Almost ready with FSD Beta V9

[powertoold]

FSD Beta is not released, only employees and 99% TSLA's inventors who are media influencers has it. Basically the PR firm of Tesla.

No.

 

[Knightshade]

Wow at your refusal to read. No where does it say the driver NEVER has to provide input.

Except you specifically cited that it says that

This IS NOT L4. This doesn't say the functionality doesn't require the human driver in the driver seat paying attention. It just says no input.

(bold added)

Man.... even you don't agree with you!

It says "designed to be able to conduct short and long distance trips with no action required by the person in the driver's seat."

Yes.

That's L4.

L3 requires action- like specifically taking over when the car asks you to.

That said, having to pay attention is also an action

One that is not required in an L4 system as Tesla is describing.

I'm again wondering if English is not your first language?

The term "no action" points towards driver input. But an ADS is not level 3, or level 4 by only whether driver input is required but by the driver not being required to monitor the environment or the system's performance.

This again is factually wrong.

L3 requires input from a driver when the car asks for it

L4 explicitly never will require input from a driver

I guess I should've used brighter crayons when circling this fact in the SAE chart.

Plus- again "monitor the environment" is an action

Also to go even further, even using your flawed logic and false interpretation that this is L4 description. The logic you are probably using to say its not L5 is also wrong.

Having/Not having a steering wheel doesn't make a car L4 or L5.

I literally never said a single thing about steering wheels.

So you're again making up strawmen based on nothing.

Having/Not having a person in the driver seat doesn't make a car L4 or L5.

A car can not operate at less than L3 without a driver in the seat.

This too is in the chart- since L3 and below may [B}require the person in the driver seat to do something[/B]

While L4 and L5 can never require this.


So having someone in the seat does not exclude it from being L4/L5.

But NOT having one does exclude it from being any lower than L4.


Again you totally fail to understand the nuance or facts.

I have watched that exact video more than 20 times. I have also watch hundreds of other SDC videos and presentations culminating to thousands of watches and read hundreds of paper.

It's a shame you still don't understand them with that many views.



Lastly- I see your previous claim you were "done" with the discussion was yet another in your never-ending string of... saying things that are not based in fact

 

[Cheburashka]

Also here's stats released by Tesla. AP is 10x safer. omg have you seen the videos?. Here's this video of it stopping at a stop sign and making a left turn. omg its blowing my mind OMG! Tesla says 1 million left turns have been made. OMG.

Yeah, this whole thing is basically a Kickstarter campaign. Maybe they'll finish it, maybe they won't. So far they have nothing but hype and a green light chime to show for it. I think if Tesla was more upfront about this and the timelines then the criticism wouldn't be deserved.

 

[Mengy]

A technology demonstration that is pretty useless gets old really fast. Quantum leap as a demonstrator? Maybe, as a non-lidar car first in business?

Sadly the beta is useless IRL; you can not sleep, work, text, make out, watch a movie; nothing. The beta drivers have to be nursing the car every split second while FSD tries to drive them. It is not comfortable or taking a burden of the driver. So FSD beta 8.2 is a useless feature, and that is not a quantum leap.

I disagree. I have a friend out in Nevada who has been driving with the FSD beta enabled every chance he gets, and he says it's been outstandingly useful and great to drive with. Sure he monitors it, but he rarely has to take over lately and its made driving much less stressful for him, even with it not being perfect.

As a safety aid even the current beta version is incredible, despite not being 100% autonomous yet.

 

[Silicon Desert]

I drove 170 miles today all on NOA and I had 2 safety disengagements and NOA bumped down to AP several times because of rain. I would not call it superhuman yet.

Were those disengagements that you made manually, or that the AP disengaged? My recent drive down from Sparks to Fremont was similar. About 250 miles and I made 3 manual disengagements for situations I was not comfortable. Actually one of those was to take an exit to eat and rest. It wasn't raining, so no issue with that. Overall I was really impressed, but I wouldn't call it superhuman either. Maybe with a newer firmware or when I get Alzheimer disease, I'll change my opinion.

 

[Silicon Desert]

Sadly the beta is useless IRL; you can not sleep, work, text, make out, watch a movie; nothing. The beta drivers have to be nursing the car every split second while FSD tries to drive them. It is not comfortable or taking a burden of the driver.

Hmmm, we must be in a different universe While I understand there are some drivers who feel the current software lacks what they want and need, there are a few of us that find it very helpful; especially for me on long interstate drives (not city streets). I never feel that I am nursing the car at all and much more relaxed with driving. In fact, for me it is taking some burden and is comfortable. So to say it is useless might apply to a subset of people and not everyone.

