TMC is an independent, primarily volunteer organization that relies on ad revenue to cover its operating costs. Please consider whitelisting TMC on your ad blocker and becoming a Supporting Member. For more info: Support TMC

How does the Bio Weapon filter work?

Discussion in 'Model X: User Interface' started by tinkoo604, Mar 13, 2017.

  1. tinkoo604

    tinkoo604 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2017
    Messages:
    32
    Location:
    Vancouver
    Hey Guys

    I am curious to know how the bio weapon filter works in the MX. Does the filter only filters the air coming from out side or does it also filters the air with in the cabin. A few days ago, I order fast food and turned on the bio weapon to filter out the food odours but I couldn't tell if it was working or not. Any body have any clue on how it works?

    Thanks
     
  2. RichardD

    RichardD Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2017
    Messages:
    539
    Location:
    Texas
  3. BerTX

    BerTX Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2014
    Messages:
    3,505
    Location:
    Texas/Washington
    Filters outside air coming in at a high rate, blowing whatever unfiltered air inside the cabin out. You can't recirculate the inside air and just filter that. Basically filters the air and creates a slight pressure in the cabin to keep unfiltered outside air from leaking in.
     
    • Like x 1
  4. carteriii

    carteriii Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    99
    Location:
    San Juan Capistrano, CA
    Have you seen that posted/described anywhere or taken apart your S to know for certain? I ask for a couple reasons. First, when going into bioweapon defense mode, the system automatically selects the recirculation mode. Second, I've looked for any definitive source AND I've asked my service center who ultimately said they weren't even sure. I've seen the picture on these forums of the HEPA filter placement (just behind our frunk) but couldn't tell from the picture alone whether that was purely intake to the vehicle or also used in any recirculation. I also haven't been able to find any definitive source on how/where the smaller filter and carbon filters are used.

    You may be 100% right so please don't take offense at my questions. Too many others, including my SC, have speculated but later said they didn't really know so I'm just looking for something more certain. Thanks.
     
  5. Saghost

    Saghost Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2013
    Messages:
    8,186
    Location:
    Delaware
    It's not possible to build the positive pressure that Bioweapon strives for without outside air - you need more total air in the cabin than you had before.

    Because of this, Bioweapon can't use pure recirculation. Your post is the first suggestion I've seen that it might use any recirculation, and I still don't understand how that would be helpful to the goals of the operating mode.

    Where do you see it selecting recirculation? It's been a while since I used Bioweapon, but the way I remember it, it greyed out both outside and recirculate when I hit Bioweapon, which is on the same line.
     
    • Informative x 1
  6. ecarfan

    ecarfan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2013
    Messages:
    19,106
    Location:
    San Mateo, CA
    I agree. Elon has stated that Bioweapon mode creates positive pressure in the cabin. It has to draw a significant quantity of air into the cabin -- through the HEPA filter -- to achieve positive pressure. Just because the display shows recirculation as being "on" does not mean that no additional air is being brought into the cabin in Bioweapon mode.
     
  7. carteriii

    carteriii Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    99
    Location:
    San Juan Capistrano, CA
    I agree with the comments about positive pressure but I believe there's more to it than that. For example, can anyone definitively describe the path that air takes to go through the smaller air filter? Does *only* recirculated air go through the smaller filter or ??? When/How does the smaller filter come into play?

    Do people think that all the "dirty" air is simply pushed out of the car via positive pressure? Wouldn't it make more sense that SOME of the air inside the car also goes through the HEPA filter, via recirculation? Wouldn't that also explain the fan being on high when in bioweapon defense mode? That is purely speculation on my part, but I mention the possibility because it seems reasonable and I've still not seen anything which definitively describes how the different filters work together and which "path" air can take to go through any one or all filters.
     
  8. Saghost

    Saghost Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2013
    Messages:
    8,186
    Location:
    Delaware
    The cabin has normal exhaust vents designed into it (at the rear under the bumper,) and leaks at the seals. It's probably faster to clear the cabin by pushing air out through all of those than by recirculating the cabin air - especially since recirculating would lead to dead zones unless it is design very carefully.
     
  9. carteriii

    carteriii Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    99
    Location:
    San Juan Capistrano, CA
    You seem to be implying that you'll get fewer or no dead zones by just pushing air into random leaks at seals and/or explicit exhaust vents, and your use of "probably" also implies more speculation. Tesla has developed something fantastic here; I just wish they'd share a bit more of the details. One of these days I hope to get time with one of the technicians who might know for certain.
     
  10. BerTX

    BerTX Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2014
    Messages:
    3,505
    Location:
    Texas/Washington
    Reading the May 2, 2016 Tesla blog about the system, it looks like you may be right. (bolding is mine)

    " Inspired by the air filtration systems used in hospitals, clean rooms, and the space industry, we developed a HEPA filtration system capable of stripping the outside air of pollen, bacteria, and pollution before they enter the cabin and systematically scrubbing the air inside the cabin to eliminate any trace of these particles."
     
