Having a newish house with a panel fully maxed out does not seem normal. It just seems sketchy. Not worth the danger to my family and neighbours if it was me, without a professional opinion.
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You probably don't need fast charge speed at home
- Thread starter ivan801
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It does seem a little odd. Because a new install shouldn't really use any twin breakers.
Keep in mind the numbers of SLOTS maxed out vs LOAD maxed out are completely separate.
Panels can also very a lot by how many slots they have for the same Main Breaker size.
He might have a smaller panel (less slots) than he should for a 200A service.
That's why a couple of folks asked for a couple photos. But it's really his call.
Keep in mind new houses/code is fairly conservative on how much and what types go on each circuit. Like he probably has 8 circuits for the kitchen alone. So even though his "slots" are maxed out, if it's "New" he should be no where near the 200A calculated load. Unless he did a ton of remodeling/additions since the panel was put in.
He is basically removing TWO 20A 120V Circuits and replacing it with ONE 20A 240V. That's really tiny. Granted it is a "continuous" load. We are not talking 60A or something.
Technically he needs a Permit. Don't know if his town requires an Electrician to change a light switch. Mine does NOT require one for any electrical work including the main service. Don't know if his town needs special permit for L2 Charging either. That's his call.
For large project I take out a permit. For this small a change I wouldn't. I'm not recommending what the OP does either way. It's his call, his house, his family.
I've hired "Professionals" and more than half do sh$t work. I hired a gas plumber to move a stove. I could turn the pipes by hand. I had to redo the whole thing over AFTER it PASSED inspection. I do as much as I can do myself. That puts my family at risk. You are the sole person responsible for your family. Don't get me wrong there are many good electricians and plumbers out there. But they can be really hard to find these days. I do as much as I can on my cars too. I had an Professional HVAC/Plumber guy not use the proper primer (purple) on the PVC vents. He painted the purple primer on AFTER the job was done to pass inspection. So when I hear someone say "you need to get a professional" I always laugh.
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I can clarify this: I finished my basement and used up a lot of capacity in the panel. We added a kitchen and washer/dryer in the basement and I also added a 14-50 plug for my Nissan Leaf. So I did have a lot of room to begin with, but used it all up. Honestly, I can't blame builder too much because 15 years ago no one expected to have to charge two EVs in the garage.
Also, to clarify my desire not to mess with my 14-50 plug, my 2018 LEAF has a range of about 120 miles (down to about 100 this time of the year) and therefore is charged to 100% every night and is plugged in after almost every drive. My wife and daughter like driving it and put a lot of miles on it every day, and I don't want for them to worry if the LEAF has enough charge to do this or that, and I don't want them to worry if they can/should unplug Model 3. We do have a 3rd car, but it's a minivan
And yes, I will hire an electrician to do this work, although it seems easy enough that I could probably do it myself.
I just had a wall charger installed in a location that requires me to back the car into the garage. It's no big deal. I do it all the time. Between the tilting rearview mirrors, the huge rear camera display and all the sensors that call out proximity in inches, it's really not a big deal. Summon? Who cares
I can clarify this: I finished my basement and used up a lot of capacity in the panel. We added a kitchen and washer/dryer in the basement and I also added a 14-50 plug for my Nissan Leaf. So I did have a lot of room to begin with, but used it all up. Honestly, I can't blame builder too much because 15 years ago no one expected to have to charge two EVs in the garage.
Also, to clarify my desire not to mess with my 14-50 plug, my 2018 LEAF has a range of about 120 miles (down to about 100 this time of the year) and therefore is charged to 100% every night and is plugged in after almost every drive. My wife and daughter like driving it and put a lot of miles on it every day, and I don't want for them to worry if the LEAF has enough charge to do this or that, and I don't want them to worry if they can/should unplug Model 3. We do have a 3rd car, but it's a minivan
And yes, I will hire an electrician to do this work, although it seems easy enough that I could probably do it myself.
Why not get two tesla wall chargers and a Tesla to J1772 adaptor for the leaf or one of the Tesla wall chargers modified with a J1772 cable. They can load balance on the same circuit and charge both cars.
