Welcome to Tesla Motors Club
Discuss Tesla's Model S, Model 3, Model X, Model Y, Cybertruck, Roadster and More.
Register

Chevy Bolt - 200 mile range for $30k base price (after incentive)

This site may earn commission on affiliate links.
I would neither be too sure or to proud of that ratio.

As I pointed out earlier, the Bolt seemed to be the leader in the Google seat issues clubhouse... beating the next several entries combined...

Uncomfortable Seats – Any Recommendations? | Tesla
Next Gen Seats are very uncomfortable for normal sized drivers

That took <5 seconds. Other than the lack of headroom in the back, I see nothing wrong with Tesla seats.

Perhaps my parents never read The Princess and the Pea to me? Dunno.

I've been in a dozen C5's with broken seats, and broke 2 myself. They are not sturdy enough for track use and lack side support.
 
  • Disagree
Reactions: ℬête Noire
Just so you know how to read a chassis dyno sheet -

If it takes 30 hp to roll two tires with 1700lb of downforce on them at 30 mph, it takes pretty close to 50 hp to roll them at 50 mph, and 70hp at 70mph. We are talking rolling losses. It's why a static HP output on a chassis dyno will slope down linearly. The motor is not losing power, it is accumulating losses.

Speed limiters aren't cutoff switches. They curve down or you'd 'stutter' like a racing rev limiter.

Chassis dyno pulls don't start at zero mph. Not enough traction and not safe. Even a Spark has enough initial thrust to hurt people.

So what do we see? A lot of smoothing and some interpolation was used to make the graph.
That pull started at either 3 mph (unlikely), 30 mph, or 42 mph.
Why the HP curve flattened at 75 mph is a mystery, since that means the HP actually climbed. A horizontal line on a chassis dyno means motor output is increasing at the same rate as the rolling drag.
The ramp down from 85-90 is what it looks like when you approach the speed limiter.
Another puzzle is why if there are 35HP losses at 42mph that there is 50HP losses at 80mph, but we really don't know what HP a Spark EV puts out. It's badged at 140HP. The curve COULD be correct. It's just very unlikely. Especially that flat at 75mph, not buying that. Most likely GIGO kicked in.

From the earlier Volt graph, you are showing over 50% rolling losses. That's wrong. A G1 Volt puts out about 162-165 whp to the rollers, or just over 120kW. All Volts are advertised at 111kW SAE at the motor. I haven't seen a G2 on the rollers yet but they more powerful than the G1's even though both are badged 111kW. There is no massive boost in power when running the ICE engine. I race both ways and don't see a difference. Some report there is a difference, but I doubt it. It's unlikely we got 3 'unique' cars. Peak output is controlled with software, think of it like a cruise control. Only the ELR increases output significantly when running both ICE and battery. That feature is not on the Volts even though the motors are the same.

The comedy hour is the Prius graph. That proves the Prius is quicker than Volt. The PiP is about 600lb lighter, so it should walk away. Trust me, if there is a driver in the Volt, that's not happening. It's not just the power to weight, the Prius is a freakin' SLUG from a stoplight. You want to open the door and push with your foot.

Except this is not a dyno Test data...

chevy spark ev UNOFFICIAL blog: SparkEV performance analysis

All you really need to do to understand what I am saying is just to examine this formula:
df093f80b3f8a2891cb9d09fe4e99be3-png.157870
.
 
  • Funny
Reactions: vgrinshpun
I’m not sure how.

By hitting the heat load limit sooner than if the motor (and presumably more importantly battery output) were rated 150kW for more than 10 seconds. Ultimately, as far as I understand, you have a Bolt, so you can just test it doing few 0 to 60 or to 75mph (whatever can be done safely) back to back accelerations.

I am not sure where you are located, but I am in PA. PM me if you are close, and I can show you how one can hit the heat load generated limit in P85+...
 
Last edited:
That quote was a reference to a Model S P85. I thought the Model S motors are not water cooled although I suspect the inverter is. Am I misinformed?
There has been some confusion, particularly regarding the rotor, so it's easy to get bad info.

The motor housing has a water jacket to cool the stator. This is relatively easy to see in the exterior shots, as there are plumbing connections on it(pic from HSR):
large_drive_unit3.jpg


In addition, the cooling diagnostic screen specifies the coolant temp entering and exiting the motor:
coolant2.jpg


The rotor cooling is harder to find pic of. I believe it was in Damien Maguire's motor testing videos that I saw it....
 
