P85D won't reach full performance with a 400v 85 pack either. "691gate" was an earlier Tesla controversy over that problem. They advertised 691 horsepower but the battery couldn't handle it so they actually output a lot less. I don't think the 350v 85 will be able to reach the promised performance either, and might not even reach the originally delivered performance. Cells in the 100 style pack can sustain a higher C rate than other packs, but the 350v "85" only has a few more cells than the old 85 and has to run at a higher amp rate (more heat) to make up for the lower voltage. It could be done, but it might not be safe or reliable. I assume we will find out sooner or later.
-
Want to remove ads? Register an account and login to see fewer ads, and become a Supporting Member to remove almost all ads.
Wiki Sudden Loss Of Range With 2019.16.x Software
- Thread starter Dutchmeeuw
- Start date
No not at all, that is why I posted this. Just giving some real world figures for people to look over, I had set the Supercharger in destination to heat up the battery but it was only a 15 to 20 min drive there so I don't know how much the battery heater did its job.
No I am not happy with the charge rates, or the 30 mile insta range loss after update and the regen loss on short journeys.
Just give us the option to preheat the battery in the morning before we leave... a dedicated 'preheat the battery' icon that we can press in the app!
I think it has been proven that temperature, higher in this case, does not solve the slow supercharging woes. It helps from the standpoint that a cold battery will charge even slower, but the charge rate is still well below what was originally delivered and promised. I guess it might give you full regen right away but that seems like less of an issue than the reduced capacity and charging rates.
It probably won't matter what you show them at your visit. No Tesla employees are acknowledging the slow supercharging issue. Always have another excuse. I have complained about it multiple times but unless Elon or management decide to do something about it we have to just wait and hope the NHTSA and the class action law suit will force them to fix it.
P85D is spec to run 400V. Putting anything less in it would downgrade the performance and or damage the battery.
It wouldn't have to as long as the 350v battery could put out the additional current to make up for the lower voltage. (Tesla has already put a 350v pack in a car that came with a 400v pack, so just because that is what your car came with doesn't mean that is the only thing compatible with your car.)
That is correct. I’m quoting the new 85kwh replacement pack that is actually a 100kwh with 2 dummy modules. New chem and better therm for greater than 79kwh of the original battery.
I think the PD has to have 400v. I don’t know how you could step up the voltage in a practical way using the same form factor of the pack.
Why would you have to step up the voltage? It isn't like the pack stays at 400v all the time, it goes well below 350 as the SOC goes down.
I've only seen the thread where the 350v 85 was installed in a P85+
P85d isn't specced for 400v specifically, that was just the battery they delivered. It can be lower, but the 350v battery will have to output more amps (and work each cell harder) to reach the same power. It's possible, I just think it might not be smart for them to try. It seems like everything about batterygate is all about lowering battery temps and increasing amps to compensate for lower volts will add a lot of heat.
You can still get the same out of a 350v pack, you just have to pull more Amps. The question is, can the vehicle's circuitry and fuses handle the additional amperage required and higher heat output?
Ferrycraigs
Member
OK from these I take it that it’s not a case that the car 'won’t take it', ie it won’t actually fit or the car would reject it, but just that it will fit but may not be suitable. Which is quite a different thing.
Reassuring for other people hoping to get one of the new 350V battery replacement that it should actually fit.
Personally I would prefer to lose Volts than miles. Better still, not to have to lose either. I’m sure I paid for both.
Amps x volts = Watts
If the cells can take the amps the controller will simply use more amps to get the Watt's needed
If the cells can take the amps the controller will simply use more amps to get the Watt's needed
My Post from higher in this thread
"Hi All!
I have a 2014 S85 32K miles, that took 2hours 37 minutes to charge from 11% to 98 % (set to 100% however). rated miles @ 98%-231miles. checked yesterday at 68% charge and I had lost 19% battery capacity.
Today I saw several warning messages on the instrument cluster with yellow flashing triangles:
Regenerative Braking Disabled
Traction Control Disabled-drive with Caution
Emergency Braking Disabled
Stability Control Disabled-Drive with Caution
Park Assist Disabled
AutoSteer Disabled
ABS Disabled
The first message was the Regenerative Braking Disabled, which made me think of a battery issue. Any advice/comment?"
Service responded by remote testing my battery and said "...no problem..."
