Tesla replacing ultrasonic sensors with Tesla Vision

[E90alex]

I really dislike this comparison they keep using because 1. cameras will never see as well as humans in our lifetimes, and 2. the software will never be as good as humans on the current gen hardware.

Even if cameras and software can match human vision abilities, isn’t the point of technology to enhance/surpass what humans are able to do?

I don’t understand why they are trying to chase parity with human vision when the limitations of human vision are pretty big in the context of operating a vehicle. I can’t tell down to the inch how far away my bumper is from a wall like a parking sensor can. I can’t tell the car 100ft in front of me is going 1.2548 mph slower than me like radar can.

There’s no stereo vision on the car except straight ahead, and even then it’s minimal stereopsis since the cameras are so close together and each camera has a different FOV so it’s not easily comparable. Yes there are other visual cues to judge depth/distance but it won’t be as good as with stereo vision. Try going a day with one eye covered and see how that feels.

Humans also rely on other senses to supplement stereo vision when navigating our environment. Namely hearing, which cars cannot do (at least not yet). Sure it’s possible with just one eye and/or without hearing, but those would be disadvantages and we consider those disabilities.

 

[Ash83]

Oh good grief! And to the surprise of anyone? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

I am gonna be a d**k and say I hope they merge the bug by mistake. these FSD cars gets more media attention and if they started to Buzzzzzzzzzzzz while driving then maybe Lord Musk will push the fix soon.

 

[MP3Mike]

I am not buying a car without rear corner radars for cross traffic alert, and 360 view,

Then you never would have even been considering a Tesla... As they have never had those features, and are not likely to add them in the future.

 

[KubASS]

Soon Elon is going to tell use our cars don't even need cameras to self drive...

 

[2101Guy]

someone refresh my memory..why is it that Tesla still cant do birds eye view while so many other mfrs can and are doing it?

 

[JulienW]

someone refresh my memory..why is it that Tesla still cant do birds eye view while so many other mfrs can and are doing it?

Because it doesn't have the cameras to view all areas close to the car like directly in the front bumper and near the front door and fenders.

 

[Durzel]

someone refresh my memory..why is it that Tesla still cant do birds eye view while so many other mfrs can and are doing it?

Cameras aren't positioned properly to be able to do it. Cars with 360 birds eye views have cameras that capture the ground around the car.

 

[Dewg]

I'm getting a very Steve Jobs, Apple vibe from this. Apple repeatedly used market dominance to change things even when users didn't want/ask for it. Such as removing the headphone jack and forcing everyone to go wireless or use an adapter. Apple knows better...

 

[2101Guy]

Got it. Thanks. I was under the impression from Elon that birds eye view was on its way to our cars really soon since FSD Beta persons already have it per Elon

By Tinsae Aregay Sep 22 2021 - 3:29pm

Elon Musk Confirms ‘Vector-Space Birds Eye View’ Coming To All Tesla Vehicles Next Month​

Tesla has currently released the company's latest vector-space birds-eye view visualization to FSD Beta testers. However, Elon Musk now says the mind of the car visualization will be released to all Tesla vehicles, including ones in Europe, next month.

 

[Knightshade]

Vector space birds eye view has been there for a while now.

It's not the same as the 360 parking cam view folks are discussing.

 

[thewishmaster]

Actually, I'm questioning myself now. I parallel park all the time. The front ultrasonics in the newer car should be useful for that, when there's a car in front. Am I really not paying attention to their readings, or has it become so unconscious/automatic that I do use them but I have no conscious recollection of it?

Probably the latter. In my garage I park nose-in and the readings help me avoid an annoyingly tall curb in front of the car.

 

[Knightshade]

Probably the latter. In my garage I park nose-in and the readings help me avoid an annoyingly tall curb in front of the car.

Note self-park for perp. always parks rear in....which is objectively safer, and has the benefit of 3 rear-facing cams covering all around the car to help with vision based parking.... but yeah front bumper to rear of car in front during parallel will be harder without the ultrasonics.

