Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[Artful Dodger]

TSLA all over the place with brisk volume in the Aftr-hrs session, as hedgies and shortzes continue their game of 'duck'n'cover'.

TSLA After-Hours Quotes​

Data last updated Dec 01, 2021 08:00 PM ET.
This page will resume updating on Dec 02, 2021 04:00 PM ET.

Consolidated Last Sale	$1098 +3 (+0.27%)
After-Hours Volume	651,649
After-Hours High	$1106 (06:13:39 PM)
After-Hours Low	$1083.77 (05:04:02 PM)

 

[Electroman]

Yep, there are a lot of things in that article that just seem plain wrong. For example:

• I haven't seen a single EV pack where a cell, or module, can be disabled like the article claims Porsche is doing.
  • They just aren't wired that way. (I haven't seen the Porsche pack so I don't know for sure that they didn't go to this great expense and complication but I highly doubt that they did that.)
• It says almost all BEVs charge in parallel, but yet every one I know of charges cells in series.
  • Again, they just aren't wired in a way to make that possible.

So at this point I am leaning to it being FUD. (Or there was a lot lost in translation between the real information and what made it into the article.)

Agreed. There is so many things in that article that doesn't make sense. Another statement that is confusing is,

"The 800V architecture of the Taycan, a vehicle the German automaker is proud of, has many advantages, but the strong current requires a very well-controlled charging process to avoid charging some cells faster than others."

800V architecture requires less current flowing than the ones used by Tesla, not "strong current".

In general some of the phrasing and choice of words used there could use some proof reading.

I would chalk this at 5% truth and the rest an exaggeration and FUD at this time and move on. Many owners have come out and said in the Porsche forum, that they haven't seen any problems and suspect this is a hit piece.

 

[WADan]

Sorry if this has been posted here, but it makes me happy happy joy joy

Tesla's stock is still cheap, says manager of new ETF who made Musk's EV company its No. 1 holding

Gary Black of the Future Fund Active ETF expects Tesla to maintain its market share, which could mean a surge in profits and share price.

www.marketwatch.com

 

[Dancing Lemur]

1. I’m annoyed that I spend the entire day monitoring all things Tesla and was not able to throw my money at them for an overpriced trinket as they’re bought out by all the Whistle Speculators.

2. Tesla YT dropped a Camp Mode not-an-advertisement today:

 

[pz1975]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/12/01/democrats-subsidy-union-made-electric-vehicles-faces-bumpy-road-senate/

“Twelve foreign automakers with non-unionized U.S. workforces — including Toyota, Volkswagen Group of America and BMW of North America — also sent a letter to congressional leadership yesterday opposing the bonus EV tax credit.


A General Motors spokesman said the company supports the provision. Ford didn't respond to a request for comment, while Tesla dissolved its PR department last year and couldn't be reached for comment.”

"...while Tesla dissolved its PR department last year and couldn't be reached for comment.”

I wish it has said "...while a representative from Tesla said he was too busy dropping some friends off at the pool."

 

[SO16]

Agreed. There is so many things in that article that doesn't make sense. Another statement that is confusing is,


800V architecture requires less current flowing than the ones used by Tesla, not "strong current".

In general some of the phrasing and choice of words used there could use some proof reading.

I would chalk this at 5% truth and the rest an exaggeration and FUD at this time and move on. Many owners have come out and said in the Porsche forum, that they haven't seen any problems and suspect this is a hit piece.

I have a difficult time believing Alex Voight would mess this up.

How much FUD is on Teslarati? Normally it seems like they write positive articles.

As far as Porsche owners not having an issue, the article seems to account for that.

I hope Alex is wrong though. This would set back EVs quite a bit in many people’s minds.

 

[Chunky Jr.]

GM leading in Taiwan...

https://twitter.com/x/status/1466222890907422720

 

[mltv]

GM leading in Taiwan...

https://twitter.com/x/status/1466222890907422720

Yes. I know.

 

[juanmedina]

Where there recently a couple of Taycan updates to lower the charging rate including a new slow charging mode to preserve the battery?

 

[Electroman]

Another one of those Twitter polls that goes pear-shaped.

View attachment 739593

Okay here is the link: Vote for this poll first and then if you scroll up you can vote for the poll from Edmunds.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1466127226965925889

 

[insaneoctane]

The innovator’s dilemma is real, and creative destruction is ruthlessly unforgiving.

The capital requirements for the technology transition will rise just as profits from obsolete ICE turn negative. Much of these companies will probably eventually BK and ask their host governments for bailouts.

It would be fitting to montage many of legacy autos own quotes denying Tesla's significance from the past as they dug their holes deeper.

 

[Curt Renz]

 

[capster]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/12/01/democrats-subsidy-union-made-electric-vehicles-faces-bumpy-road-senate/

“Twelve foreign automakers with non-unionized U.S. workforces — including Toyota, Volkswagen Group of America and BMW of North America — also sent a letter to congressional leadership yesterday opposing the bonus EV tax credit.


A General Motors spokesman said the company supports the provision. Ford didn't respond to a request for comment, while Tesla dissolved its PR department last year and couldn't be reached for comment.”