YESTERDAY I again "Supercharged" at the same supercharger location, different stall and was the only TESLA vehicle there. I started at
47% SOC - 33kWand finished at 74% - 31kW, with an interim max of 36kW through the 34 minute episode , delivering 19 Kwh. Iheard a high pitch whistling noise throught the session , as I had for the 1st 15 minutes and last 1.5 hours of the preceding session.
This AM,I nted 64% SOC on my phone app. I got into the car early THIS AFTERNOON and saw three messages on the instrument cluster.
Need service car may not start
Car needs service pull over safely
Power reduced vehicle systems shutting down
The displays then went black and won't power up on entering the car.
I have been trying to get TESLA to set a greater than two hour evaluation appointment, with all the ablove, but they wouldn't do taht for weeks. Now they want me to have the car towed to the service center 66 miles away at my expense, which MAY be reimbursed, depending on what they find and say...
Any advice?
Thank you very much
FURY
"Hi All!
I have a 2014 S85 32K miles, that took 2hours 37 minutes to charge from 11% to 98 % (set to 100% however). rated miles @ 98%-231miles. checked yesterday at 68% charge and I had lost 19% battery capacity.
Today I saw several warning messages on the instrument cluster with yellow flashing triangles:
Regenerative Braking Disabled
Traction Control Disabled-drive with Caution
Emergency Braking Disabled
Stability Control Disabled-Drive with Caution
Park Assist Disabled
AutoSteer Disabled
ABS Disabled
The first message was the Regenerative Braking Disabled, which made me think of a battery issue. Any advice/comment?"
Service responded by remote testing my battery and said "...no problem..."
YESTERDAY I again "Supercharged" at the same supercharger location, different stall and was the only TESLA vehicle there. I started at
47% SOC - 33kWand finished at 74% - 31kW, with an interim max of 36kW through the 34 minute episode , delivering 19 Kwh. Iheard a high pitch whistling noise throught the session , as I had for the 1st 15 minutes and last 1.5 hours of the preceding session.
This AM,I nted 64% SOC on my phone app. I got into the car early THIS AFTERNOON and saw three messages on the instrument cluster.
Need service car may not start
Car needs service pull over safely
Power reduced vehicle systems shutting down
The displays then went black and won't power up on entering the car.
I have been trying to get TESLA to set a greater than two hour evaluation appointment, with all the ablove, but they wouldn't do taht for weeks. Now they want me to have the car towed to the service center 66 miles away at my expense, which MAY be reimbursed, depending on what they find and say...
Any advice?
Thank you very much
FURY
I have to disagree with the fact that each cell will have to work harder on a 350V vs 400V... power is Volts times Amps.
A 350V battery pack will have 400/350 more cells in parallel so each cell will draw the SAME current for a given power output! This is assuming the same cell format in each pack (i.e the same number of cells)
The advantage of 400V system is wiring between modules and to the motors can be of smaller size and more efficient.
JRP3
Hyperactive Member
In fact since the new pack is larger, 89kWh vs 81kWh, the pack will be putting out a lower relative C rate at the same power levels. So I agree that the limitation with the lower voltage pack would be current carrying capacity of other components.
Ferrycraigs
Member
My immediate reaction is I think the very slow charging is a completely different issue to all the Warnings.
I had one of those 'all warnings known to man' situation. The car wouldn’t drive, but it also wouldn’t shut down, so I couldn’t drive it, but I couldn’t lock it (it froze during the shutdown sequence). The next morning the signs were still there. Manoeuvring the car to somewhere that a flatbed could get at it, must have nudged the car, which suddenly started working again. Tesla had the car for a couple of weeks. In the end they decided it was most likely a slightly bent pin in a multi pin connector. They replaced the entire harness. The problem hasn’t come back, but I have never been convinced that 2+2=4 in this instance.
Your slow charging sounds like classic chargegate. I really would be surprised if the two problems are in any way related
The fact that your screens have gone completely black sounds very much like the eMMC problem (explained here: UPDATE: Tesla Cars Have A Memory Problem That May Cost You A Lot To Repair).
I am not surprised that Tesla have suggested you pay for the flatbed. I assume your car is well out of normal Warranty. The warnings sound more computer based than battery based.
If it were me, I would wait a couple of days to see if the warnings cleared themselves again. At that point I would drive it it them. If they don’t clear, or the screens don’t burst back into life, you may have to bite the bullet.
Sorry I can’t be more positive.
Similar threads
