Transport Minister Marc Garneau tweeted today that he was giving his colleagues a ride to parliament in a Toyota Mirai. For those unfamiliar with the Mirai, it's a hydrogen fuel cell car. Obviously someone has been lobbying the liberals and trying to sway them away from EVs. Maybe Tesla should set him up with a P100D for the weekend and see which one he thinks has a better future. A Supercharger in Ottawa wouldn't hurt either.
-
Want to remove ads? Register an account and login to see fewer ads, and become a Supporting Member to remove almost all ads.
-
Tesla's Supercharger Team was recently laid off. We discuss what this means for the company on today's TMC Podcast streaming live at 1PM PDT. You can watch on X or on YouTube where you can participate in the live chat.
toto_48313
CAN P #5
Toyota is making a huge effort to push hydrogen in Canada, but in Quebec they have no support at all as Hydro electric power makes EV much better at all level (efficiency and GHG emission).
Regarding the supercharger at Ottawa, as I know Tesla team is working on it.
Regarding the supercharger at Ottawa, as I know Tesla team is working on it.
I just hope they don't start handing out subsidies to build a network of hydrogen filling stations. They have done nothing for EVs as of yet so it would be a real slap in the face to the EV movement. He knows how much energy it takes to make hydrogen. The external center fuel tank on the Space Shuttle was liquid hydrogen, so of all people, I'd expect him to know it's a dead end technology as far as propelling a car goes. Pretty sure he also knows how explosive it is (Challenger disaster). It's political. I will be writing to my deputy Peter Shiefke (who drives an EV) to hopefully knock a little sense into our Transport Minister.
I emailed Mr. Garneau. I included a link to this article in the email
Toyota vs. Tesla - Can Hydrogen Fuel-Cell Vehicles Compete with Electric Vehicles? - Tony Seba
Toyota vs. Tesla - Can Hydrogen Fuel-Cell Vehicles Compete with Electric Vehicles? - Tony Seba
Lon12
Member
Wonder who said this: "And then they’ll say certain technologies like fuel cell … oh god … fuel cell is so bullsh*t. Except in a rocket.”
It might also have something to do with the fact that Toyota has been building cars in Canada for many years. Tesla... nope.
The environment, natural resources and transport ministers were all there for the dog and pony show. Surely, some media outfits that sell a lot of advertising space to Toyota must have taken the bait, but I will not look.
Ministers Garneau, McKenna and Carr to test drive hydrogen fuel cell vehicle - Canada News Centre
Ministers Garneau, McKenna and Carr to test drive hydrogen fuel cell vehicle - Canada News Centre
Chopr147
Active Member
Sorry to hear a politician disappointed you. They are usually so dependable
don't worry. once they know it costs millions of dollars to build a refilling station and Toyota is counting on the government to shed the money, they will back out
The government is forever begging the automakers for more production in Canada. When the opportunity comes up to talk about EVs, they really have no choice but to talk-up the companies that have invested in their jurisdiction. So they will push Toyota, Honda, Ford, GM, Chrysler.
Rule #1 - Never bite the hand that feeds.
If Tesla / Solarcity had located that solar cell plant in Windsor instead of Buffalo, I think you'd see the politicians being more than happy to put on a Tesla hat.
don't worry. once they know it costs millions of dollars to build a refilling station and Toyota is counting on the government to shed the money, they will back out
Unfortunately, the other CA, California, isn't the slightest bit fazed by having to fund a hydrogen network.
You have understand why Canadians are hoping for better from Transportation Minister Marc Garneau. The last last four US Secretaries of Transportation have degrees in History, Sociology, Law, and Business Administration. However, Minister Garneau has a B.S. in Engineering physics and a Doctorate in Electrical Engineering, as well as experience as an engineer and astronaut. Therefore, you'd hope he'd be better positioned to understand the huge downsides to hydrogen.
green1
Active Member
Downsides for the environment, the budget, and the citizens, but nothing but upsides for his campaign finances.... Or were you expecting him to care about the first 3 items on the list?
Chopr147
Active Member
I had a look up close and personal with the Toyota Mirai. It was interesting. Some of you know these things but I will state them anyway:
1) Not a bad looking car and almost as big as the Model S. Plenty of rear leg room and nicer than most econo-boxes.
2) Under the hood is a full engine that burns fuel cells and no emissions. It has a water tank for the vapor burnoff which is emptied with a valve by the owner.
3) According to the rep. 350 mile range
4) He said Toyota is/will put in hydrogen fill stations all along the East coast ( Have not seen any yet)
5)Counts towards Fed tax credit
6) Turn wheel for the gear shift (hate that)
7) $58,000 before credits
Toyota is "all in " on the hydrogen train and spending hundreds of millions for a concept Elon calls "just dumb". I tend to agree but I assume Toyota believes this will be the future. Sort of like the Sony Blueray/ HD DVD format wars
I think Toyota is destined to be the HD DVD cousin and may bring Canada down with them?