 

[qdeathstar]

Ever since trying Smart Summon again around Thanksgiving, Smart Summon does blow my mind! I feel silly for not using it earlier and more often.

(just do not use "Come to me" but drop a pin where you want the car to come)

you must love watching paint dry?

 

[Bladerskb]

Except you specifically cited that it says that

It’s like arguing with a child. Where do you see NEVER here? It says “the system is designed to be able to conduct short and long distance trips with no action required by the person in the driver's seat."

It doesn’t say “the system will conduct all trips including short and long distance with no action ever being required by the person in the driver’s seat”

If it said that then you actually have a a little bit of something. But it doesn’t. Neither does it say the system is autonomous, or is responsible, etc.

Yes.

That's L4.

you can have a L2 system that fits that description. How is it that you can’t understand this?

A car can not operate at less than L3 without a driver in the seat.

This too is in the chart- since L3 and below may [B}require the person in the driver seat to do something[/B]

While L4 and L5 can never require this.


So having someone in the seat does not exclude it from being L4/L5.

But NOT having one does exclude it from being any lower than L4.


Again you totally fail to understand the nuance or facts.

No I said having or not having a driver doesn’t determine that description is describing a L4 or L5 system. You have been adamant that Tesla/Elon didn’t promise a L5 system in official documentation but rather L4. Yet you have yet to provide a single shred of evidence.

On the other hand I have proved that the most used description actually does not constitute even being a L4 system

It's a shame you still don't understand them with that many views.

I do this for a living. I’m a software engineer that work on production grade applications including simulation software. You on the other hand in comparison might as well work for McDonald’s with the occupation of flipping burger.

You literally have no clue what you are talking about. And you keep proving it.

 

[Soda Popinski]

There is no "quantum leap" to something that doesn't exist yet if you're arguing all he meant was city streets was coming. He's saying that the re-wrote *everything* as a "fundamental architectural rewrite". You can't rewrite something that doesn't exist.

I disagree. It seems clear there was a re-write to the perception system, as it's now doing 360 video, which was not the case before. This isn't being used in the current AP, as far as I know.

 

[Silicon Desert]

you must love watching paint dry?

That got me to smile. Maybe he does like to watch paint dry, OR maybe mspisars had a situation like me whereas 4 months ago my foot was in a cast for awhile. It sure was convenient at the dentist office were the parking was a bit away from the front door and there was no drivers around that I felt I would be getting in there way. And then the trip to Walmart where it was easy to have it come to the side of the building away from everyone. It was bad enough walking from the car to the store. I sure didn't want to do it going back out. I was surprised at how well summon worked on those few times (5 or 6) that I used it. I didn't realize how nice it is to be able to walk, until of course I couldn't do it easily. Now, fully recovered, I just walk to the car because I could sure use the exercise. Nice to know I might be able to use that feature again in the future if I need it.

Aside from that, it sure was nice to have one of those little electric carts in the store. Frankly, I was not as comfortable driving it for the first time as I was the Tesla

 

[Knightshade]

It’s like arguing with a child

You mean where you keep contradicting your own posts? True.

. Where do you see NEVER here? It says “the system is designed to be able to conduct short and long distance trips with no action required by the person in the driver's seat."

No action.

not "sometimes no action"

And again, monitoring the system and the road is an action

The fact it is designed to not require that is by definition level 4

I notice you just flat ignored the multiple times this was pointed out so far.

Again is English not your first language?

you can have a L2 system that fits that description. How is it that you can’t understand this?

Because it's factually wrong.

I even circled why in big red circles, which again flew way over your head.

A L2 system requires action by the person in the drivers seat

So does an L3 system.

By design.

If they didn't require those they'd be L4 or 5.

By definition.

No I said having or not having a driver doesn’t determine that description is describing a L4 or L5 system.

So just glossing over your steering wheel strawman then?

And again, only an L4 or L5 system can operate without a driver in the seat.

HAVING one doesn't disqualify it of course- but again nobody ever claimed it did so again you're either factually wrong- or arguing something nobody ever claimed.

Maybe both.

You have been adamant that Tesla/Elon didn’t promise a L5 system in official documentation but rather L4

This, too, is a lie.

I said they promised at least an L4 system.

And specifically called out there's reasonable debate over if they describe L4 or L5, but that there is no reasonable debate they described anything less than 4.

. Yet you have yet to provide a single shred of evidence.

Why do you keep asking people to prove things they never said?

