FSD Beta v11.x

The next big milestone for FSD is 11. It is a significant upgrade and fundamental changes to several parts of the FSD stack including totally new way to train the perception NN.

From AI day and Lex Fridman interview we have a good sense of what might be included.

- Object permanence both temporal and spatial
- Moving from “bag of points” to objects in NN
- Creating a 3D vector representation of the environment all in NN
- Planner optimization using NN / Monte Carlo Tree Search (MCTS)
- Change from processed images to “photon count” / raw image
- Change from single image perception to surround video
- Merging of city, highway and parking lot stacks a.k.a. Single Stack

Lex Fridman Interview of Elon. Starting with FSD related topics.

Here is a detailed explanation of Beta 11 in "layman's language" by James Douma, interview done after Lex Podcast.

Here is the AI Day explanation by in 4 parts.

Deep Understanding Tesla FSD Part 1: HydraNet

From Theory to Reality, Analyze the Evolution of Tesla Full Self-Driving

saneryee-studio.medium.com

Here is a useful blog post asking a few questions to Tesla about AI day. The useful part comes in comparison of Tesla's methods with Waymo and others (detailed papers linked).

Twelve Questions about Tesla Autopilot Technologies Exposed at 2021 AI Day

On Aug. 19 2021, Telsa held an AI day , exposing more technologies about Autopilot , from perception, planning, data labeling, simulation…

yuhuang-63908.medium.com

 

[hybridbear]

But only the font size on three icons:

On Twitter Teslascope claimed that this recall is because the standards changed for how warning lights should be displayed & since Tesla has a fully customizable screen dash they can do a recall to update the warning lights to the new standards. I do not know if Teslascope has verified their claim that this is due to a new standard versus Tesla failing to comply with old standards.

 

[willow_hiller]

On Twitter Teslascope claimed that this recall is because the standards changed for how warning lights should be displayed & since Tesla has a fully customizable screen dash they can do a recall to update the warning lights to the new standards. I do not know if Teslascope has verified their claim that this is due to a new standard versus Tesla failing to comply with old standards.

Here's the actual icons side-by-side. Old icons on the left, new icons on the right. To my eye, the old icons match what I've seen on every other car I've driven, so that would say to me that Tesla is updating to new standards:

 

[Knightshade]

On Twitter Teslascope claimed that this recall is because the standards changed for how warning lights should be displayed & since Tesla has a fully customizable screen dash they can do a recall to update the warning lights to the new standards. I do not know if Teslascope has verified their claim that this is due to a new standard versus Tesla failing to comply with old standards.

Typically when a new standard is passed it only applies to cars built after the standard, so I'd be surprised if their claim was accurate.

 

[Daniel in SD]

I think Tesla does recalls to get free publicity.

 

[hybridbear]

Typically when a new standard is passed it only applies to cars built after the standard, so I'd be surprised if their claim was accurate.

That would be my expectation as well. On Twitter Green says that the regulation has been in place since 2005/2006. So this is another case of Tesla not being competent enough to follow established regulation.

 

[sleepydoc]

Here's the actual icons side-by-side. Old icons on the left, new icons on the right. To my eye, the old icons match what I've seen on every other car I've driven, so that would say to me that Tesla is updating to new standards:

View attachment 1014673

All of the original icons are completely consistent with those on every car I’ve owned in the last 10 years. It’s hard to distinguish size and that also depends on viewing distance and angle. Having the gear indicator in a larger font is good but I can’t see how the other icons matter. “PARK,” “BRAKE” and “ABS” are larger but the old icons were readily identifiable so there’s no clear benefit to me to changing them.

 

[rlsd]

I think PRND needs to be larger and bolder.

Pedestrian symbol needs to be darker and have a different color.

Shoulder lane symbol needs to be darker.

Moving car symbols need to be darker.

We need something to know if our car break lights are on. The little red behind the ego is not easy to tell.

 

[sleepydoc]

Yeah something wrong with your car. This is abnormal (though I think you are also including experiences with old software which was allegedly defective in this regard (not a car issue)), but really the question is whether this is happening for the current software.

Yes - the last unprovoked strike I had was last September. I can’t remember what version I was on then but it was at least a couple versions ago.

For reference, a friend and I were driving In late afternoon on a 2 lane highway in WI. I can’t remember how much traffic there was but there was little if any. I had just tugged the wheel to stop a nag (screen started flashing blue, But no beeping) and It put me in timeout. The only possible triggering factor was my friend answered his phone, but he was sitting in the passenger seat so it was either completely unrelated or the system is even more atrocious than suspected at accurately identifying risky behavior.

 

[bhakan]

I don’t see this at all as long as I am driving and looking at the road when engaging. The only way I can get it is to look down while/after engaging.

I did not get the red "pay attention to road" alert when I engaged the FSD when I drove during the daytime yesterday. So it is a cabin camera issue when it is darker in the cabin. I had that issue a while ago but later on it went away. Now it is baaaaaack!

 

[sleepydoc]

I did not get the red "pay attention to road" alert when I engaged the FSD when I drove during the daytime yesterday. So it is a cabin camera issue when it is darker in the cabin. I had that issue a while ago but later on it went away. Now it is baaaaaack!

