how can we encourage tesla to give better audible alert of AP status: full, distance keeping, or off

[marcmerlin]

If someone can help me push this to Elon/tesla or whatever best channels outside of reporting it to tesla tech support who told me they agreed and had gotten people asking for the same, that would be appreciated:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1709650113386389781

I'm a pilot, I know about automation in planes and/or the issue of two pilots flying all the way to things like the fatal crash of AF447 and others, or none flying each thinking the other one is, causing other obvious problems, or misunderstanding of what parts of plane automation are still active, or not, from autopilot to autothrottles or autobrakes and so forth. Each have caused deaths and aviation has taken those seriously by making it more and more clear who is doing what, or not

In the meantime, Tesla has a few beeps, which can be missed, and weird modes like AP lane following disengages but distance following is still on, making you think the car is still driving, but not really, or being able to engage distance following hoping that lane keeping is on too, but it's not.
The little icon on the top of the screen is useless, sorry, you're not looking at that when you're supposed to be looking out the window.
I've even had problems where I had AP on and thought it was in FSD mode, but it was not, so it drove straight and missed turns. Not a true safety issue, but annoying nonetheless.
And it gets worse, I've had one day when I tried to enable AP, it didn't but I thought it did. It apparently did enable distance control, so it put on gas, but wasn't steering. I let it do its thing, and when it got to the side of the lane, corrected thanks the setting I had turned on for that, at the time I do not think I got the loud alert that it had just saved my ass, and it then failed to do it again, and drove off the lane. Yes, I was tired that day, yes I could (should?) have been able to know at all times what mode it's really in, but guess what, I'm not perfect every single day, and you probably aren't either

What the car really needs is very obvious "autopilot on" or "FSD on", "lane keeping off", "AP off" alerts. Yes, it might be slightly annoying, but it's definitely better than having to have an audio decoder ring to know what sound means what.
Again, in planes, certified pilots have gotten confused between the stall alarm and the gear up alarm, and have landed planes without gear down, wrecking the plane, because it wasn't clear which sound was what.

Yes, I understand some people will hate the audio alerts, and I propose for this to be a setting that drivers who know better (good on them), can turn off, and then they'll have no one to blame if they make a mistake one day.

How does that sound?

 

[Supcom]

Keep your hands on the wheel. No resistance = no autosteer.

 

[zoomer0056]

If someone can help me push this to Elon/tesla or whatever best channels outside of reporting it to tesla tech support who told me they agreed and had gotten people asking for the same, that would be appreciated:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1709650113386389781

I'm a pilot, I know about automation in planes and/or the issue of two pilots flying all the way to things like the fatal crash of AF447 and others, or none flying each thinking the other one is, causing other obvious problems, or misunderstanding of what parts of plane automation are still active, or not, from autopilot to autothrottles or autobrakes and so forth. Each have caused deaths and aviation has taken those seriously by making it more and more clear who is doing what, or not

In the meantime, Tesla has a few beeps, which can be missed, and weird modes like AP lane following disengages but distance following is still on, making you think the car is still driving, but not really, or being able to engage distance following hoping that lane keeping is on too, but it's not.
The little icon on the top of the screen is useless, sorry, you're not looking at that when you're supposed to be looking out the window.
I've even had problems where I had AP on and thought it was in FSD mode, but it was not, so it drove straight and missed turns. Not a true safety issue, but annoying nonetheless.
And it gets worse, I've had one day when I tried to enable AP, it didn't but I thought it did. It apparently did enable distance control, so it put on gas, but wasn't steering. I let it do its thing, and when it got to the side of the lane, corrected thanks the setting I had turned on for that, at the time I do not think I got the loud alert that it had just saved my ass, and it then failed to do it again, and drove off the lane. Yes, I was tired that day, yes I could (should?) have been able to know at all times what mode it's really in, but guess what, I'm not perfect every single day, and you probably aren't either

What the car really needs is very obvious "autopilot on" or "FSD on", "lane keeping off", "AP off" alerts. Yes, it might be slightly annoying, but it's definitely better than having to have an audio decoder ring to know what sound means what.
Again, in planes, certified pilots have gotten confused between the stall alarm and the gear up alarm, and have landed planes without gear down, wrecking the plane, because it wasn't clear which sound was what.

Yes, I understand some people will hate the audio alerts, and I propose for this to be a setting that drivers who know better (good on them), can turn off, and then they'll have no one to blame if they make a mistake one day.

How does that sound?

Autopilot is a group of features. Two of which are Traffic Aware Cruise Control (TACC) and Autosteer. For my Feb 2022 MSLR without FSD or EAP, you can set it up so that one thumb wheel click enables TACC, and two clicks enable Autosteer. To be sure which feature is active, engage one and listen for alert, engage the other and listen for alert. Then look at indicators on the screen to be sure.

If it's hard to look at the screen, a co-pilot might help. I got a co-pilot when I got married. She's very good and very attentive. She tells me when the light changes, what to do at a stop sign and when to use the turn signal. Very convenient.

 

[E90alex]

IDK it’s pretty clear to me.

Plus with Autopilot and even FSD beta you’re supposed to have your hands on the wheel and paying attention at all times. There should never be a situation where Autosteer suddenly disengages and the driver is caught off guard and not ready or prepared to steer.

 

[dansev]

I was just thinking this exact same thing. I’m 90,000 miles into my M3. At least 80% of those miles have been on autopilot. There have been a number of times—not an insignificant number—when I thought auto pilot was on, but only TACC was enabled. This has led to some scary moments. And then there have been other times where I thought nothing was on, but TACC was on, causing unexpected speed ups which can also be scary.

