FSD v12.x (end to end AI)

[Mardak]

More examples of 12.x not getting confused by 11.x perception. The new blue path is confidently speeding towards incorrectly perceived median:

Plenty of construction around here that results in very jerky 11.x, so hopefully it'll be much improved with end-to-end.

 

[rlsd]

I took v12.2.1 to La Jolla, San Diego at lunch today.
FSD correctly waited for pedestrians, a seagull, and other cars to move and make turns.

I had 2 disengagements because of caution:
1. FSD wanted to get around a long construction pickup truck that was parked head-in in an angled parking spot and partially blocked the street. My car was too close to the rear of the truck.
2. A woman made a sudden u-turn in the middle of a street with a double yellow line. FSD stopped but I disengaged when seeing the driver reversing her car to my car path because there was not enough room for her to make a complete u-turn.

This evening FSD made a bad move: it attempted to make right turn from a shopping area to a 45 mph street when cars were moving fast to my car path.

 

[Mardak]

Is this the type of turn lane that people have noticed 11.x getting into when needing to go straight? Seems like at least this one is fixed with 12.x.

I wonder why end-to-end avoided one puddle but drove through another?

 

[Dewg]

I didn't think to ask - does v12 have Minimize Lane Changes?

 

[aronth5]

For those who have V12 how close is FSD to taking elderly parents to the doctor or the grocery store assuming the parent can take over if the car comes up an unusual edge case (i.e. traffic accident, detour). And park as needed. I suspect there are many people who hope FSD will let their parents to keep their cars longer and give them greater independence.

 

[rlsd]

For those who have V12 how close is FSD to taking elderly parents to the doctor or the grocery store assuming the parent can take over if the car comes up an unusual edge case (i.e. traffic accident, detour). And park as needed. I suspect there are many people who hope FSD will let their parents to keep their cars longer and give them greater independence.

You need to specify the age ranges and the health conditions of the parents.
If the parents are still in good health, can be vigilant, and can react quickly then they can use the polished version of V12.

 

[Knightshade]

You need to specify the age ranges and the health conditions of the parents.
If the parents are still in good health, can be vigilant, and can react quickly then they can use the polished version of V12.

Honestly depending on the answers to those, and road/traffic conditions, 11.x works fine for that too,

Especially if you don't care about annoying anyone behind you when it takes longer than a human to get through a stop sign.

 

[kabin]

Haste makes waste. V12.2.1 attempts to go around a long line of vehicles on a blind curve.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1760846858564612144

 

[rlsd]

Honestly depending on the answers to those, and road/traffic conditions, 11.x works fine for that too,

Especially if you don't care about annoying anyone behind you when it takes longer than a human to get through a stop sign.

"Honored Citizen" sign behind the car may help.

 

[kabin]

Is the neural network doing lane planning for a route or is that planning still coming from some external component that feeds FSD? For example, "take the next left". If that directive comes late enough, then there's not much any system can do.

I find it so odd that lane selection is such a difficult problem to solve. The car is juggling pedestrians, cars, traffic controls, markings on the road, etc, in real time, but knowing when to get into the left lane for a left turn is somehow beyond it. Or is this that perennial favorite - flawed map data?

I would guess map/nav are part of the input. I'm wondering if the current build is overtrained on short SF city blocks where you can get away with navigation lane changes in the last 0.1mi versus the real world where heavy traffic flow almost requires early decision making.

 

[aronth5]

Honestly depending on the answers to those, and road/traffic conditions, 11.x works fine for that too,

Especially if you don't care about annoying anyone behind you when it takes longer than a human to get through a stop sign.

Where I live (Greater Boston) V11 isn't ready based on 2 1/2 years of using FSD. Too many difficult intersections and old road layout problems. V12 based on the videos I've watched seems a lot closer to achieving this which is promising. Especially at night and in wet conditions.