  • Informative
Reactions: GSP and Jeff N
Uncomfortable Seats – Any Recommendations? | Tesla
Next Gen Seats are very uncomfortable for normal sized drivers

That took <5 seconds. Other than the lack of headroom in the back, I see nothing wrong with Tesla seats.
Sure, that's a prime feature of the Internet. It takes little effort and time to find find someone making a preposterous claim about nearly any given subject. :p

Doesn't change that Bolt seats are cheap-ass lawn chairs. At their best they'll be bearable. If your butt doesn't happen to be a close match to the narrow thing that it's doing? Much unhappiness will ensue. You'll have to try adjust around it somehow.

It's like those old iron tractor seats. Obviously they were used by millions over decades. They fit some people and then some people had to pile crap on them to keep the blood flowing.
 
Last edited:
It’s quite likely it isn’t mentioned there since most owners aren’t interested or aware of that level of detail.

The Bolt motor is water cooled via an internal heat exchanger with the transmission oil rather than with an actual water jacket directly around the motor. This is a simpler design that was deemed adequate. You can see the water connection pipes sticking up from the back side of this cutaway photo of the motor.

D937899D-C56B-4C95-A36D-CEA7233B563A.jpeg
 
Sure, that's a prime feature of the Internet. It takes little effort and time to find find someone making a preposterous claim about nearly any given subject. :p

Doesn't change that Bolt seats are cheap-ass lawn chairs. At their best they'll be bearable. If your butt doesn't happen to be a close match to the narrow thing that it's doing? Much unhappiness will ensue. You'll have to try adjust around it somehow.

It's like those old iron tractor seats. Obviously they were used by millions over decades. They fit some people and then some people had to pile crap on them to keep the blood flowing.
I know several people who have Bolt's and this is a non-issue for them. I think some dealers have been able to adjust a bolt that was protruding more than it should have been. Unless people are buying the Bolt site unseen (doubtful) they have the opportunity to evaluate the seats for themselves and decide if it is a deal breaker or not. Clearly for most, it is not.
 
I know several people who have Bolt's and this is a non-issue for them. I think some dealers have been able to adjust a bolt that was protruding more than it should have been. Unless people are buying the Bolt site unseen (doubtful) they have the opportunity to evaluate the seats for themselves and decide if it is a deal breaker or not. Clearly for most, it is not.
They are cheap-ass, lawn chair seats.

Whether or not someone cares about that does NOT change that fact.
 
Seems odd that GM isn't able to tell which cars were going to have the problem and send a note to those with affected cars. Instead of the car just giving up the ghost and leaving folks stranded. Of course on the flip side, it seems like Tesla can be overly paranoid with it's you need to get to a service center messages.
 
Well that sucks... hopefully just an outlier. I haven't heard of this being a widespread Bolt problem.

I wonder what the actual failure was? Doesn't sound like contactor issues, as it was "reduced power" for a bit, not sudden shutdown.
 
View attachment 287582 Edmunds’ February Bolt EV update is out and it can best be summed up in a photo. Nothing like your car crapping out in the carpool lane...

Monthly Update for February 2018 - 2017 Chevrolet Bolt EV Long-Term Road Test

Looks like Edmunds got one of the few earlier build Bolts with the battery pack afflicted with the low voltage issue. Curious to know what the build date was on their Bolt. I bet once GM found out it was the Edmunds Bolt that died, they expedited the replacement battery. :D
Most shocking part of the article was the gas station that tried to charge $15 for a bottle of windshield wiper fluid! wtf! Lol

I just took a ~270 mile mini road trip in my Bolt yesterday with 5 people in tow. The elevation increase to my destination in Cumberland certainly took a bite out of range. But it was expected, as I had mapped out my trip in advance and knew the drive to our destination would use more energy than the trip back.

On the return drive, started with 62 miles of estimated range and 65 miles to my destination. Despite that fuzzy math, made it to the fast charging station in Hagerstown, MD (located in an outlet shopping mall parking lot) with 13 miles to spare. Took it a little slow at first but sped up to the 70 mph speed limit once I determined I was fine on range.

The wife and mother in law did some clothes shopping while I took the kids to a toy store. 45 minutes of interruption free charging later (I ended up unplugging and waiting in the parking lot listening to NCAA games for an additional 30 minutes while the wife and MIL finished shopping). Started at 6% SOC, and 33.1 kWh of added juice later, ended at 60%. For the total 270 mile trip, I averaged 3.6 miles/kWh or 278 Wh/mile in Tesla speak.

I was pretty much in the Bolt's sweet spot as far as SOC% for a 45 minute charge sesion on a 125A EVgo station, averaging 44 kW out of the station for the 45 minute charge session....so probably 41-42 kW average flow into the battery. It's likely I hit the first taper towards the end of the session, but not sure exactly when.
chargebegin.jpg chargeend.jpgcharge.jpg