I'm suddenly feeling really lucky to have just replaced the 12V battery in my late-2017 for the first time after ~5.5 years.
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Well the HV battery died per Tesla remote diagnosis, what are my options?
- Thread starter bhawkins4194
- Start date
I'm suddenly feeling really lucky to have just replaced the 12V battery in my late-2017 for the first time after ~5.5 years.
While many claim this is just a conspiracy theory part of me really wonders. I think Tesla has thresholds in place to where they will brick batteries through software updates. How many people have to be weeks to 2 months out of warranty for us to believe this could be happening? What could be a threshold? Miles for certain. Total kWh charged?
While I don't think Tesla is doing what you are suggesting, if they were it certainly isn't based on miles. (There are people with low mileage having failures as well as people making it to very high mileage without failures.)
In general, it seems like age is a major factor, and water ingress from sub-optimal designs on the older packs. (Which happens over time as corrosion worsens.)
my theory is that there is ongoing voltage testing by the BMS. At a certain threshold, the battery is deemed inoperable due to a failure to meet that threshold. As the battery ages, the threshold is lowered by software... to the point that very minor issues trigger the fatal error after, say, 100 months. Batteries that have significant issues (typically ones with high mileage) still trigger the fatal error under warranty
@gaswalla @MP3Mike @tesluv108 I wonder what the profit margins are per pack.
In addition to Tesla's current base $13.5k for reman and base $17k for new, Tesla would charge you $10k if you want to keep the pack [MSX HV BATTERY CORE CHARGE(1234555-01-A)].
@Recell @wk057 @racevpr FYI on Tesla's core charge.
In addition to Tesla's current base $13.5k for reman and base $17k for new, Tesla would charge you $10k if you want to keep the pack [MSX HV BATTERY CORE CHARGE(1234555-01-A)].
@Recell @wk057 @racevpr FYI on Tesla's core charge.
Yes, there is testing, and when the balance falls out of spec the battery failure is triggered.
There is no evidence of that. And the third-parties, Recell and WK057, have said that the balance spec hasn't changed. It is just a matter of as packs are used/aged, and cells fail, they go further and further out of balance until they hit the threshold.
$10k seems reasonable for a core charge. Good modules sell for ~$1,200 each, and figure there are normally at least 12 good modules in a failed pack, that is at least $14,400 worth of good modules on the open market. Obviously, they are worth less to Tesla, as they are likely just going to send them to be recycled to recover the core materials.
What that really means is that the packs actually cost $23.5k for reman or $27k for new.
How many counterexamples of this NOT happening will it take to prove this is nonsense? @gaswalla 's claim was that "Last year all the 2014's had battery failure". Mine didn't.
For your personal case, you're right.
However, please put yourself in those folks shoes that have had to shell out five figures for pack replacement. For them, this issue is not nonsense.
I sincerely hope you can dodge this bullet for as long as possible.
As I always tell folks - we wouldn't be having this conversation if Tesla charged $5k for a new replacement pack
And it only takes one single case to disprove the assertion that it has happened to "all" 2014 cars. Maybe people shouldn't make such absolute statements that are so easily disproven.
This theory that Tesla is maliciously pushing a nuke button to disable people's cars is certainly nonsense. But I am not dismissing people's issues, which is a different issue. It is very well known now that there were some bad design decisions that make those early cars VERY susceptible to early failure. That's real. That is truth.
And yes, it is affecting a large proportion of those early cars. Certainly that would be frustrating, and I do readily acknowledge that my car is one that is fairly lucky to not fail to this design problem yet, and I think it's likely that it might in the next few years, but might not if it continues to be lucky.
That's what we need to distinguish here. High failure rate is what's going on--not Tesla intentionally disabling cars.
I bet we would still be having this conversation even if the repair was only $5k. (Look at how much people are complaining about a ~$400 fuse replacement, or the ~$5-6k drive unit replacements.)As I always tell folks - we wouldn't be having this conversation if Tesla charged $5k for a new replacement pack
I don't know about that. I'm going to grumble about a $400 fuse. $5k is not fun but in the context of the value of the car it's doable.
$20k is catastrophic.
$20k is catastrophic.
I think you're right. While we would all prefer a $5K reasonable HV battery repair over the $14K or $20K option, I think folks would still be complaining but it would be a much smaller percentage of people. I am surprised at the number of folks who think the fuse replacement thing is a "cash grab" by Tesla and that it's either planned to go out after the warranty expires or is suspiciously not covered under warranty.
The simplest explanation for me is that Tesla did not do any long-term testing before designing and releasing production models to the public. They are discovering some flaws as they are going along and staying mum on their findings. Many owners doesn't want to be on the hook for these flaws and Tesla Service's goodwill seems to be drying up. With the lack of transparency from Tesla (they aren't obligated to share their findings), it leaves a chasm of suspicion by concerned owners.
You won't hear me complain about the price of the pyro fuse replacement, but I think $6K for a DU that seems to be just as problematic as the original is one that I would take issue with. I expected Tesla to have fixed their design flaws, but perhaps the solutions are not as simple as we all expected.
Read fuse cover section here
Howards Model S - THE Battery
This is an achilles heel for EVs. There are several fundamental class of problems. These seems to occur for all EVs. Not just Tesla. Tesla is just the highest volume so far and have more statistics. Lithium Batteries have been marketed as great modern technology. There are 2 major class of problems
sites.google.com
My 13 MS RWD can easily see 1/2 of the cover with frunk removed. Not sure about dual motor and later cars. Also later cars got cover moved facing ground to solve this problem (on X for sure, not sure about S)
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