I was literally just thinking the same thing today: there needs to be much better feedback on what is enabled, and what is not. Absolutely agree, 100%.

 

[EV_Travels]

There's enough beeps already - the blue steering wheel icon works for me.

 

[uscbucsfan]

I was just thinking this exact same thing. I’m 90,000 miles into my M3. At least 80% of those miles have been on autopilot. There have been a number of times—not an insignificant number—when I thought auto pilot was on, but only TACC was enabled. This has led to some scary moments. And then there have been other times where I thought nothing was on, but TACC was on, causing unexpected speed ups which can also be scary.

I was literally just thinking the same thing today: there needs to be much better feedback on what is enabled, and what is not. Absolutely agree, 100%.

I like in the MS/X you can disable TACC personally. I would do it in my MY if I could.

 

[zoomer0056]

when I thought auto pilot was on, but only TACC was enabled

TACC is one feature of AP. If TACC is on, AP is on.

 

[dansev]

TACC is one feature of AP. If TACC is on, AP is on.

Not really sure what you mean. You can have TACC on, and no lane keep assist. To me, TACC plus lane keep assist = autopilot. Anyway, the pain is, if you think you're driving, completely manually, but TACC is on, you can have sudden accelerations that are surprising and sometimes quite jarring which could be dangerous. And the only visual feedback this is happening is subtle and easy to overlook.

 

[zoomer0056]

Not really sure what you mean.

You were saying:

when I thought auto pilot was on, but only TACC was enabled.

AP is on if TACC is engaged. You're incorrectly implying that AP can be off while TACC is on. TACC is one feature of AP. You might be confusing Autosteer as AP. However, Autosteer is also just one feature of AP.

 

[Max Spaghetti]

You're talking to a pilot. TACC is auto-throttle/auto-thrust (Boeing/Airbus). Autopilot is steering and navigation.

 

[OxBrew]

I've had mode confusion several times. I agree it should be clearer which is enabled, but especially which is disabled.

I have a curve AP cannot handle on a street near me. I have to take over by jerking the wheel to stay in the lane. Every time, TACC stays on, and every time, it surprises me on the next corner when I lift the throttle and the car does not slow. You would think I would learn, but I don't. It's sort of not unsafe, I just flick up the stalk to disable.

Anyway, I've trained myself to always look for the lane lines to turn blue on the display when I engage lane keeping. If Tesla won't make it clear, I need to be double sure of what is going on.

This is a stop gap I use because I have to. Tesla has failed to make this really clear. On top of that, the engagement beeps volume is inconsistent. Sometimes it's really quiet, sometimes loud enough. That's just horrible implementation, and Tesla needs to be held accountable for irresponsible software development.

They could easily create a longer dramatic transition sound and animation with flashing colors when AP is about to engage, like the sound of Dolby Theater at the start of a movie, plus some fun inverted color sequence and color fade like a sunset or something. No one would miss that.

 

[diplomat33]

My proposal:

• Replace the blue wheel icon with the words "AUTOPILOT ON" when you are in full AP mode or "TACC ON" when in cruise control mode or "MANUAL DRIVING" when nothing is on.
• Have option of voice alert that says "autopilot is on" and "autopilot is off".

 

[E90alex]

This is a problem of not having a drivers display. If there was a drivers display you could more easily see in your peripheral vision what is engaged. The center screen is too far out of line of sight and you have to deliberately turn to look at it.

There is the setting of “always rainbows” in the toybox which turns the road into a rainbow road whenever autosteer is engaged. That makes it more apparent in your peripheral vision.

 

[beachmiles]

I rarely/never use basic cruise control and suspect most do not as well. Sometimes the car misses my 2nd click on the stalk and I'm not in autopilot like I thought I was which sucks.
I think there should be a setting to make autopilot be enabled with the first stalk press and maybe then bring up a menu on the screen if you want to switch to autosteer or autopilot with a large radio button above each option showing which is the current default mode allowing you to easily change.

 

[uscbucsfan]

I rarely/never use basic cruise control and suspect most do not as well. Sometimes the car misses my 2nd click on the stalk and I'm not in autopilot like I thought I was which sucks.
I think there should be a setting to make autopilot be enabled with the first stalk press and maybe then bring up a menu on the screen if you want to switch to autosteer or autopilot with a large radio button above each option showing which is the current default mode allowing you to easily change.

That's how it is on the MS/X. Theres an options for inee click activation for FSD, no TACC.

 

[legendsk]

I think a series of colored, reasonable bright, circles or dots at the top of the display would be the most useful, least annoying. Not hidden behind the steering wheel, (like when the car wakes up and all NHSTA symbols come on, carefully hidden behind the steering wheel), not tiny buried down at the bottom of the screen, not blinding bright and annoying - just reasonable little {dimmable} lights with a different position + color for each function, e.g., red = FSD, Yellow = AUTOPILOT, Blue = TACC, Green = Drive, Dark = Neutral, etc.

 

[Dewg]

There are also aftermarket screens that go behind the wheel on the dash. Some may offer better indication.

 

[Skateboardgolf]

When AP is engaged, it would be nice to have a highly-noticable change to the screen, such as like half of the screen inverts its colors, or changes to red/white like the BMW dashes years ago, or a wide colored border around the screen. The blue steering wheel icon is too small, IMHO.

 

[Supcom]

The car already notifies you FOUR ways when AP is engaged:

1. The small steering icon next to the speed display turns blue.
2. The lane lines in the visualization turn blue. If you are using FSD, there is a blue Path of Destruction displayed.
3. There are specific audio tones emitted. If AP does not engage, different tones are emitted.
4. The steering wheel becomes noticeably harder to turn.

How many MORE ways do you need? You can see it, hear it and feel it.