Not sure about that. Many on this board consider it a betrayal to mention any faults of Tesla vehicles.
Look at the abuse Mr. Cordaro gets. Folks are calling him a liar when he state he does not live on a dirt road.
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Not sure about that. Many on this board consider it a betrayal to mention any faults of Tesla vehicles.
Look at the abuse Mr. Cordaro gets. Folks are calling him a liar when he state he does not live on a dirt road.
JohnSnowNW
Active Member
Well, that would be because he has lied several times...though. Not sure you can fault people for finding anything he says suspect...
Thanks for that information. However, are we to accept that a leasing company with a fleet of 140 vehicles can be operated out of one's home with one employee? More to the point, has the OP been leasing out the Model S in question?
No... I took it as truth right away. Tesla was wrong in stating that he lives on a dirt road. The car was merely picked up on a dirt road.
Instead, he's a liar for what he wrote about the NHTSA communications. He has withheld pertinent information about the service records of the vehicle and its operating conditions. And then he promotes the clear lies from Mr. Wivaneff. Those things make him a liar.
If on the very first post, Mr. Cordaro wrote that he was driving on a dirt road while mushroom hunting and his suspension broke, this entire thread would be different. If he mentioned what he actually asked the Tesla Ranger to do, and what service work was actually performed, again this thread would be different. Instead, he's withheld very pertinent information. A lie of omission is still a lie.
Since Mr. Cordaro opened this thread by stating that he was driving 5 mph and then later stated he was driving 2 mph, he is most definitely a liar, since both cannot be true. Also, the fact that he operates a "passenger car leasing company" is an indication that he also has not disclosed all relevant information. And we are still waiting to see documentation that his car was recently serviced by Tesla.
MassModel3
Member
I think that's pretty far from the truth. Most on this forum are definitely enthusiasts, and some of us really (really!) want to believe that Tesla can do no wrong, but we're also realists and we know that Tesla isn't perfect. What gets our goat is when people start slamming Tesla without any proof, or when people use made up evidence as proof that Tesla is hiding something.
Yeah, call me a fanboy (whatever..), but I'll admit when Tesla is wrong, and I'll defend them when gearheads and anti-EV'ers try to run Tesla out of business because they're afraid of an electric future.
And no, I'm not calling gpcordaro anti-EV. He was insightful enough to buy a Tesla, after all.
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
Wait what? No, the NHTSA did not say anything of the sort. Here's what they actually said:
"NHTSA learned of Tesla’s troublesome nondisclosure agreement last month. The agency immediately informed Tesla that any language implying that consumers should not contact the agency regarding safety concerns is unacceptable, and NHTSA expects Tesla to eliminate any such language. Tesla representatives told NHTSA that it was not their intention to dissuade consumers from contacting the agency. NHTSA always encourages vehicle owners concerned about potential safety defects to contact the agency by filing a vehicle safety complaint at SaferCar.gov."
So the issue has already been resolved on NHTSA side after Tesla's clarification that the NDA didn't prohibit owners from contacting the NHTSA (if you look at the example I linked, what Tesla says is true). This is further proven by the fact that the OP contacted the NHTSA about this regardless of the NDA.
The NHTSA did not make any comment about the practice of offering free/reduced cost repairs nor about NDAs in general, only about potential problems with the language in the NDA.
“Just how are you supposed to lubricate a ball joint that doesn't have a grease fitting?????” [sorka]
Well you don’t, you just wait for it to begin to get loose, then replace it. Or you drill and install a zerk fitting into it. Replacement ball joints typically do have zerks already on them.
To self-test your steering ball joints:
Put your fingers firmly over each ball joint as your helper turns the steering wheel back and forth. If you can feel any play then spray yellow (or pink) paint on it and move to the next.
To self-test the upper and lower A-arm ball joints you must actually move the suspension up and down thru its entire range. This is secondarily important to discover out of roundness between ball and socket, but primarily to relieve the spring tension between ball and socket. At some point as you move the suspension the tension will become zero (or close to it). Only at that point can you feel for a worn ball joint. Use a pry bar if you have to. Again: ALL WEIGHT must be removed from the ball joint, which is not the same as just jacking up the corner of the car and removing the wheel.
So checking the suspension is a complicated job that requires experience and time to do it right. Recommended when new tires are fitted, especially in the Rust Belt of N.America.
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Well you don’t, you just wait for it to begin to get loose, then replace it. Or you drill and install a zerk fitting into it. Replacement ball joints typically do have zerks already on them.
To self-test your steering ball joints:
Put your fingers firmly over each ball joint as your helper turns the steering wheel back and forth. If you can feel any play then spray yellow (or pink) paint on it and move to the next.
To self-test the upper and lower A-arm ball joints you must actually move the suspension up and down thru its entire range. This is secondarily important to discover out of roundness between ball and socket, but primarily to relieve the spring tension between ball and socket. At some point as you move the suspension the tension will become zero (or close to it). Only at that point can you feel for a worn ball joint. Use a pry bar if you have to. Again: ALL WEIGHT must be removed from the ball joint, which is not the same as just jacking up the corner of the car and removing the wheel.
