Help deciding 60kw or 85kw

[johnnyS]

The 85 is great--the range almost replicates a gasoline car range. The model S is a fantastic road car. I think you will be surprised how you will find excuses for road trips. My commute is only 6 miles, but sometimes I have appointments that are 75-100 miles away. I never think about range in daily driving. My wife and I have been thinking about flying to Vancouver next summer, but now there are superchargers all the way from Southern California to Canada--maybe we will drive!

 

[dsm363]

I do follow your point but I don't take long road trips(San Diego => Sequoia National Park was my longest stretch in a day till date), instead prefer flying and then renting(usually a large SUV) from the destination. Usually that also involves a larger group of people and kids at times. So with that $8k I could do this fly+rent combination several times without worrying about bashing up a nice car on unknown terrain over extra long distances and people who may or may not care about a pricey car :smile: .. yes I am finicky about a whole bunch of things I don't allow in my car (maybe because I don't have kids yet)
I can surely argue in favor of S85 as well but I am trying to justify what I really need and not throwing away money for peace of mind (for situation which may never really present itself). I have two ICE cars on the side btw, and one of them stays.

Can't argue with anything you said. If you plan on keeping the car for many years (8+) then a larger battery pack will allow for more range after some degradation and also in bad weather. That said if you are confident you'll never go on long day trips then the 60kWh is still a great car.

 

[N4HHE]

Can't argue with anything you said. If you plan on keeping the car for many years (8+) then a larger battery pack will allow for more range after some degradation and also in bad weather. That said if you are confident you'll never go on long day trips then the 60kWh is still a great car.

Absolutely totally agree. Thats one significant reason I bought an 85. A corollary of the above is that smaller percentage charge/discharges induce less wear. So regular 60 mile cycles will wear an 85 kWh battery less than a 60 kWh battery. A Nissan LEAF with only 80 mile range is working the battery hard for a 60 mile day.

Also charge rate slows somewhere above 50%, and is really slow from 80% to 100% (if you go that far). So if you need a charge the 85 might get there a few minutes quicker.

 

[jerry33]

I don't think you will find many people who went with the 85 and later consider the money "thrown away".

Many find after the get the Model S, they drive it much more and further than they ever planned to. Many drive it far more than they drove their previous ICE vehicles.

Last year I drove 16,000 miles with my ICE. This year I'm at over 13,000 in eight months. If I continue at this rate it will be a 20,000 mile year. A 25% increase.

 

[Discoducky]

I don't think you will find many people who went with the 85 and later consider the money "thrown away".

"Thrown away" is harsh, but I'm really glad I invested the money in TM I 'saved' (not sure that is the right word either) or 'didn't spend' on the 85 as I've never *needed* it to live my life the way that makes the most sense to me

AKA, I haven't lost a speed race yet or come up short or been delayed from charging or not been able to go anywhere I didn't want to go or keep me from going 4000 miles up and down the west coast

Are you feelin' me?

 

[Tacket]

I've got a 60 and also love it tremendously. Have not felt range issues, even on longer trips (500mi) in the cold rain here in the NW. HOWEVER, I assume that I will be able to upgrade this battery to a bigger one when it comes time to replace as probably at some point in the distant future it's degraded range will not get me to where I need to go (NOTE: I have no proof of this and quite honestly this may be a completely idiotic assumption on my part since we've been expressly told this will not be an option -- which in that case, I give this car to my wife and get a new one )

BUT, I have had to drive slow on some of those long rainy trips, and once had to safely draft a semi to get where I needed to go. Oh yeah, I usually drive with the heat off on those aforementioned longer, cold trips. Some may think that on a $80k+ car putting up with these inconveniences is ridiculous -- I personally love it (I like feeling needed by the car). I also have fun planning the trips out, making sure I have enough range, charge time, etc. etc., making a spreadsheet, blah blah. Crazy right?!

 

[Merrill]

As was stated before many times the choice is dependent on your individual situation. My wife I are both retired, so no commute and we rarely take long road trips. So for us the 60 works great, went to Lake Tahoe with no problems and live in California so plenty of charging options. If you have plenty of money, then go for the P85+ and all the goodies.