 

[geordi]

I don't understand the idea of REDUCING the number of external sensors on a car that is marketed as having self driving capability... I'd want it to have MORE sensory options not less!

People don't drive with just their eyeballs - because that frequently isn't sufficient to bring full awareness of the environment outside the vehicle.

 

[DarkForest]

I'm getting a very Steve Jobs, Apple vibe from this. Apple repeatedly used market dominance to change things even when users didn't want/ask for it. Such as removing the headphone jack and forcing everyone to go wireless or use an adapter. Apple knows better...

Nah, it’s nothing like that. With Apple, the alternatives they forced you into were already available. They didn’t remove functionality with the promise of it coming back Some Day (tm).

 

[JulienW]

Got it. Thanks. I was under the impression from Elon that birds eye view was on its way to our cars really soon since FSD Beta persons already have it per Elon

By Tinsae Aregay Sep 22 2021 - 3:29pm

Elon Musk Confirms ‘Vector-Space Birds Eye View’ Coming To All Tesla Vehicles Next Month​

Tesla has currently released the company's latest vector-space birds-eye view visualization to FSD Beta testers. However, Elon Musk now says the mind of the car visualization will be released to all Tesla vehicles, including ones in Europe, next month.

This is probably one of the rare times the lawyers talked Musk out of it. Since offering a 360º could give a false sense of security. For instance if Parked and a small child on a tricycle pulled next to the front bumper. You get in cut on the 360º and see a clear view in front of the bumper.

 

[E90alex]

I'm getting a very Steve Jobs, Apple vibe from this. Apple repeatedly used market dominance to change things even when users didn't want/ask for it. Such as removing the headphone jack and forcing everyone to go wireless or use an adapter. Apple knows better...

Except Apple does it when the alternative technology is mature enough to replace what they removed.

Imagine if they removed the headphone jack before Bluetooth headphones were a thing? Removed the CD drive before flash drives, downloadable software and portable digital music players?

 

[mongo]

...but just like us humans there will be NO WAY to sense what is near the front bumper. This means if you pull up close to a concrete bollard/bumper and park. Then you forget and so does your car and you drive forward.......

What if something is placed in the path of the car outside of camera view after it’s parked?

Ultrasonics have limited detection area also. If you park close enough to the concrete curb, USS won't help. Same with an object placed in the region between the front and rear wheels or the wheels and some distance from the bumper.
For parking, easiest approach is to exit in the opposite direction you entered.
Another technique is to limit torque output until the car has moved through the un-sensed zone. Can also shift backwards using rear camera to view frontal area.

 

[DJT1]

Can’t speak for everyone here but I only park backwards at the supercharger.

There are some superchargers that are drive into stalls rather than reverse. You wouldn't be able to back into these because your charge port would be way past the supercharger kiosk and on the wrong side. There is (at least) one in the San Diego area that is this way.

 

[Azathoth]

Especially with low-res "eyeballs" that lack stereoscopic vision and anything near to full coverage around the vehicle. Removing near distance sensors is an astoundingly dumb idea on Tesla's part.

I don't understand the idea of REDUCING the number of external sensors on a car that is marketed as having self driving capability... I'd want it to have MORE sensory options not less!

People don't drive with just their eyeballs - because that frequently isn't sufficient to bring full awareness of the environment outside the vehicle.

 

[cliff harris]

Once they are convinced that they're going SW to eliminate a piece of hardware, they hate paying for and installing a single unit more that they know will be rendered useless in the near future.

I have a model Y arriving in 2 months time. I expect it to now not have the parking sensors, or the autopark functionality on the day I get it. I know Tesla 'hate paying for it'...so where is the reduction in my car's asking price? Oh right...there isn't one. Tesla removing functionality from a pre-ordered car, without altering the price.

This is customer relations failure. No point in any of us pretending this is 4D chess, its apple-level arrogance.
If the car I ordered does not have the functionality I was promised at order time, you bet I'll put in daily complaints to support until they fix it.

This is a total own goal.