If it were larger and had more range it might have competed with the Model S, but it doesn't so it doesn't. It also might have cannabilized sales of BMWs ICE cars, and we can't have that now, can we?
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BMW i3
- Thread starter gregincal
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- Electric Vehicles
Interesting video. I'm very disappointed that the i5 is going to be fuel cell. Must have a large battery.
Paul8810
Longtime Member
My wife joined the electric family and took delivery of a BMW i3 last weekend. While I would have much preferred an X to join my S the garage, she's used to driving a Mini Cooper and the X is just overkill for her needs.
The styling at first turned me the other way (in fact I hated it), but after seeing it in person and driving it has grown on me. We both agreed it had to be in black to better blend with the hood and tailgate (which are black no matter what color you order) , and we have plans to wrap the silly electric blue under the doors. The tech is actually quite impressive (not quite tesla tech, but much better than the 5 series I owned before my model S).
This will do us just fine until a model 3 arrives.
The styling at first turned me the other way (in fact I hated it), but after seeing it in person and driving it has grown on me. We both agreed it had to be in black to better blend with the hood and tailgate (which are black no matter what color you order) , and we have plans to wrap the silly electric blue under the doors. The tech is actually quite impressive (not quite tesla tech, but much better than the 5 series I owned before my model S).
This will do us just fine until a model 3 arrives.
I don't like the looks either, but that's subjective.
I would call the i3 VERY far from "well engineered". In North America, it was found that the KLE's (2nd on-board charger) were blowing and thus causing charging speed to be cut in half. Apparently it was some design flaw, so the band-aid was to reduce charging speed a bit until a redesigned part was available (took many months for that). Everyone w/the REx was getting check engine lights all over the place, and they still are. Some are spurious, others are real problems (e.g. misfires, moisture in the REx engine, camshaft-related problems IIRC, etc.) Early i3's also seemed to have body hardware issues w/false open door/hatch detections.
A couple folks have broken their motor mounts or motor mount bolts. It's not REx specific. One guy w/i3 BEV had his motor mount bolts break twice, causing major damage each time, requiring replacement of many parts and a boatload of labor. They put on a J1772 handle lock on the car but w/NO options, so the handle stays attached and locked to the car like a parasite even when charging's done. It's ok for the European charging case where you bring your own Type 2 Mennekes cable and you can unhook on the station side but it sucks for the plug sharing case in the US. (Who knows why they didn't look at how Nissan did it and provided 3 options: auto (unlock when done charging), don't lock or lock (stay attached like a parasite) when they added it on the '13 Leaf?)
The REx version seems very unreliable in general, w/all sorts of reports of check engine lights, drivetrain malfunctions (sometimes keep cropping up again, after visits to the dealer) and some restraint system errors (sometimes requiring wiring harness replacement). Some of the drivetrain malfunctions require a tow.
There are also numerous complaints of people going out to their cars finding the windows are wide open. The cause it believed to be buttons on the fob being pressed (feature to open the windows remotely) when in one's pants pockets. I believe there's nothing in the UI to disable that.
There have been a few reports of something failing (I think it was either their EME or KLE) that ends up damaging the battery pack, causing the dealer to need to replace the entire pack or all the cells.
The REx engine is too wimpy to make it up steep hills at highway speeds (not safe if you can go say under 40 mph on a 55+ mph speed limit grade). And, it's a long story about why the US version doesn't let you engage the REx engine earlier to avoid this (ala Volt's mountain mode).
A November update (BMW i3 Software Update 15-11-502 Fixes Flaws, Adds Features) apparently has some mitigations for the broken bolt, spurious CELs and finally unlocks the handle when done, but doesn't provide options to the user.
It used to be on the i3 Facebook group, at least one new problem was reported per day, on average. It's died down a bit, but it's still about 1/day.