 

[N4HHE]

I haven't lost a speed race yet or come up short or been delayed from charging or not been able to go anywhere I didn't want to go or keep me from going 4000 miles up and down the west coast

Another excuse I found good enough for 85 kWh is that I am 183 to 220 miles (depending on the route) from my SC in Marietta. Expressed a bit of concern to my Delivery Specialist about my maiden voyage getting the car home and he insisted people drive that distance all the time without issue. Then again there are no SuperChargers any where near me, nor planned through 2015.

I would be hard for me to get a 60 kWh Model S home. Of course they will ship it, but whats the fun in that?

 

[Cal1]

I agree! Having mine for the last month I'd give up all other options before I'd move down in battery size. Once you start driving it and see just how cheap it is on a daily basis, you'll be climbing every chance you get. Then range will matter. I did't get it until I realized just how much it cost me to drive my ice vehicles. The reality of not buying gas every week or so (lack of gas receipts to put in the check book) really hits home after the purchase. This is one time where bigger is better!

 

[Pax Omnibus]

Considering the large amount of money you are paying for a Tesla Model S, get the 85 KWH battery instead of the 60 KWH battery. It is only $10,000 more base price. Also, the 85 KWH Tesla Model S comes with a couple of options standard that the 60 KWH Tesla doesn't have. One, you get the Michelin 19 inch tires that give you an extra 3% driving range, a total of 8 extra miles, on the 85 KWH Tesla. This is a $1,000 extra option on the 60 KWH Tesla. Also, the 85 KWH Tesla comes standard with the supercharger plug, if you want to avail yourself of Tesla or other DC fast chargers, especially on long road trips. This is a $2,000 option on the 60 KWH model. When you add these two options onto the 60kwh Tesla Model S, that is a total difference of only $7,000 between the two models on a car you are paying a lot for to begin with. When you add in the 3% extra miles Michelin tires, you get an EPA range of 273 miles in the 85 KWH Tesla Model S, versus 214 miles for the 60 KWH Model S. For an extra $7,000 in price, you get an extra 59 miles in total range. That is a lot of extra range, worth it in my opinion for only an extra $7,000, considering you are paying a lot of money for the car to begin with. Less than 30% of Tesla Model S cars are ordered with the 60 KWH battery, I have read. The large mileage difference, and minimal difference in cost, seems to be why most people opt for the 85 KWH Tesla Model S instead of the 60 KWH model S. I am not a Tesla owner presently, but I am looking into the possibility of one day becoming one, once I can afford it. The above information is based on my research of the Tesla Model S internet sales site. Also, the 85 KWH Tesla Model S has a better battery warranty, 8 years unlimited miles versus 8 years 125,000 miles for the 60 KWH Model S. Also, the 85 KWH Model S is a faster car, with more horsepower and more torque than the 60 KWH Model S. You will also obtain a higher resale value with the 85 KWH Model S versus the 60 KWH Model S, all other options being equal. All the other options are the same price, regardless of which battery Model S you choose. In summary, the 85 KWH Tesla Model S is a much better value than the 60 KWH Model S, all things considered, for only an extra $7,000.

 

[Ocelot]

Considering the large amount of money you are paying for a Tesla Model S, get the 85 KWH battery instead of the 60 KWH battery. It is only $10,000 more base price. Also, the 85 KWH Tesla Model S comes with a couple of options standard that the 60 KWH Tesla doesn't have. One, you get the Michelin 19 inch tires that give you an extra 3% driving range, a total of 8 extra miles, on the 85 KWH Tesla. This is a $1,000 extra option on the 60 KWH Tesla. Also, the 85 KWH Tesla comes standard with the supercharger plug, if you want to avail yourself of Tesla or other DC fast chargers, especially on long road trips. This is a $2,000 option on the 60 KWH model. When you add these two options onto the 60kwh Tesla Model S, that is a total difference of only $7,000 between the two models on a car you are paying a lot for to begin with. When you add in the 3% extra miles Michelin tires, you get an EPA range of 273 miles in the 85 KWH Tesla Model S, versus 214 miles for the 60 KWH Model S. For an extra $7,000 in price, you get an extra 59 miles in total range. That is a lot of extra range, worth it in my opinion for only an extra $7,000, considering you are paying a lot of money for the car to begin with. Less than 30% of Tesla Model S cars are ordered with the 60 KWH battery, I have read. The large mileage difference, and minimal difference in cost, seems to be why most people opt for the 85 KWH Tesla Model S instead of the 60 KWH model S. I am not a Tesla owner presently, but I am looking into the possibility of one day becoming one, once I can afford it. The above information is based on my research of the Tesla Model S internet sales site. Also, the 85 KWH Tesla Model S has a better battery warranty, 8 years unlimited miles versus 8 years 125,000 miles for the 60 KWH Model S. Also, the 85 KWH Model S is a faster car, with more horsepower and more torque than the 60 KWH Model S. You will also obtain a higher resale value with the 85 KWH Model S versus the 60 KWH Model S, all other options being equal. All the other options are the same price, regardless of which battery Model S you choose. In summary, the 85 KWH Tesla Model S is a much better value than the 60 KWH Model S, all things considered, for only an extra $7,000.

