Welcome to Tesla Motors Club
Discuss Tesla's Model S, Model 3, Model X, Model Y, Cybertruck, Roadster and More.
Register

36.X and Steering Wheel Weight?

This site may earn commission on affiliate links.
#81
coco135 said:
It doesn't "recalibrate" at every start of a trip, it doesn't look for force changing, there's no aliens looking from above.
You do need to cover the cabin camera as well.
Click to expand...
I'm curious, then, what you believe is the reason for these reports of being suddenly kicked out of AP until next drive without warning.

As for the camera, depending on the model the steering wheel is not in view:

teslanorth.com

Watch: Tesla In-Cabin Camera Videos Shown in Color - TeslaNorth.com

Tesla's in-cabin camera was recently discovered to have a "full color" RGB picture, based on footage discovered by hacker @greentheonly on Twitter. The news comes in the midst of larger debates over both the security concerns over the company's footage, as well as driver monitoring systems...
teslanorth.com teslanorth.com
 
#82
Graham J said:
I'm curious, then, what you believe is the reason for these reports of being suddenly kicked out of AP until next drive without warning.

As for the camera, depending on the model the steering wheel is not in view:

teslanorth.com

Watch: Tesla In-Cabin Camera Videos Shown in Color - TeslaNorth.com

Tesla's in-cabin camera was recently discovered to have a "full color" RGB picture, based on footage discovered by hacker @greentheonly on Twitter. The news comes in the midst of larger debates over both the security concerns over the company's footage, as well as driver monitoring systems...
teslanorth.com teslanorth.com
Click to expand...
i am not an engineer so i cannot give you the answers, all i can is to talk about my experience.
if the camera is not covered, i get Constant nags but that maybe just because i for very brief moments do not look straight on the road.

i have 5k miles on the car (most on the Fwy) with no AP issues.
You can see in the picture how much i use AP (Only reason why i still own this junk of model X) that is just since 10/13/22, it starts tracking it when you request FSD beta and get safety score overview
IMG_80C11D1E67AD-1.jpeg
 
#83
coco135 said:
you guys are making this more complicated than it is.
All you need is 260 grams of weight on either side and you’re good to go.
I took a metal piece that weigh 250g added epoxy mold to shape the rear of the yoke, used double sided tape and all is good.

It doesn't "recalibrate" at every start of a trip, it doesn't look for force changing, there's no aliens looking from above.
You do need to cover the cabin camera as well. View attachment 873630View attachment 873633
Click to expand...

I just use regular ankle/wrist weight. Works fine and it cost $12. I can put it on, or take it off the wheel as needed.
 
#84
coco135 said:
you guys are making this more complicated than it is.
All you need is 260 grams of weight on either side and you’re good to go.
I took a metal piece that weigh 250g added epoxy mold to shape the rear of the yoke, used double sided tape and all is good.

It doesn't "recalibrate" at every start of a trip, it doesn't look for force changing, there's no aliens looking from above.
You do need to cover the cabin camera as well. View attachment 873630View attachment 873633
Click to expand...
Man i wish i could 3d print that beauty :rolleyes:
 
  • Funny
Reactions: alexcue
#85
KLam said:
Trying to defeat hands on the wheel check with wheel weights is doomed unless its very sophisticated .

Tesla relied on the torque sensor on the steering column to detect if the hands are on the wheel. For a good detection implementation, the software will first calibrate the system initial torque magnitude at start of drive. Then it will sense the increase in torque with the hands on. This sensing could be done by turning the steering wheels clock wise or counter clock wise. The sensing frequency and magnitude could be variable. Human will not be able to give a "constant" torque increase all the time, but a wheel weight would. The presence of a "constant" torque increase is a tell tale sign of the presence of a wheel weight. Hence immediate strike out!
Click to expand...

I think it's a bit more complicated than that. Here's what I would do as an ex-physicist. There still will be torque fluctuations on the wheel because of bumps transmitting through the front suspension and steering. There will be a torque fluctuation expected given the moment of inertia and normal dynamics of an unhandled wheel. If that torque fluctuation is highly correlated in a time series sense with accelerometers in the body (we know they are there) then that looks like a non-human-touched wheel (whether a steering weight is present or not). If there are intermittent periods of torque fluctuation decorrelated with accelrometer fluctuation that looks like external input.

I'd make statistics of the rate of short (2 second?) periods where correlation was below a certain threshold determined by empirical observations, and if there are enough of them then a hand is on the wheel.

The hack is to have a device with an internal movable slug (sex toy style) which randomly oscillates. Might need external power, or maybe a spring system with unexpected momentum storage and release might decorrelate enough.

The underlying problem is that Tesla (probably elon himself) cheapened out. Everyone else uses an electronic touch sensor on the wheel to detect hands because as the universal experience is that needing to artificially torque the wheel induces danger and distraction, which is why people put on the weights.

With the correct hardware, there wouldn't be a problem, and few would try to hack around a quality system.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: KLam
#86
I have gotten confirmation from Tesla Support Center that .36 did indeed introduce software to detect weights, but I've had AP Disabled for the rest of the trip even with just my hand resting on the wheel... Seemed to correlate to long stretches of straight highway with no turns... I rest my left arm on the top of the door at the base of the window and allow my hand to rest on the upper section of the wheel above the left dial (2019 MX, no camera). I keep it pretty steady on the wheel, just resting it on that area, but I guess it was too consistent.
 