  11. lheifetz

    lheifetz Member

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2020
    Messages:
    6
    Location:
    Truckee, CA
    Does it make sense to turn on the Bioweapon mode when you first get into the cabin, leave it on for x number of minutes, then switch to recirculating mode?
     
  12. mxnym

    mxnym Member

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2018
    Messages:
    803
    Location:
    Bloomington, IN
    If you have bioweapon defense mode, all outside air is coming through the HEPA filter anyway. Turning on Bioweapon defense mode when you don't feel a need probably won't benefit you. That having been said, many people say recirc isn't necessarily advisable regardless, as the carbon dioxide you produce by breathing will build up. Regulations may reduce that by requiring some air to always come from the outside, but you'll also notice that Auto typically doesn't use recirc for some reason. On the flip side of that same coin, I'm told that recirc is used by Auto if you put the vehicle in Range Mode. This would seemingly support the argument that recirc isn't dangerous (regardless of whether or not one should consider the space between dangerous and healthy here).
     
  13. lheifetz

    lheifetz Member

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2020
    Messages:
    6
    Location:
    Truckee, CA
     
  14. lheifetz

    lheifetz Member

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2020
    Messages:
    6
    Location:
    Truckee, CA
    Thanks so much. Very helpful. What exactly does the bioweapon defense mode do if all the air is going through the HEPA filter anyway?
     
  15. mjptech

    mjptech Being cyberbullied by TMC users PhilDavid + DCEV

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2019
    Messages:
    449
    Location:
    Ventura
    For the most part, Bioweapon Mode is basically a "let's speed this filtration process up" - in extreme cases, such as entering a wildfire zone or smoke-filled area. It will help push the stale air away, like when you're on a plane.

    In the end, the filtration does what most vehicles do... it just includes a charcoal filter as well to help...
    Tesla “Bioweapon Defense Mode” As Effective as a 2010 Mazda?
     
  16. lheifetz

    lheifetz Member

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2020
    Messages:
    6
    Location:
    Truckee, CA
    Yes, that is what is happening right now in California. The smoke is terrible. So, it still seems to me that when we first enter the cabin, we could start with the bioweapon mode to “speed the filtration process up“. Then, after X number of minutes, we could turn it back to the auto mode. The question is, how many minutes?
     
  17. jtrevill

    jtrevill Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2020
    Messages:
    25
    Location:
    California
    When I turned mine on, I noticed the air volume coming from the vents was decreased. Fan was on high, just lower volume than when bioweapon turned off. Normal?
     
  18. mjptech

    mjptech Being cyberbullied by TMC users PhilDavid + DCEV

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2019
    Messages:
    449
    Location:
    Ventura
    Yes - when Bioweapon is turned on, it's combining air recirculation with fresh (or, whatever the outside air is), so the air volume goes down, even though the workload goes up (I believe some of the air is getting redirected before it hits the vents).

    Probably need to check with the air flow paths that were recently posted when someone's AC stopped blowing air in the X (I actually had this problem the past few weeks after my service update - no air flow in the rear center or the third row pillars - turned out they pinched the "snorkel" as they call it in the center console when replacing the USB ports)..
     
  19. jtrevill

    jtrevill Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2020
    Messages:
    25
    Location:
    California


    Yes, I was going to look into that as well - I noticed my used 2017 vents aren't working in the rear as I expect they should.
     
  20. mxnym

    mxnym Member

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2018
    Messages:
    803
    Location:
    Bloomington, IN
    What about this Elon Musk Twitter post? I understand that at one point some people put a HEPA filter in and got the service center to enable the feature, but that doesn't prove those items don't exist on vehicles where the upgrade was paid for (or perhaps even in early vehicles without the feature, like with the larger battery in the Model S 60). Also, having previously driven other vehicles with air filters that have carbon in the air filter, I can assure you that my Model X does FAR better than they ever did at dealing with sewage and skunk smells, which wouldn't necessarily be measured in many tests. This could be due to having an actual bed of carbon instead of just a thin layer on the filter, or it could be the work of these other components.
     

Share This Page

  • About Us

    Formed in 2006, Tesla Motors Club (TMC) was the first independent online Tesla community. Today it remains the largest and most dynamic community of Tesla enthusiasts. Learn more.
  • Do you value your experience at TMC? Consider becoming a Supporting Member of Tesla Motors Club. As a thank you for your contribution, you'll get nearly no ads in the Community and Groups sections. Additional perks are available depending on the level of contribution. Please visit the Account Upgrades page for more details.


    SUPPORT TMC