that is some really great analysis.

 

[roblab]

Considering the large amount of money you are paying for a Tesla Model S, get the 85 KWH battery instead of the 60 KWH battery. It is only $10,000 more base price. Also, the 85 KWH Tesla Model S comes with a couple of options standard that the 60 KWH Tesla doesn't have. One, you get the Michelin 19 inch tires that give you an extra 3% driving range, a total of 8 extra miles, on the 85 KWH Tesla. This is a $1,000 extra option on the 60 KWH Tesla. Also, the 85 KWH Tesla comes standard with the supercharger plug, if you want to avail yourself of Tesla or other DC fast chargers, especially on long road trips. This is a $2,000 option on the 60 KWH model. When you add these two options onto the 60kwh Tesla Model S, that is a total difference of only $7,000 between the two models on a car you are paying a lot for to begin with. When you add in the 3% extra miles Michelin tires, you get an EPA range of 273 miles in the 85 KWH Tesla Model S, versus 214 miles for the 60 KWH Model S. For an extra $7,000 in price, you get an extra 59 miles in total range. That is a lot of extra range, worth it in my opinion for only an extra $7,000, considering you are paying a lot of money for the car to begin with. Less than 30% of Tesla Model S cars are ordered with the 60 KWH battery, I have read. The large mileage difference, and minimal difference in cost, seems to be why most people opt for the 85 KWH Tesla Model S instead of the 60 KWH model S. I am not a Tesla owner presently, but I am looking into the possibility of one day becoming one, once I can afford it. The above information is based on my research of the Tesla Model S internet sales site. Also, the 85 KWH Tesla Model S has a better battery warranty, 8 years unlimited miles versus 8 years 125,000 miles for the 60 KWH Model S. Also, the 85 KWH Model S is a faster car, with more horsepower and more torque than the 60 KWH Model S. You will also obtain a higher resale value with the 85 KWH Model S versus the 60 KWH Model S, all other options being equal. All the other options are the same price, regardless of which battery Model S you choose. In summary, the 85 KWH Tesla Model S is a much better value than the 60 KWH Model S, all things considered, for only an extra $7,000.

Dang again! Here I paid extra for a Signature, and I got Goodyears. I never knew Michelins were standard. I had never heard they gave 3% better mileage. I pump my Goodyears up to 48 lb as recommended, and I get over 300 miles per charge, easily and often. Mayhaps the difference is in the speed of the car? There's an 8% difference in range just going from 65 to 70.

In my mind, the important thing is how far do you want to go? Are you going to be hampered with 25% less range? I live 30 miles from town, and with my old EV, 100 mile range was just not quite enough, too often for comfort. Many times it simply meant I couldn't take the EV. As it is, we take the S everywhere and are selling our Prius. So much for range issues. For me, there was no other choice: Get the 85.

 

[jerry33]

Dang again! Here I paid extra for a Signature, and I got Goodyears. I never knew Michelins were standard. I had never heard they gave 3% better mileage. I pump my Goodyears up to 48 lb as recommended, and I get over 300 miles per charge, easily and often. Mayhaps the difference is in the speed of the car? There's an 8% difference in range just going from 65 to 70.

Michelin only became standard a short while ago.

