Can you guess who supplied the hardware in AP1 cars, you have proven my point perfectly
.If you want the old world way of doing things go for it, no one is forcing anyone to buy FSD or even a Tesla.
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FSD subscription - Q2
- Thread starter DaveW
- Start date
Can you guess who supplied the hardware in AP1 cars, you have proven my point perfectly
.If you want the old world way of doing things go for it, no one is forcing anyone to buy FSD or even a Tesla.
As far as I'm aware he'd divorced from mobileye well before adding the pillar cams or any condensation protection on them when first installed. AP1 buyers knew what they got and what they got worked. Agreed no-one is forced to buy FSD but they were easily duped....Can you guess who supplied the hardware in AP1 cars, you have proven my point perfectly
If you want the old world way of doing things go for it, no one is forcing anyone to buy FSD or even a Tesla.
When did you realise Musk was a fantasist and a liar relative to when you bought your car (because its been subsequently proven he consistently lied over the FSD progress since 2015) ?
Musk in March 2015:
"I don't think we have to worry about autonomous cars because it's a sort of a narrow form of AI. It's not something I think is very difficult. To do autonomous driving that is to a degree much safer than a person, is much easier than people think. I almost view it like a solved problem."
Musk in February 2019:
“I think we will be feature complete, full self-driving, this year. Meaning the car will be able to find you in a parking lot, pick you up and take you all the way to your destination without an intervention. This year. I would say I am of certain of that, that is not a question mark.”
Anyone else who spouted complete crap like this would be described as a charlatan, but there are plenty of people who hang on the Musk’s every word as if he’s the second Messiah. Fact is that true full self driving (rather than Tesla’s definition) will not be a realty , especially in this country, for many years.
Yes, I invested in FSD nearly two years ago and I consider it to be a complete waste of money.
"I don't think we have to worry about autonomous cars because it's a sort of a narrow form of AI. It's not something I think is very difficult. To do autonomous driving that is to a degree much safer than a person, is much easier than people think. I almost view it like a solved problem."
Musk in February 2019:
“I think we will be feature complete, full self-driving, this year. Meaning the car will be able to find you in a parking lot, pick you up and take you all the way to your destination without an intervention. This year. I would say I am of certain of that, that is not a question mark.”
Anyone else who spouted complete crap like this would be described as a charlatan, but there are plenty of people who hang on the Musk’s every word as if he’s the second Messiah. Fact is that true full self driving (rather than Tesla’s definition) will not be a realty , especially in this country, for many years.
Yes, I invested in FSD nearly two years ago and I consider it to be a complete waste of money.
MrBadger
Badger out
Unfortunately, it wasn't just Musk. There was (still is in some conversations) also a lot of hype from others - you do soon learn to filter them out but not before potential decisions have been made. Before becoming a TMC member I can remember asking a sales rep some questions and getting some answers with a look on his face that I now understand to be his 'you know I am BSing you don't you?' face. Thankfully FSD in those days was not as expensive as now, so the price differential between the then unavailable EAP and vapourware FSD additional functionally was relatively small. I would be well upset if I had paid current FSD pricing and fully sympathise with early FSD adoptors who have had nothing to show for their money, although less so for those that changed cars are subsequently did the same thing.
And there m'laud concludes the case for the defense.
That said, I really do believe that Tesla couldn't achieve L3 in the NoA domain reasonably quickly if they put their minds to things. My concern is that I think they think highways is 'Done' and in typical Tesla fashion, have moved on from there and content in leaving it in their half finished box of features that may occasionally benefit from a side effect of some other development.
Tesla seem to claim a success when something is implemented, even if really poor. SO froma feature complete point of view the motorways is pretty much done, or was as they're starting again without a radar, Sme with auto headlights, Same with auto wipers. Get something out there, claim its "feature complete" or "has more features than any other autonomous tech in consumers cars" and move on with really slow, glacial improvement of what you've already delivered. For 3 if not 4 years people talked about the older AP1 performing better than Teslas offering on a feature by feature basis, but you get the Gangzooms of this world claiming Tesla is winning because it could do more, even if badly. AP1 lane change from 2016 was pretty rock solid yet many complain about delaysm, nags, how hard to press the indicator, the regulations make it not work (which is bull given AP1 works ok)
I'm sure the Tesla system is now muich better than the old AP1, but its been a pretty disfunctional journey getting there when a car bought with AP1 back in late 2-16 would have enjoyed the benefits of a reliable working system with speed limit recognition, lane change and parking.
I'm sure the Tesla system is now muich better than the old AP1, but its been a pretty disfunctional journey getting there when a car bought with AP1 back in late 2-16 would have enjoyed the benefits of a reliable working system with speed limit recognition, lane change and parking.
Of course Tesla is a car manufacturer. To suggest otherwise is patently ridiculous.
This “Tesla is primarily a tech company” BS has been used by fanboys for years to excuse Tesla’s sometimes inexcusably shoddy manufacturing processes, and the fact that they are clearly incapable of producing windscreen wipers and auto headlights that work anything like as well as those on a £20k hatch.
I really don’t know how people give Musk any credibility when it comes to predictions and timelines. He’s as full of crap as the average sewage farm. As well as the BS he’s spouted about FSD over the years, where are the one million robo taxis that were supposed to be on the streets at the end of LAST year?