I‘m not keen on the union provision. However, if it applied only to pure BEV’s (no ICE in any way, shape, or form on the vehicle) and not to PHEV’S or hybrids, then I might be more supportive.

The logic is clearer, too. It conceivably softens the blow of the lower labor requirement of the BEV. Whereas PHEV’s probably require more, not less, labor. So the UAW has nothing to complain of with the PHEV.

Also, not including PHEV’s and hybrids sends the correct(ive) signal to the legacy OEM’S, which is why this likely won’t happen.

 

[BornToFly]

I‘m not keen on the union provision. However, if it applied only to pure BEV’s (no ICE in any way, shape, or form on the vehicle) and not to PHEV’S or hybrids, then I might be more supportive.

Why would you be supportive of giving more money to companies that treat workers so badly that they feel the need to join a union and give part of their salary to a corrupt organization, instead of using that money to feed their families?

 

[SmokyPeat]

I have a difficult time believing Alex Voight would mess this up.

How much FUD is on Teslarati? Normally it seems like they write positive articles.

As far as Porsche owners not having an issue, the article seems to account for that.

I hope Alex is wrong though. This would set back EVs quite a bit in many people’s minds.

I'm inclined to believe the whistleblower. This is the same VWAG that thought putting monkeys in gas chambers to support their fraudulent diesels would be a good idea. They might have transplanted a new head onto the fish, but the rot was already systemic by that point.

 

[ZsoZso]

Okay here is the link: Vote for this poll first and then if you scroll up you can vote for the poll from Edmunds.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1466127226965925889

I'm confused. A poll should have alternative options, not the same option with alternative wording but same meaning...
This is like playing Mass Effect 3 and wondering what choice to make at the end.

 

[capster]

Why would you be supportive of giving more money to companies that treat workers so badly that they feel the need to join a union and give part of their salary to a corrupt organization, instead of using that money to feed their families?

Because I would like to see one or more of the US legacy auto companies survive the energy transformation lest we, in the US, diminish our overall national capability to, for example, weather and win another large war. It also behooves our society to mitigate the disruptive impact of the transformation on its citizens.

I’m not ecstatic about the idea of union carve-outs or even industrial policy generally speaking. However, if the need is great enough, at least the policy should push companies in the right direction.

Boeing has 162,000 workers 35% of whom are unionized. I don‘t necessarily blame those workers for Boeing’s recent space program setbacks. However, if the US space industrial policy becomes equally as strategically misdirected as the proposed EV subsidies—subsidies that seem like they will be a PHEV Pickup bailout—then I’d likely be opposed to what will be coming down the pike.

Boeing Job Moves Take Aim At Unions

Boeing confirmed that it will move the remainder of its 787 Dreamliner production from Washington State to South Carolina where unions are relatively weak.

www.forbes.com

 

[Artful Dodger]

"...while Tesla dissolved its PR department last year and couldn't be reached for comment.”

I wish it has said "...while a representative from Tesla said he was too busy dropping some friends off at the pool."

TSLA had unusually high volume in the After-hrs session of Tue, Nov 30 reaching just over 7% of the total daily volume. This is about 1.1M shares MORE volume than has been average for TSLA in recent After-hrs sessions.

IMO, there's two leading candidates to explain this high volume:

1. End-of-Month "window dressing" by Benchmarked funds, or
2. Elon selling 900K into the After market via dark pools

Note that item 2. above does not exclude item 1. No further SEC Forms 4 filed by Tesla as of 22:00 ET today.

Today's SP action appears to have been all shortzes and hedgies: that was a big move down on comparatively light volume.

Cheers!

 

[StarFoxisDown!]

TSLA had unusually high volume in the After-hrs session of Tue, Nov 30 reaching just over 7% of the total daily volume. This is about 1.1M shares MORE volume than has been average for TSLA in recent After-hrs sessions.

IMO, there's two leading candidates to explain this high volume:

1. End-of-Month "window dressing" by Benchmarked funds, or
2. Elon selling 900K into the After market via dark pools

Note that item 2. above does not exclude item 1. No further SEC Forms 4 filed by Tesla as of 22:00 ET today.

Today's SP action appears to have been all shortzes and hedgies: that was a big move down on comparatively light volume.

Cheers!

So dark pool trades are not traceable in real time but do those trades have to be reported on a form like regular sell orders within 2 trading days?

 

[Tommy O]

Regarding the Porsche report, the level of detail given leads me to believe the report is either true or the source is a practiced liar with ulterior motives.

A number of comments on the article question its validity because there's seemingly an easy fix in replacing the charging circuitry for a small dollar amount. Why risk your reputation if the fix is so easy and cheap?

An explanation that's consistent with the claims in the article is very simple: if this issue was discovered too late, that would imply that not only would the charge circuitry need be replaced at some small cost, but that there would also already likely be a number of vehicles that sustained damage to the cells from faulty power electronics. Maybe a large percentage of vehicles. Reputational and recall costs, as the report explains, would be large.

If true, it may very slightly slow down the transition to BEVs, but also further solidify Tesla's lead.

I'll wait for more information before forming a strong opinion.