upgrade to a P100DL pack/hardware and if so how much would that be being in your warranty? Will I still get Tesla OTA updates? Car will show as a P100DL in app and car menus...
teslamotorsclub.com
From that comment:
"Every case is different, and depends on stock/availability of the target pack at the time and our actual acquisition costs on those packs."
"The upgrade cost range for the Model S is literally about $4,000 to $40,000... which is a pretty useless metric,"
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The financials with an EV work very well if the resale fits.
If we accept that the average car will go 200k miles eventually, the resale on the EVs will be higher than a comparable ICE because of the gas savings which will go the entire 200k miles.
Example $40k for EV (theoretical, yes you can spend a lot less.) $30k for comparable ICE.
Say $2k saved per year based on average miles driven.
Each person sells car after 5 years
EV owner actually saved the exact extra cost (trying to be both easy and realistic).
The EV sells for $20k vs $15k for the ICE. Not just because of the same percentage, but also because the used car buyer saves $2k per year for the 5 years they own it.
Now - who is the more value conscious person - the used or new car buyer? Obviously the used car buyer. The used car buyer is smarter financially also so they really value that $2k saved per year.
In practice, the Leaf had such a poor range and a poor battery design that it screwed early resale so you can absolutely find numbers that say this isn't true. But have a good battery life and a good replacement cost and that all will fade into memory.
I paid $24k net after TC for my 2013 Leaf. Put 60k miles over 6 years and sold for $6k. I had 5c KWH electricity - so we can call it free and $4 gas was pretty standard averaged over that time. So maybe $1500 saved per year since my mileage per year was low. So $9k saved meant a new $15k car. So $9k for 6 years on a car that did have zero maintenance outside of tires.
I think anyone doing math can say that that is fairly cheap and well below average TCO costs. And that was with a terrible battery so the resale got crushed.
We bought a 2019 model 3LR for just under $40k after TC. I can sell it for $25k pretty easily I would think today. Probably saved $6k in gas secondary to reduced mileage during Covid and my higher electricity costs now (10 cents) and higher supercharging cost. So that is $9k for 4 years for a new (fast, fun, techy) car which again is well below average TCO. Just replaced the battery for $120 so not zero maintenance costs.
My 2 examples and, yes, I ignored the time value of money (or interest if you do that sort of thing).
Now I do have an S also. I paid $80k for it. It has 110k miles on it. If you want to compare to a 20 mpg car, that is about $20k in fuel savings. I can sell for probably $25k, so $35k for 8 years and more like $38k with maintenance/repairs. That is probably roughly average TCO for new car. Certainly not horrible and better than a higher end sedan most of the time. But not a slam dunk value argument for sure.
Now - if my S lasts me another 8 years with original battery, then that is another $20k in fuel savings. An outlier because I kept it. But still a good value. If, a $15k battery gives it another 8 years - it continues to be a pretty big win.
If we accept that the average car will go 200k miles eventually, the resale on the EVs will be higher than a comparable ICE because of the gas savings which will go the entire 200k miles.
Example $40k for EV (theoretical, yes you can spend a lot less.) $30k for comparable ICE.
Say $2k saved per year based on average miles driven.
Each person sells car after 5 years
EV owner actually saved the exact extra cost (trying to be both easy and realistic).
The EV sells for $20k vs $15k for the ICE. Not just because of the same percentage, but also because the used car buyer saves $2k per year for the 5 years they own it.
Now - who is the more value conscious person - the used or new car buyer? Obviously the used car buyer. The used car buyer is smarter financially also so they really value that $2k saved per year.
In practice, the Leaf had such a poor range and a poor battery design that it screwed early resale so you can absolutely find numbers that say this isn't true. But have a good battery life and a good replacement cost and that all will fade into memory.
I paid $24k net after TC for my 2013 Leaf. Put 60k miles over 6 years and sold for $6k. I had 5c KWH electricity - so we can call it free and $4 gas was pretty standard averaged over that time. So maybe $1500 saved per year since my mileage per year was low. So $9k saved meant a new $15k car. So $9k for 6 years on a car that did have zero maintenance outside of tires.
I think anyone doing math can say that that is fairly cheap and well below average TCO costs. And that was with a terrible battery so the resale got crushed.
We bought a 2019 model 3LR for just under $40k after TC. I can sell it for $25k pretty easily I would think today. Probably saved $6k in gas secondary to reduced mileage during Covid and my higher electricity costs now (10 cents) and higher supercharging cost. So that is $9k for 4 years for a new (fast, fun, techy) car which again is well below average TCO. Just replaced the battery for $120 so not zero maintenance costs.
My 2 examples and, yes, I ignored the time value of money (or interest if you do that sort of thing).
Now I do have an S also. I paid $80k for it. It has 110k miles on it. If you want to compare to a 20 mpg car, that is about $20k in fuel savings. I can sell for probably $25k, so $35k for 8 years and more like $38k with maintenance/repairs. That is probably roughly average TCO for new car. Certainly not horrible and better than a higher end sedan most of the time. But not a slam dunk value argument for sure.
Now - if my S lasts me another 8 years with original battery, then that is another $20k in fuel savings. An outlier because I kept it. But still a good value. If, a $15k battery gives it another 8 years - it continues to be a pretty big win.
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That degradation seems a little high new it was 265 miles, My friend with a 2014 with similar mileage has just under 250 miles range on a 100% charge. My 2014 has 228 miles range on a 90% charge, but it's not got nearly the miles that you are working with. We recently traded a 2015 85D in and it had about 80K miles and a 90% charge was still 232 miles
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