I’ve actually read people on this forum (UK) saying they’re looking forward to sending their cars out to work as robo taxis and earn money. Dream on!
Thinking about it - enhanced autopilot with auto lane change, navigate on autopilot, parking assist and summon - arguably thats reasonable value for 3.4k. Plenty of other cars like eg the polestar charge you that for active cruise and lane keep assist. window shopping things like the enyaq, polestar etc really open your eyes to just how much manufacturers charge for relatively small features - and often carefully split across ‘packs’ in such a way to encourage/require you to buy a couple - you can easily be paying more in options for less functionality than EAP.
the FSD part is clearly worth nothging right now in the UK, but if it was anything like the claims then that too could be worth the cost of entry. If they could improve a few bits of EAP then I might consider a purchase or more likely a sub as I tend not to keep my cars for long despite my initial intentions
the FSD part is clearly worth nothging right now in the UK, but if it was anything like the claims then that too could be worth the cost of entry. If they could improve a few bits of EAP then I might consider a purchase or more likely a sub as I tend not to keep my cars for long despite my initial intentions
SpareHeadOne
Member
I'll be interested when it works and not before. I don't mind being a tester, but I object to being fleeced for it; after 5-6 years of broken promises and missed deadlines around FSD I wouldn't pay 1p for it right now, especially given how randomly TACC, the wipers and the headlights still behave at times.
I've been around the block a few times and I've been burned by a few companies who promise future enhancements that never appear or don't work nearly as well as promised. Here's a life tip: Buy it for what it does now, no more. (Exceptions for things like Kickstarter projects, for obvious reasons)
Drew57
Active ember
I guess I was fortunate that my Daughter has owned several Tesla models & latterly an Xs in the USA. I'd been driving them regularly before ordering my own Tesla & therefore had plenty of opportunity to try out FSD in the place where it is supposedly optimised.
Even in California I never found it to be particularly useful or accurate (phantom braking occurs randomly there too which can be more stressful than here as general driving standards seem inferior).
After a number of lengthy CA-NV-ID road trips during 2018-2019 I still believe I made the right decision to stay with hair-shirt AP & Musks' fantasy-hype irritates me to the point that I now doubt I would ever subscribe, let alone purchase.
Sorry to be so negative, I really like the cars & the pleasure of driving them myself (plus perfectly adequate Autopilot relative to its own cost premium).
Even in California I never found it to be particularly useful or accurate (phantom braking occurs randomly there too which can be more stressful than here as general driving standards seem inferior).
After a number of lengthy CA-NV-ID road trips during 2018-2019 I still believe I made the right decision to stay with hair-shirt AP & Musks' fantasy-hype irritates me to the point that I now doubt I would ever subscribe, let alone purchase.
Sorry to be so negative, I really like the cars & the pleasure of driving them myself (plus perfectly adequate Autopilot relative to its own cost premium).
Just don’t cancel autopilot when I want to change lane. That’s all I want
I’ll pay £500-1000 for ‘auto lane change on indication while in AP‘ as a standlone feature.
I think there are 2 types of people in this regard, those that have picked up on the hyp, get here and smell the coffee after a while (something that is getting quicker all the time, 5 years a go you'd be a lone voice complaining about Tesla) and those that just refuse to think anything but magic comes out of Fremont excusing anything bad putting it down to "young growing company" or "they're a technology company not a car maker" while dropping every last investment penny they have into bitcoin because Musk did.
As said, the annoying aspect to this is what will have pushed some people into buying FSD. Tesla making it available for £500-£1000 would invalidate FSD completely.
Frankly now that EAP exists for half the price there is pretty much no reason to buy FSD now, as all you get is traffic light stop and go.
I'm happy with my purchase of FSD for £4800 in May 2019, but clearly now I would probably either get EAP or a subscription. I use it everyday for lane changing on the motorway, and occasionally summon to move my car on the drive. It was always entirely clear that this was a ticket to join an early access programme and not a finished product. I've rarely seen any issues with 'phantom breaking', perhaps 3 or 4 times and you just take control, no big deal.
I also have a recent Leaf with their Mobileye based lane keeping, it's not equivalent to Autopilot. Tesla takes firm control of the car so you can take in a far greater awareness of your surroundings. With Mobileye I'm still far too fixed on that patch of tarmac ahead. It's a steering assist, not self driving.
People do seem very passionate about their 'not buying' of it, kinda like a cheesy love story where the protagonists hate each other until their eyes finally meet
I also have a recent Leaf with their Mobileye based lane keeping, it's not equivalent to Autopilot. Tesla takes firm control of the car so you can take in a far greater awareness of your surroundings. With Mobileye I'm still far too fixed on that patch of tarmac ahead. It's a steering assist, not self driving.
People do seem very passionate about their 'not buying' of it, kinda like a cheesy love story where the protagonists hate each other until their eyes finally meet
I'm looking forward to finding out the length of commitment required if using the subscription. I've little use for either EAP or FSD day to day but am planning a 3,500 mile round trip in July.
If I can pick up EAP for $100/(£80-£100) for a month only then I think that would be worth it for the auto lane change function as the trip will be 90% motorway.
If I can pick up EAP for $100/(£80-£100) for a month only then I think that would be worth it for the auto lane change function as the trip will be 90% motorway.
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