It also seemed dumb of them to include J1772 CCS/SAE Combo as the DC FC option for the US market when the infrastructure was almost non-existent at the time it shipped and still is far behind CHAdeMO in the US. For the Japanese market i3, they include CHAdeMO, which was likely a pragmatic decision. In the end, they ended up having to support 3 DC FC plugs, depending on the market: Combo1 (aka SAE Combo, for North America), Combo2 (for Europe) and CHAdeMO (for Japan).
It is a fairly fast vehicle in its price range though and the REx idea is a decent one. And, I applaud BMW for taking such a bold approach w/the use of CFRP but the overall execution is lacking. If the i3 qualifies at "well-engineered" then the Leaf is somewhere WAY above "well-engineered" except for battery degradation. (Despite the Leaf having been on the market for years longer and having MANY more vehicles on the road (and higher sales too), we don't see anywhere near this frequency or magnitude of problems on mynissanleaf.com or a few Leaf FB groups I'm on.)
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Tedkidd
Member
I had suicide doors in my old pickup truck. Liked them a lot!
But the truck's seat belts were in the seat, not the door, so you could open the doors without unbuckling to let people in and out, and there was an operable window in the back to help rear passengers avoid claustrophobia (a complaint I got when I took some folks on an I3 test drive...).
They could have gone with smaller, operable rear windows - which IMO would have dramatically improved appearance also - and the seat mounted seat belts and taken this car to a much more versatile and interesting level.
Trev Page
Member
I just test drove an i3 today before plunking down my Model 3 deposit. What a great little car. Handles like a BMW, plenty of pep for this size and the fit and finish is typical BMW. Just too bad the range is not great and the financing rates are crap in Ontario (leasing over 36 months 5.9% and a 34% residual. Come on....) Dealer is offering $2K and BMW is offering $2K off on 2015 models. They aren't moving.
I know a lot of people don't like the design but I do.
Anyhow, for that kind of $$ everyone is better off waiting for Model 3. It will have better ranger, more performance, more storage and Supercharger access.
I know a lot of people don't like the design but I do.
Anyhow, for that kind of $$ everyone is better off waiting for Model 3. It will have better ranger, more performance, more storage and Supercharger access.
I took a test drive a year ago and thought the same thing, nice little EV. It took me a long time to like the design though....hated it for at least a year. And I agree, too bad it doesn't have more range.....Model 3 it is!
thefortunes
Active Member
We took one for a weekend and quickly realized that ~120 miles of actual REx range wasn't enough. We had to stop for gas 2x on the way home from a family gathering (silly little gas tank)
SmartElectric
Active Member
Hmm, that puts the new price at approx $45K - 2 -2 -13 (ontario ev rebate) + tax = ~ $34K Canadian for the EV only (no REX).
Used i3's on autotrader are $35 - 50K ... wow, out of touch!
I too like the i3, but I would right, I like upright cars with lots of window.
My wife, not so much, she loves her Tesla S and wouldn't be seen in the i3.
SageBrush
REJECT Fascism
I agree, the i3 deserves consideration.
It is great to have choices ! I'll decide between an i3, the new Toyota plug-in, and the Tesla Model ☰.
It is great to have choices ! I'll decide between an i3, the new Toyota plug-in, and the Tesla Model ☰.
Trev Page
Member
The 2017 models coming out in July will have new higher captaincy cells so the range is supposed to 50% more so 120 miles or 193Km. Better but again, at those prices a Model 3 is still more attractive.
SageBrush
REJECT Fascism
Trev Page
Member
Sorry, should be 30% more range with the NEDC cycle so 124 miles or so. EPA will be less.
If BMW had a 200 mile EPA battery they'd had a much more compelling car on their hands, design aesthetics notwithstanding.
If BMW had a 200 mile EPA battery they'd had a much more compelling car on their hands, design aesthetics notwithstanding.
SageBrush
REJECT Fascism
My favorite is:
NEDC X .69 = EPA
EPA / .69 = NEDC
So, 30 kWh LEAF is 155 NEDC, 107 EPA
155 X .69 = 106.95
16 kWh 2011 Volt/Ampera is NEDC 51.6, 35 EPA
51.6 X .69 = 35.6
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