Is it a lack of any fact-based arguments on your own part?

On the other hand I have proved that the most used description actually does not constitute even being a L4 system

No, you haven't.

Your facts continue to be...not.

And directly contradict SAEs own words, as shown in the chart.

I do this for a living.

Make bad faith arguments far removed from actual facts?

What's that pay anyway?

I’m a software engineer that work on production grade applications including simulation software.

Lemme know when your simulation of a rational argument is out of alpha... seems like it'll be a while

You literally have no clue what you are talking about. And you keep proving it.

I mean, you keep saying that- while continually proving you don't' care about actual sourced facts and instead of rant NU UH over and over.

Even several posts after, again falsely, claiming you were "done" even having the discussion.

 

[aronth5]

Let's hope v9 is the real thing, the real leap.

Agree, just waiting for the V9 FSD Beta video games to begin
Of course waiting for any agreement by this raucous group will be like trying to nail jello to a tree!

 

[Bladerskb]

You...

None of that is correct either.

Nothing in Teslas official documentation around FSD says L5. Nothing during the purchase process promised those folks L5.

It did promise them L4..

Me..

You have been adamant that Tesla/Elon didn’t promise a L5 system in official documentation but rather L4.

Yo..wait what?

This, too, is a lie.

I said they promised at least an L4 system.

And specifically called out there's reasonable debate over if they describe L4 or L5, but that there is no reasonable debate they described anything less than 4.

Why do you keep asking people to prove things they never said?

Is it a lack of any fact-based arguments on your own part?

Lmao, I love how you keep pathetically failing to twist my words.
First it was the radar now this. Hilarious, i wonder what got you so upset? Its not my fault you were naïve enough to be swindled into buying a car that will never be autonomous.

 

[rxlawdude]

Nope, they do it for lots of people when they upgrade from MCU1 to MCU2 (which is a paid upgrade). They're already in there so they swap it out knowing they're going to need to do this for most HW2 computers in the near future as they start offering FSD subscriptions. You do realize they are going to have to do this, right? "All cars have the hardware for FSD." They are not going to be able to offer FSD subscriptions only to HW3 cars without getting sued immediately. Uncharacteristic of Tesla to actually treat a customer reasonably we seem to agree, but in this case it's the cheaper option for them.

Look around, I'm far from the only one. But it's not advertised as part of the MCU change and not everyone that has done the change got it. I had no idea it was going to happen when I scheduled service for my MCU upgrade, and at no point did they tell me. Just got in the car afterwards and couldn't use AP because it had to re-calibrate which was my hint. Here's the infotainment upgrade page:

Infotainment Upgrade | Tesla Support

Upgrade your Infotainment system to access new features, and for a more advanced and smoother user experience.

www.tesla.com

From your quoted source: "Enhanced Driving Visualization for owners with the Full Self-Driving Capability Computer" That certainly doesn't mean that HW3 is routinely installed during infotainment. Perhaps if there is a problem with HW2 computer, OR the vehicle owner has PAID FOR FSD. Not your case.

 

[rxlawdude]

Sadly the beta is useless IRL; you can not sleep, work, text, make out, watch a movie; nothing.

Your useless is useful to others.

 

[rxlawdude]

Maybe with a newer firmware or when I get Alzheimer disease, I'll change my opinion.

You won't remember what your opinion was.

 

[diplomat33]

Were those disengagements that you made manually, or that the AP disengaged? My recent drive down from Sparks to Fremont was similar. About 250 miles and I made 3 manual disengagements for situations I was not comfortable. Actually one of those was to take an exit to eat and rest. It wasn't raining, so no issue with that. Overall I was really impressed, but I wouldn't call it superhuman either. Maybe with a newer firmware or when I get Alzheimer disease, I'll change my opinion.

All the disengagements were manual. I turned off AP completely in order to avoid what I saw as a potential accident situation. Both cases involved trucks encroaching into my lane and not seeing me.

 

[qdeathstar]

You...

Me..

Yo..wait what?


Lmao, I love how you keep pathetically failing to twist my words.
First it was the radar now this. Hilarious, i wonder what got you so upset? Its not my fault you were naïve enough to be swindled into buying a car that will never be autonomous.

You are both saying the same thing in those posts. What is he twisting?

 

[Silicon Desert]

You won't remember what your opinion was.

yes, but the wife will remind me what my opinion was. She always does. Especially if she thinks I was wrong

 

[Knightshade]

Lmao, I love how you keep pathetically failing to twist my words.

Are you drunk or something?

Nothing twisted except your ability to read and understand words that I can see.