I have a theory on this:
FSD is constantly monitoring your attention/gaze and when you acitvate FSD is giving you a nag based on what you were doing immediately before activating. How does this play out? Well, you are glancing down at the screen to enter/verify your destination and activate navigation. Immediately after that you look back up at the road and activate FSD, at which point FSD nags “pay attention to the road!” Because you were just looking down at the screen.

Next time try making sure you’re looking straight ahead for 5-10 seconds prior to activating and see what happens. I was out this afternoon and it seems to work but I’ve only tested it a couple of times.

 

[pilotSteve]

Need fisher price mode for old people.

** multi focal contact lenses **

 

[Hiline]

Do the nags bother people that much? I typically just ignore the eyes on the road reminders because they disappear after a few seconds. The hands on the wheel reminders just require a light tug or a scroll wheel scroll.

 

[bhakan]

I have a theory on this:
FSD is constantly monitoring your attention/gaze and when you acitvate FSD is giving you a nag based on what you were doing immediately before activating. How does this play out? Well, you are glancing down at the screen to enter/verify your destination and activate navigation. Immediately after that you look back up at the road and activate FSD, at which point FSD nags “pay attention to the road!” Because you were just looking down at the screen.

Next time try making sure you’re looking straight ahead for 5-10 seconds prior to activating and see what happens. I was out this afternoon and it seems to work but I’ve only tested it a couple of times.

Ok. I am looking at my watch and looking at whatever notifications I get and during the daytime I don;t get any nag. I can be doing anything with my watch and FSD does not care. However, at night I don't do any of that. Just engaging the FSD even tho i have my nav all set and I am at the stop sign in my neighborhood it alerts me with red wheels. There is no warning like I would see during the daytime. Oh well!

 

[PACEMD]

Hey Mr law breaker! You take your penance as deserved! Your next suspension the “Shame” soundtrack will play on All of your external speakers continuously with wipers a 140% speed to signal All that you disobeyed the rules and all should fear you.
View attachment 1014417

Walk of shame, I'm there. Now the Autopilot screen actually states you lose both Autosteer beta and FSDb for 5 such misanthropic events. Our non-FSDb car just states you lose the Autosteer beta after 5 such events. Neither says for how long you lose those prepaid privileges. Anyone know if the suspension time has changed?

I did get both back yesterday, after one week, so there's that.

 

[PACEMD]

I don’t see this at all as long as I am driving and looking at the road when engaging. The only way I can get it is to look down while/after engaging.

Sure, but the rest of us do. I clearly now only get strikes when staring straight ahead, eyes open, obviously paying attention, but not moving my head like an ectopic octopus.........

 

[rlsd]

I have a theory on this:
FSD is constantly monitoring your attention/gaze and when you acitvate FSD is giving you a nag based on what you were doing immediately before activating. How does this play out? Well, you are glancing down at the screen to enter/verify your destination and activate navigation. Immediately after that you look back up at the road and activate FSD, at which point FSD nags “pay attention to the road!” Because you were just looking down at the screen.

Next time try making sure you’re looking straight ahead for 5-10 seconds prior to activating and see what happens. I was out this afternoon and it seems to work but I’ve only tested it a couple of times.

That's true but you will have plenty of time to react. It will not give you a strike unless you continue to give a long dirty look to the touchscreen. I got red wheel many times but I don't have any strike so far. I change music all the time on Spotify. I had 1.75 hour drive during the afternoon and 1.75 hour during the evening today and had less than 5 nags.
My experience may be different from yours.

 

[PACEMD]

Sometimes that screen stares at me as if my other head is making faces at it..........

 

[PACEMD]

I think Tesla does recalls to get free publicity.

I recall getting some free publicity once. But I was out of town when that sh*t happened.........

 

[LincolnsDoctor]

Sure, but the rest of us do. I clearly now only get strikes when staring straight ahead, eyes open, obviously paying attention, but not moving my head like an ectopic octopus.........

You are "supposed" to keep checking your mirrors when driving ( i.e. that is what I was taught and do). That said, one thing this forum has taught me is that there is a lot of variability in driving styles.

It would be nice if the car told you what it thinks you are doing wrong. My car now only nags me if my hand is near my face for too long, or if I tilt my head to the right for too long. Why? Who knows. I miss thoughtfully stroking my imaginary beard while driving.

I used to get strikes all the time, now I never do. I don't think I'm doing anything different. I hope the next update doesn't put me back in the strikes-all-the-time club.

You should check your mirrors roughly every 5 to 8 seconds. This includes your rear view mirror (to check what is going on behind you) and your side mirrors (to check what is going on either side of your vehicle). How To Check Your Mirrors While Driving (With Ease)

 

[PACEMD]

You are "supposed" to keep checking your mirrors when driving ( i.e. that is what I was taught and do). That said, one thing this forum has taught me is that there is a lot of variability in driving styles.

It would be nice if the car told you what it thinks you are doing wrong. My car now only nags me if my hand is near my face for too long, or if I tilt my head to the right for too long. Why? Who knows. I miss thoughtfully stroking my imaginary beard while driving.

I used to get strikes all the time, now I never do. I don't think I'm doing anything different. I hope the next update doesn't put me back in the strikes-all-the-time club.

Right, you should pay as much attention to what's behind and beside you as to what's in front. But with me, now mostly using FSDb on a basically empty freeway, those percentages have favored the straight-ahead views. I should have explained that earlier. I commute once a week, 150 miles each way, on a rural Montana interstate. And I only have half an imaginary beard so perhaps that's where I'm striking out........