So checking the suspension is a complicated job that requires experience and time to do it right. Recommended when new tires are fitted, especially in the Rust Belt of N.America.
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I am glad Tesla responded, but I do find it problematic that they incorrectly stated the OP lives on a dirt road. They know where he lives, so I have no idea why they would have done that. If the car was driven on dirt roads a lot, they should have just stated that.
It really doesn't help when they have a wrong fact in their response that any journalist can refute in a few minutes of googling.
Overall, I hope this is a one-off case. I am just not fully convinced since Teslas response with the wrong data about where the OP lived and personal attacks against the blogger seemed a bit... odd. If they were another manufacturer, I would immediately assume a response like that was a cover-up. I will give Tesla the benefit of the doubt in that they are inexperienced in addressing these sorts of accusations in a more professional manner.
I do hope someone follows up with them about the OPs address.
It really doesn't help when they have a wrong fact in their response that any journalist can refute in a few minutes of googling.
Overall, I hope this is a one-off case. I am just not fully convinced since Teslas response with the wrong data about where the OP lived and personal attacks against the blogger seemed a bit... odd. If they were another manufacturer, I would immediately assume a response like that was a cover-up. I will give Tesla the benefit of the doubt in that they are inexperienced in addressing these sorts of accusations in a more professional manner.
I do hope someone follows up with them about the OPs address.
Me: This thread really blew up today. Let me check it out...
Why do people here believe anyone including the OP has to prove anything to them?
He does not owe us anything. Please stop badgering the guy. Let see what happens when all this is wrap up.
Last note, Tesla does a lot of great things but they still do a lot of stupid things too.
He does not owe us anything. Please stop badgering the guy. Let see what happens when all this is wrap up.
Last note, Tesla does a lot of great things but they still do a lot of stupid things too.
Ah, he's trying to publicly shame Tesla. We're the public. He's the one making the claims. If he doesn't provide sufficient evidence, then his claims fall short. He's lied about pertinent information. Now, even if his claims are correct, his lies taint all of it. And to be extra clear, Tesla doesn't owe him anything wrt to his out of warranty suspension.
You haven't been here long enough to say that. The history of this forum is FILLED with complaints of all sorts, especially pervasive ones. Just look for the 691 HP debacle. Sure people push back, and some are blindly pro-Tesla, but that is not the norm. In this particular case, the media surrounding it and the hyperbole is getting people's backs up.
Tam
Well-Known Member
Hopefully, some day Tesla will make an off-road vehicle down the line.
In the mean time, if you decide to get Model S, it's your property so you can do whatever way you see fit after reading its warranty exclusions.
The issue then is: Would Tesla go beyond those legal formality and cover you regardless?
Tesla has bent backward in many cases despite of its more restrictive legal language:
It used to offer free Ranger Service when it clearly posted that would cost a fee.
For years, It was known to tow your car for free to a charging station when the language says it does not cover tow fee for "over-discharged" reason.
And so on...
The warranty exclusions also cite: "racing," "autocross" but yet, that's what owners show what they exactly do on youtube.
It is fine that you would do all those exclusions but just be conscientious that you might need more maintenance than normal and although I have never been heard of Tesla penalizing gravel road, drag racing... owners, keep in mind that just like in this case, Tesla has the right to demand payment for repairs for those damages caused by warranty exclusions.
That's your opinion and I respect it. However that all it is because there is only speculation on what his intent was. We don't know what is intent is, only he does. I took it as a warning, Something I should look for and pay attention too.
Am I going to worry it could happen to me, nope. Could it, yup.
Technically, that's still not over, see the rampant fanboi-ism going on over the the 10.9 quarter thread.
All that aside I don't even have to read the whole thread. The pictures of the failed ball joint from the first few posts indicates that unless the driver was deaf, they intentionally ignored a ****load of racket and poor handling coming from that corner of the car. That wasn't a sudden failure, it had failed A LONG time ago and was driven around like that until catastrophic failure.
steven wood
Member
Dear Gpcordaro, any chance your name is Niedermeyer?
Any experienced driver with any experience with motor vehicles would notice a worn upper ball joint like that, Way,.. Way,... before you reached 70,000mi .
Yes, Something is really, really, wrong here. : )
Any experienced driver with any experience with motor vehicles would notice a worn upper ball joint like that, Way,.. Way,... before you reached 70,000mi .
Yes, Something is really, really, wrong here. : )
I actually thought the response was pretty good, even the factual error does not change the fact of where the car was. As far as the blogger goes, I did not see any personal attack. They pointed out he has a long history of negative articles (fact) and questioned what his motivations might be, which is reasonable, since none of the lazy-ass journalists who picked up the story and ran with it yesterday bothered to do any research on their own.
Tesla just lost $2 billion in market value during these two days.
It's pretty sad for other Tesla owners because this could pretty well mean the end of the Good Will agreements.
It's pretty sad for other Tesla owners because this could pretty well mean the end of the Good Will agreements.
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