I actually got better range (about 15 Wh/mile) from the Goodyears that I just replaced. However, the Michelin Primacy MXM4 don't skip during an off camber turn the way the Goodyears did--which was kind of scary. The Michelins stay planted.

3% is effectively the same as zero due to uncontrollable variables, so I wouldn't sweat the difference.

 

[Chas F]

Someone early on in this thread suggested that many MS60 owners regret not getting the MS85. I haven't seen much evidence of this. I have seen only a couple say they would do it differently a second time. The majority of MS60 comments I've seen say they are happy with their choice. This has also been my experience. I realize there is only a $7K difference between the 60 and 85, but for my budget, $7K is not peanuts and I haven't had one instance of regret.
I enjoy my selected options on a daily basis much more than any additional range would have provided. This was a good trade-off for me.
My daily commute is about 40 miles and even with the unexpected increase in weekend driving, I have always had enough range to meet my needs.
As others have stated, the additional performance is neglible. I haven't had the feeling of "wish I had a little more speed".
I feel I would be lugging around an additional $7K of unused battery capacity had I gone for the 85.

Of course, no one regrets getting an 85 but not many regret getting the 60 either.

Caveats: 1) I live in Florida so no cold temp concerns. 2) I plan on keeping the car for 10+ years (and then maybe upgrade the battery) so no resale concerns 3) Expect only 1-2 long trips per year. Expected Supercharger locations should support those with no problem.

 

[yobigd20]

I pump my Goodyears up to 48 lb as recommended, and I get over 300 miles per charge, easily and often.

48? The recommended is 45, not 48. Where did you get 48 from? Overinflating may cause the center treads to wear faster.

 

[jerry33]

48? The recommended is 45, not 48. Where did you get 48 from? Overinflating may cause the center treads to wear faster.

That was true with bias-ply tires. It's only true in radial tires if the tire has a small crown radius. Unfortunately, this has been carried forward from the bias-ply tire days.

Overinflation is setting the cold pressure to more than the maximum inflation pressure on the sidewall. Adjusting pressure to suit conditions is not overinflation.

 

[Btrflyl8e]

Someone early on in this thread suggested that many MS60 owners regret not getting the MS85. I haven't seen much evidence of this. I have seen only a couple say they would do it differently a second time. The majority of MS60 comments I've seen say they are happy with their choice. This has also been my experience. I realize there is only a $7K difference between the 60 and 85, but for my budget, $7K is not peanuts and I haven't had one instance of regret.
I enjoy my selected options on a daily basis much more than any additional range would have provided. This was a good trade-off for me.
My daily commute is about 40 miles and even with the unexpected increase in weekend driving, I have always had enough range to meet my needs.
As others have stated, the additional performance is neglible. I haven't had the feeling of "wish I had a little more speed".
I feel I would be lugging around an additional $7K of unused battery capacity had I gone for the 85.

Of course, no one regrets getting an 85 but not many regret getting the 60 either.

Caveats: 1) I live in Florida so no cold temp concerns. 2) I plan on keeping the car for 10+ years (and then maybe upgrade the battery) so no resale concerns 3) Expect only 1-2 long trips per year. Expected Supercharger locations should support those with no problem.

As I was reading this I thought "wait, is this MY post?" LOL

Ditto all of this, including the caveats! I even grew up in Orlando...

 

[lloyds]

I too had this dilemma, but after taking delivery half a yr ago and over 10k miles, there were countless moments where I'm glad I had the extra range. Do it if it is doable for you financially

 

[David Rhee]

If you like to drive at 75-80mph, the range on a 85 is at right around 200 miles. 60 will be correspondingly less. Get the 85 without the frills on the options. You won't regret it.

 

[bwilliams]

I just placed an order yesterday for the 60. I am a LEAF owner and mostly wanted a little extra range. Another 50 miles would have done it for me so getting more than double the range with the tesla is actually overkill. Interesting to me, the sales guy said LEAF owners almost always get the 60 because they have enough experience with electric cars to know that there is more than enough range with the 60. He expects sales for the 60 to increase once people become more comfortable with electric cars. If you are a performance-oriented driver who likes to drive a lot then maybe the 85 makes sense - but for the average commuter who doesn't think driving hundreds of miles just to drive is much fun then I'm confident the 60 is more than enough.