1) Not a bad looking car and almost as big as the Model S. Plenty of rear leg room and nicer than most econo-boxes.
2) Under the hood is a full engine that burns fuel cells and no emissions. It has a water tank for the vapor burnoff which is emptied with a valve by the owner.
3) According to the rep. 350 mile range
4) He said Toyota is/will put in hydrogen fill stations all along the East coast ( Have not seen any yet)
5)Counts towards Fed tax credit
6) Turn wheel for the gear shift (hate that)
7) $58,000 before credits
Toyota is "all in " on the hydrogen train and spending hundreds of millions for a concept Elon calls "just dumb". I tend to agree but I assume Toyota believes this will be the future. Sort of like the Sony Blueray/ HD DVD format wars
I think Toyota is destined to be the HD DVD cousin
and may bring Canada down with them?
green1
Active Member
I love that they still claim 350 miles range despite the fact that no fueling station can actually put enough pressure in the tank to achieve anywhere near that...
They claim they're building fueling stations, but the truth is they're trying to get the government to do it fort then because they're so expensive. I also hope there is never an H2 station or car within many miles of anywhere I am, just wait until the first one explodes, a car will take out several houses. A station will take out a couple city blocks.
They claim they're building fueling stations, but the truth is they're trying to get the government to do it fort then because they're so expensive. I also hope there is never an H2 station or car within many miles of anywhere I am, just wait until the first one explodes, a car will take out several houses. A station will take out a couple city blocks.
mknox
Well-Known Member
Seems to be a common misconception that Challenger exploded. It did not. It broke apart due to aerodynamic pressure when the stack failed. The fuel and oxidizer did burn quite dramatically, but it did not "explode". The SRBs exploded when ground controllers executed the self destruct command before they careened into danger.
RE: "I just hope they don't start handing out subsidies to build a network of hydrogen filling stations."
NRCan was provided funding for an "Electric Vehicle and Alternative Fuel Infrastructure Deployment Initiative":
http://www.nrcan.gc.ca/energy/alternative-fuels/fuel-facts/ecoenergy/18397
NRCan was provided funding for an "Electric Vehicle and Alternative Fuel Infrastructure Deployment Initiative":
http://www.nrcan.gc.ca/energy/alternative-fuels/fuel-facts/ecoenergy/18397
Marc Garneau.. astronaut... love in for H2. Go figure.
Ya, I'll just fill 'er up with H2 in my garage overnight !?
How convenient is that?
Iceland and Shell put up a H2 filling station on the island in 2003.. I saw it in 2009-ish, fueling all the H2 cars there.. I think 14 cars at the time. Great investment for the government and Shell. Free abundant geothermal generation of H2.
I guess Quebec and B.C. can use all their hyrdo electric power to make H2 to burn in cars in Canada. Or, we could just use the electricity directly. Just a tad more efficient.
But it's been a very popular choice with the Icelandic natives... really catching on. I think there's now maybe 3 more cars there that use H2. Still no line ups at the H2 pumps, life is awesome!
Ya, I'll just fill 'er up with H2 in my garage overnight !?
How convenient is that?
Iceland and Shell put up a H2 filling station on the island in 2003.. I saw it in 2009-ish, fueling all the H2 cars there.. I think 14 cars at the time. Great investment for the government and Shell. Free abundant geothermal generation of H2.
I guess Quebec and B.C. can use all their hyrdo electric power to make H2 to burn in cars in Canada. Or, we could just use the electricity directly. Just a tad more efficient.
But it's been a very popular choice with the Icelandic natives... really catching on. I think there's now maybe 3 more cars there that use H2. Still no line ups at the H2 pumps, life is awesome!
Last edited:
Toyota's dog and pony show is currently at the Montreal Auto show. They claim the Mirai will be available in Canada this year.
However, no price for the vehicle or for refueling has been announced. Quebec government Ministers have taken the bait and will be funding a hydrogen station in Montreal and another in Quebec City. (The Federal government has previously committed to wasting up to one million per site.)
And to top it off the provincial government is buying 50 Mirais. EDIT: Someone thinks the government is getting a free, short-term lease on the Mirais.
Canada's 1st fleet of hydrogen fuel cell vehicles coming to Quebec this year | CBC News
However, no price for the vehicle or for refueling has been announced. Quebec government Ministers have taken the bait and will be funding a hydrogen station in Montreal and another in Quebec City. (The Federal government has previously committed to wasting up to one million per site.)
And to top it off the provincial government is buying 50 Mirais. EDIT: Someone thinks the government is getting a free, short-term lease on the Mirais.
Canada's 1st fleet of hydrogen fuel cell vehicles coming to Quebec this year | CBC News
Last edited:
Similar threads