#89
HouTexan said:
Why is it even still a requirement to have a hand on the wheel? As I understand it GM Super Cruise doesn't require it. Maybe because older cars don't have cabin cameras?
Click to expand...
It's a safety measure to cover Tesla's butt for government regulators.

Hard to tell a court that you didn't know you had to pay attention when your hands have to be on the wheel at all times. Other car companies have installed special cameras (IE: infrared) on the steering column aimed at the driver's face. Tesla has cabin cameras on all new vehicles, but older ones didn't have them. And many of the new ones don't have IR lighting so they have difficulty with low or no ambient light. If all cars had cabin cameras with IR lighting, then the hands-on requirement could be lifted, as Tesla could report to regulators that there are safety systems monitoring the driver.
 
  • Like
Reactions: wadood and DarkForest
#90
rpo said:
I have a new model X with .36 and can confirm it is kicking me off autopilot with my &*#$##$ hand on the wheel. It is so bad I cannot even make the alert go away by tugging on the wheel because it never senses the movement until it completely disengages. Makes me regret paying for autopilot....
Click to expand...
Here's what you do:

1) Drive with AP
2) When the system asks you to move the wheel, do so
3) When the system escalates the warning, continue making small movements to the wheel
4) Immediately after the red wheel warning and AP disengagement, press the voice button and say "bug report"
5) Notes the date/time you did that - then open a service ticket and let them know the problem and the date/time of your bug report

The service tech will download and analyze your bug report (which includes camera footage and all telemetry from the vehicle for a window of time. They can then confirm what's happening with the car. For example, you say you're turning the wheel, and the telemetry shows you are not turning it. This could indicate to the tech that there is a problem with the torque sensor on the wheel.
 
  • Like
Reactions: rpo
#91
rpo said:
I have a new model X with .36 and can confirm it is kicking me off autopilot with my &*#$##$ hand on the wheel. It is so bad I cannot even make the alert go away by tugging on the wheel because it never senses the movement until it completely disengages. Makes me regret paying for autopilot....
Click to expand...
Just downloaded 40.4.1 - i'll report back once installed
 
#93
HouTexan said:
Why is it even still a requirement to have a hand on the wheel? As I understand it GM Super Cruise doesn't require it. Maybe because older cars don't have cabin cameras?
Click to expand...
Because teslas interior cabin camera wasn’t engineered for the purpose of monitoring the driver for auto pilot related usage. Per Elon he stated that the interior camera was to monitor passengers during robotaxi service (that was promised for the end of 2019)
 
#94
Last edited:
#95
rpo said:
I have a new model X with .36 and can confirm it is kicking me off autopilot with my &*#$##$ hand on the wheel. It is so bad I cannot even make the alert go away by tugging on the wheel because it never senses the movement until it completely disengages. Makes me regret paying for autopilot....
Click to expand...
both of our X and Y are on 36.2 and does not kick us out of AP. with the weight i can drive with 0 interruptions as long as the cabin camera is covered.
as soon as i remove the camera cover, it will start nugging after a minute or so.

my weight is stuck on the yoke and i never remove it since it's nicely hidden behind.
 
#97
burtinboy said:
Just downloaded 40.4.1 - i'll report back once installed
Click to expand...
On another thread I reported my experience. In a nutshell nag performance 40.4.1 is great! Very light force needed to de-nag, and works with weights too. It now works as I expected it to work when I bought the car, and I don't mind the lack of touch sensors, small light friction with fingers at the bottom of wheel is enough.

I also had many problems with .36.X. I think it was just plain buggy with sudden unexpected lockouts.
 
  • Like
Reactions: JohnB007 and rpo
#98
DrChaos said:
On another thread I reported my experience. In a nutshell nag performance 40.4.1 is great! Very light force needed to de-nag, and works with weights too. It now works as I expected it to work when I bought the car, and I don't mind the lack of touch sensors, small light friction with fingers at the bottom of wheel is enough.

I also had many problems with .36.X. I think it was just plain buggy with sudden unexpected lockouts.
Click to expand...

Wonderful!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

M
40.X and steering Wheel weight?
Replies
148
Views
21K
AI, Autopilot, & Autonomous/FSD
JohnB007
J
rainman50
Will stock 19 inch wheels from 2014 Model S P85 fit the 2024 Model X Plaid?
Replies
1
Views
105
Model X: Driving Dynamics
MODEL+
MODEL+
J-a-x
Random ping sound on FSD with steering wheel haptic vibration
Replies
8
Views
469
AI, Autopilot, & Autonomous/FSD
Mardak
Mardak
I
Close call with Autosteer
Replies
10
Views
919
AI, Autopilot, & Autonomous/FSD
dansev
D
G
How much weight can the steering wheel support?
Replies
2
Views
346
Model Y: Interior & Exterior
Stavinski
S
Top
Back
Blog
New
Forum list
Marketplace
Menu