That's exactly what we'll be doing later this month. We ran a 60 amp circuit to our carport for a 40 amp JuiceBox. We'll be replacing the JuiceBox with two wall connectors (one modified with a J-1772) that will share the 60 amp circuit.
This is where I think car roof panels would help bridge the gap. Assuming 1KW of panels, which is what some car manufacturers are thinking of debuting, It would make charging on a regular outlet feasible, and perhaps more importantly would eliminate vampire battery drain and make a battery heater more feasible in really cold climates. I certainly would't mind parking my car in long term parking, go for a 1 week trip by plane, and come back to a fully charged car.
2 points
If I was as frugal as OP I would simply move the existing 240v outlet closer to the desired location. This is a DIY with a little help of YouTube and your hardware store in installing and mounting pre cut conduit.
2) I'd be concerned running solely on 120 as the charging electronics are in use for an extended period of time. Plus poor efficiency as about a 1/3 of the charging is lost to the charging electronics at that small of a load.
If I was as frugal as OP I would simply move the existing 240v outlet closer to the desired location. This is a DIY with a little help of YouTube and your hardware store in installing and mounting pre cut conduit.
2) I'd be concerned running solely on 120 as the charging electronics are in use for an extended period of time. Plus poor efficiency as about a 1/3 of the charging is lost to the charging electronics at that small of a load.
I had my electrician come by and look over my options. For about $2-3k I can tap into my power distribution panel and run up the side of the house, through my attic space, down the other side, and then into the garage.
He also did like the idea of converting my existing dedicated 5-20 into 6-20. He though that I should just double up some more lines (two lines on one breaker) to free up space in the panel for 240 V breaker. His reasoning was that the worst that will happen is that I will trip a breaker. So my plan is to give a 6-20 a try. I just don't want to poke all these holes in my house. And saving a few bucks will not hurt either.
My thinking is that I've been using 5-20, and has been mostly sufficient, so 6-20 should do the trick.
He also did like the idea of converting my existing dedicated 5-20 into 6-20. He though that I should just double up some more lines (two lines on one breaker) to free up space in the panel for 240 V breaker. His reasoning was that the worst that will happen is that I will trip a breaker. So my plan is to give a 6-20 a try. I just don't want to poke all these holes in my house. And saving a few bucks will not hurt either.
My thinking is that I've been using 5-20, and has been mostly sufficient, so 6-20 should do the trick.
timk225
Active Member
I charged my 3 off a 6-20 for months, it was never an issue even when I came home in the evening with the battery low on charge. My new driveway has a 14-50 outlet and it is more than enough. I'll usually stop the charge around 200-220 miles, and restart it in the morning to warm up the battery before I go drive anywhere.
eprosenx
Active Member
There is nothing wrong with that as long as either the breaker lugs can handle two wires or you just pigtail them together before going into breaker.
You would want to carefully chose what things you put together to ensure there was not too much load.
Of course the house would still have to be code compliant as far as number of general purpose lighting and receptacle circuits go.
There is no practical difference between one circuit with six receptacles daisy chained and two circuits with three receptacles each that later got connected together in the breaker panel into the same breaker.
In the right situation this is fine. A lot of houses have way more circuits than required by code (some other houses have too few).
Got everything hooked up, charging at 240V 16 amp. Estimated 14 mph. Will have to figure out how to burn off all that extra range.
eaker
Haha, yeah I have the same problem. I was living on 4-5mph charge(5-15 outlet) with once a week plugging into my stove for an hour to get me through my 65mile per day usage. I then put in a 240V/30A(10-30) that gets me 22mph. I now just use the schedule in the car to start it at a time when it will still be charging when I leave in the morning.
Haha, yeah I have the same problem. I was living on 4-5mph charge(5-15 outlet) with once a week plugging into my stove for an hour to get me through my 65mile per day usage. I then put in a 240V/30A(10-30) that gets me 22mph. I now just use the schedule in the car to start it at a time when it will still be charging when I leave in the morning.
jkoya
NA2 NSX
We have a 30A EVSE originally installed in 2012 for our Leaf and is now used by our Volt. Having the Tesla HPWC installed for the Model 3. Mainly installing the HPWC for convenience sake so we don't have to shuffle cars around.
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