Decreasing rated range.

[glhs272]

Updated:
At that same range charge, here is the ideal miles number:

It took a few miles to begin showing less that the 206.

On the way back the next day, I was able to get 52.1 kwh out of the battery.

For reference about a year ago, I was able to get about 54.0 kwh out of the battery on the same trip (different weather conditions and slightly different route). Not sure how representative this is of battery degradation though.

 

[islandbayy]

I like your range. Just a hair away from 50,000 miles, I should hit 50k when I go in for repairs again... next friday.... My range went up 1 mile after last firmware update. I'm at 202 Rated. ~48,700 miles on car, just under 16,000 miles on new referb battery.

 

[glhs272]

I am quite happy with how my range is holding up thus far, about 1% range loss at 42K. At this rate, I will still have 196 rated miles at 250K miles.

202 range isn't that bad either at 50K. Maybe we will get lucky and the rate of decay will flatten out even more as we rack up the miles.

 

[wycolo]

266 rm after 26k on B battery.
--

 

[Electroman]

glhs272: more than RR, the energy extracted is perhaps a better indicator of your battery capacity. If you were able to extract 54 kWh last year and 52 this year (on a fully charged battery down to zero miles of driving) , that would indicate approx 4% degradation.

You agree?

 

[apacheguy]

@wycolo - that's pretty darn good. What's your daily charge limit?

 

[sorka]

I like your range. Just a hair away from 50,000 miles, I should hit 50k when I go in for repairs again... next friday.... My range went up 1 mile after last firmware update. I'm at 202 Rated. ~48,700 miles on car, just under 16,000 miles on new referb battery.

Only 50K miles and you already got a new battery???? What happened?

 

[rlang59]

Only 50K miles and you already got a new battery???? What happened?

See here:
Well, luck finally caught up with me... Main pack failed...

 

[glhs272]

glhs272: more than RR, the energy extracted is perhaps a better indicator of your battery capacity. If you were able to extract 54 kWh last year and 52 this year (on a fully charged battery down to zero miles of driving) , that would indicate approx 4% degradation.

You agree?

The extracted energy should be different between the two trips. On the second trip I used a different shorter route (back roads vs. free way) that allowed me to drive slower and use more heat. So not a very good test in that regard, but yes I agree the lower extracted energy should be noted. Also note the different firmware and the fact that on this latest trip the drive limiter was not present, unlike the old trip where I was driving for several miles at limited kw. Thus I believe I ended this latest trip with more range still available in the pack despite showing the same rated miles. I considered making the trip the same as last time, but I found this other route much more pleasing. I guess I need to make another run and just see how much energy I can extract from the pack and see if I can get 54 kwh or greater. Maybe target an identical 312wh/mi consumption rate and see how many miles it will go until I hit the power limiter at that level.

 

[tezco]

266 rm after 26k on B battery.
--

That is good. I think the last time I topped off I only got up to 257 rated miles. Of course, I have an A pack and the car is about 2 1/2 years old now.

 

[wycolo]

It was still charging after 266 but I didn't want to waaait out a possible 267. Getting 'one over' the nominal 265rm was good enough for me!!

This was at the 7th SuperCharger in a row as I was preparing to venture off into uncharted territory, so the pack had been exercised somewhat up to that point.
--

 

[wycolo]

@wycolo - that's pretty darn good. What's your daily charge limit?

I used to keep around 170rm and charge up right before trips but it often was a good bit below that for days at a time. Nowadays in this 'don't worry, be happy' SOC era I'm setting it around 210 or 220. It is still hard to see just where the 90% marker is when I go to reset it.

Maybe this 'do a string of SpCs and then try for a full 265rm' test might be worth doing periodically.
--

 

[glhs272]

More about this picture when I return from my trip. Note the kWh extracted from the pack.

 

[FredTMC]

This is insane! How are you still getting 207 RR with 45K mi on the ODO?!

brand new my car got 208 mi

now, after 51k mi, I get ~193 mi RR on a full charge. And 173 mi on a "standard" charge.

Note:

- I hardly ever "range charge"

- I hardly ever run the battery down and I charge immediately after

- I don't leave the car sitting around at high SOC or Low SOC

 

[dalamchops]

This is insane! How are you still getting 207 RR with 45K mi on the ODO?!

brand new my car got 208 mi

now, after 51k mi, I get ~193 mi RR on a full charge. And 173 mi on a "standard" charge.

Note:

- I hardly ever "range charge"

- I hardly ever run the battery down and I charge immediately after

- I don't leave the car sitting around at high SOC or Low SOC

some batteries are just better than others.. I had a 60kwh that was down to 174 90% after 11k, and another one that's still at 187 90% with zero signs of degradation after 7k

 

[Pilot_51]

some batteries are just better than others.. I had a 60kwh that was down to 174 90% after 11k, and another one that's still at 187 90% with zero signs of degradation after 7k

After charging to 80% for about half a year and losing ~15 miles range, then charging to 90%, I got about 165. Since then, it has gradually increased to 173 and still appears to be rising very slowly. I just passed 11k last week. I've never charged over 90% and only went down to 10% once. In this case, it is clearly not a degradation issue, rather an issue of calibration or balancing, at least as far as the regained range proves.

 

[David99]

This is insane! How are you still getting 207 RR with 45K mi on the ODO?!

Look at where he lives and where you live.
Average annual temperature in Wisconsin is 45 degree F
Average annual temperature in OC 72 degree F
That makes a big difference. Elon once said (in regards to battery life) it would last 'forever' in Alaska. Temperature is one of the biggest factors in battery aging.

 

[apacheguy]

Look at where he lives and where you live.
Average annual temperature in Wisconsin is 45 degree F
Average annual temperature in OC 72 degree F
That makes a big difference. Elon once said (in regards to battery life) it would last 'forever' in Alaska. Temperature is one of the biggest factors in battery aging.

This really shouldn't be an issue with liquid cooling/heating. If someone could actually demonstrate a correlation between rated range, battery age, and location, I'd be very interested.

 

[invisik]

But when the car is not being driven, the average ambient temperature is way lower in WI. So over the life of the pack, the WI pack should last longer....

-m

 

[David99]

This really shouldn't be an issue with liquid cooling/heating. If someone could actually demonstrate a correlation between rated range, battery age, and location, I'd be very interested.

The battery has a liquid temperature management, but it's not cooled down to the same temperatures as you have on average in Wisconsin. That's not how it works. The battery is actually performing better at warmer temperatures, but unfortunately also aging quicker. The only time it is actively cooled down is when it reaches a dangerous temperature which is when you drive very hard or when you charge at a Supercharger.
The battery is not kept at the same temperature regardless of the outside temperature. This would take a huge amount of energy and make the car inefficient and would have very little advantage.
Again, Elon pointed out that lower ambient temperatures are good for the battery life. The temperature management just keeps it from going too cold and too hot.