 

[Knightshade]

Yeah as I suggest it's highly dependent on area- around here, esp. if I remember to put on minimum lane changes, it's fine for 95% of my miles, nearer 99% if I don't care about annoying people behind me by being slow at stop rights or rights on red....Still not REMOTELY near RT level, but plenty good enough for "do vast majority of work to get to local doctor or store if you're able to take over" Other places it seems a lot worse.

 

[kabin]

V12 needs more bake time. It looks more like an engineering version than beta.

 

[sleepydoc]

Ah, with the over-training being from the west coast I can now see the problem with running stop signs. They don't yet have a video yet from the 3 people who actually stop for signs over there.

no, since they moved to TX they trained on Texas rolling stops!

 

[rlsd]

"Honored Citizen" sign behind the car may help.

Don't laugh

Honored Citizen Fare

For age 65+, people on Medicare, people with disabilities, people who qualify based on income, veterans and active-duty military.

trimet.org

 

[sleepydoc]

Tesla, please, please don't regard it as bad behavior. In my part of town, if you don't cross the double yellow line early, you'll never get the chance to turn left.

"But Officer, I was just driving like you do!"

 

[rlsd]

I think Tesla needs to do more testing in the following areas:
San Diego, Orange County CA, Portland, DC, Durham, Boston, Philadelphia, Lansing, Indianapolis, Atlanta, Orlando, Miami, Baton Rouge, San Antonio (in both downtown and suburban areas). Plus mountains and ski resorts.

 

[JulienW]

I think Tesla needs to do more testing in the following areas:
San Diego, Orange County CA, Portland, DC, Durham, Boston, Philadelphia, Lansing, Indianapolis, Atlanta, Orlando, Miami, Baton Rouge, San Antonio (in both downtown and suburban areas). Plus mountains and ski resorts.

I volunteer for ATL. Please get Elon to send v12.x to me and I'm on it. I'll even make some SUPER HIGH quality/professionally edited videos like in my post below (eat your heart out AI DRIVR and DirtyTesla).

 

[JulienW]

For all the "never cross" a double yellow liners how do you handle the following 2 scenarios, both from this morning (sorry, shi$$y HW3 camera)?

In the first I'm turning into a mall (FSD disengaged for safety) and you must use the VERY top part of the left turn lane. If FSD 11.x does it (only if no one is turning in front of me or coming up behind for safety) it passes the yellow and then angles in and leaves its a$$ dangerously blocking the left lane. And of course with a car turning in front on me there is 0 choice other than to pass up the turn completely.

In the 2ed FSD engaged and double parked cars 100% of the time from early morning to late evening (privileged golf course). So what to do? Stop in the road and wait 10 hours for the spaces to clear?

 

[SidetrackedSue]

Haste makes waste. V12.2.1 attempts to go around a long line of vehicles on a blind curve.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1760846858564612144

I feel like this video answers the question can FSDb can be used by elderly parents to increase their independence?

I'd rather drive slowly (at the speed limit, not above or at the speed driving conditions require), at my own pace, leaving space between me and the car in front of me, and choosing a route that is least likely to cause issues (avoiding unprotected lefts, or high collision rate intersections) than let FSDb (any version) make all the decisions and while counting on me to be ready to jump in when it decides to do something crazy like pulling into oncoming traffic for no reason rather than stop for traffic in front of me.

I feel that one must be a higher functioning driver to babysit FSDb. So I do not recommend it for older drivers who are hoping to use FSDb to increase independence and possibly 'drive better' than they currently do.

Example: I have trouble driving at night due to haloing (apparently due to astigmatism, not cataracts which I don't have.) Since I own FSDb, this would be a natural fit for me, helping me drive with more confidence at night. But it is useless because I have to be more attentive through the glare, leaving me with no extra energy to be dealing with FSDb, even if I reduce the speed traveled and tell it to limit lane changes. It is one thing to have to see and predict what is happening around you responding accordingly. It is another to have to see and predict and then sit back and wonder if the car is going to respond accordingly or worse, worry about what the car will do for no logical reason at all. That makes driving far too stressful for me and why neither of us use FSDb on city streets in daylight or at night.