Started downloading as I was in the drive thru at Raising Cane's, debated whether to park after and wait in the car while it installs but then decided I'll just drive it tomorrow so I can eat my chicken while it's hot at home 
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Wiki MASTER THREAD: Actual FSD Beta downloads and experiences
- Thread starter jebinc
- Start date
I noticed the reduction in jerky steering as well, path line is still jumpy but maybe they are doing more filtering downstream. I didn't notice any random slowdowns besides falsely stopping at intersections where it has right of way, etc. Some new badness I never saw before... it stopped super late at this one-way stop sign, sticking out halfway into the traffic lane. Still can't handle flashing yellow left arrows, cruises up to the stop line like it's going to proceed through, then abruptly brakes at the last second.
It seems like the chill FSD profile now actually prevents it from making rolling stops, it actually zero'd out its speed at a 4-way stop with no traffic when it would ALWAYS roll through in 10.4.
It seems like the chill FSD profile now actually prevents it from making rolling stops, it actually zero'd out its speed at a 4-way stop with no traffic when it would ALWAYS roll through in 10.4.
Wow. Wow! I'm massively impressedMain reason is probably because the perception is currently not good/sure enough until the vehicle gets closer with a better view of the turn. Theoretically the neural networks with more training should be able to make the prediction earlier and more confidently resulting in a smooth turn, but at least right now, it's actually very important that FSD Beta makes these "real time" jerky corrections to its path.
There's a left turn where FSD Beta 10.x doesn't see the destination past the median until it is in the middle of the intersection, so it actually starts the turn aiming towards oncoming traffic to the left of the median. Here's a Google Street View of the turn except it's from a higher vantage point, which I believe also helps the Y take the turn better than the 3:
View attachment 734518
Similarly, right turns can get confused by bike lanes and/or parking lanes such as this turn that has both (and wife actually messaged me complaining about this just yesterday). And of course faded lines or those covered up by dirt/tire tracks are likely to confuse the perception:
View attachment 734519
with the 10.5 improvements and can't wait to test more during the daytime. Both the 2 above turns are consistently taken without much issue anymore probably due to "Improved static world predictions (road lines, edges, and lane connectivity) by up to 13% using a new static world auto-labeler and adding 165K auto-labeled videos."Overall visualizations are showing solid / confident lines and road edges ahead generally to the "vanishing edge" even at night, and I expect daytime driving to improve cross street visualization improvements with better visibility. These strong predictions from so far away probably allows for much better control with FSD Beta getting more seconds to plan instead of last-moment jerky reaction.
Huge congrats to the autolabeling folks!
Just took my initial drive on 10.5 and like many others have similarly said massive improvement. My early morning locate route (25 and 35 mph) is highly curved and there was virtually no phantom breaking, only a couple false turn singles on high curvature roads when in the past there were many, and only a few crossing the double yellow line. Most of these roads have no shoulders. Cross traffic was very limited but road turns were very smooth. A couple of occasional degraded camera warnings but no disengagement because of that. I am excited to try it out in traffic later and maybe not paranoid of being rear ended with, at least for these routes, phantom breaking almost gone or at least more obvious places where it will possibly occur.Wow. Wow! I'm massively impressed
Overall visualizations are showing solid / confident lines and road edges ahead generally to the "vanishing edge" even at night, and I expect daytime driving to improve cross street visualization improvements with better visibility. These strong predictions from so far away probably allows for much better control with FSD Beta getting more seconds to plan instead of last-moment jerky reaction.
Huge congrats to the autolabeling folks!
Quick drive. Mixed results
Good-
Good-
-Improved turning and lane alignment. Actually did a halfway decent turn into my street.
Bad- -Per usual came to a full stop entering the rotary. Once cars came up behind me I had to take over.
-Construction zone with cones. Simple reduction to 1 lane for 100 feet. Instant panic by FSD and Immediately told me to take over.
-@ T-intersection came to a full stop then crept and started to go. However once it realized it would go over the center line it stopped in the street.
Better to stop then hit the traffic coming the other way. Since FSD won't point the car to the right as it approaches the intersection the car cannot
make the turn on my side of the road. Every driver when they approach this type of an intersection will turn the car to the right as it approaches
the intersection.
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Same issue here, car stays full left when stopped for right turn at intersection. Cars approaching from behind me pull alongside to make their right turn while mine sits there signaling.
Woke up to the notification that 10.5 was ready to install. (It came in at 3am.)
I've only gone to the gym and back, 10-minute drive each way.
Good:
I've only gone to the gym and back, 10-minute drive each way.
Good:
- Steering wheel is much less jerky, especially when stopped waiting to turn. (Still some adjustments, but no WFT moments so far.)
- No random "phantom slowdowns" so far, even though the morning sun was definitely glaring.
- It only made the necessary lane changes, and made them well in advance of where it needed to turn.
- I held the wheel with a very light touch, and it never nagged me to apply more pressure. I'm guessing the cabin camera is doing the lion's share of checking for attentiveness now. I hope this is a step on the way to allowing hands-free driving.
- It still slowed down to 19mph for all the neighborhood speed humps, even though they stopped being visualized.
- It stops even further back for stop signs (and side streets) and doesn't creep enough to see before it commits to turns.
- I disengaged, crept forward, and re-engaged for an unprotected left from a center lane onto a side street. It picked a safe gap, and then went so slowly I had to push the accelerator to stay safe.
- It's gone back to riding more in the center of unlined neighborhood streets, like 10.3.1. (10.4 had gotten better about trying to stay in the right half.)
Quick drive in the morning. Some definitive observations:
Improvement on unmarked roads: car is noticeably away from center compared to 10.2-10.4.
Improvement finding the correct lane with short notice: avoids dedicated turn lanes when going straight. Appropriately goes to turning lane for a turn.
Improvement with steering wheel jitter on turns. Pretty smooth. Not as smooth as me, but getting there.
No change with slowing too early for stop signs. Creeps very slowly sometimes to make a simple right turn.
No change with gentle phantom braking for tree shadows.
Better detection of small rotaries in my neighborhood roads. It completed a problematic rotary for the first time ever.
Improvement on unmarked roads: car is noticeably away from center compared to 10.2-10.4.
Improvement finding the correct lane with short notice: avoids dedicated turn lanes when going straight. Appropriately goes to turning lane for a turn.
Improvement with steering wheel jitter on turns. Pretty smooth. Not as smooth as me, but getting there.
No change with slowing too early for stop signs. Creeps very slowly sometimes to make a simple right turn.
No change with gentle phantom braking for tree shadows.
Better detection of small rotaries in my neighborhood roads. It completed a problematic rotary for the first time ever.
10.5. 36.8.8 installing now..download was available at 23:10 PST.
IMO the root cause is having to stay perpendicular to the road. If FSD turns toward the right the front camera cannot adequately see to the left since the B pillar camera cannot see properly with a partially obstructed left side. By staying perpendicular and needing to creep the car HAS to cross the center yellow line to make the right turn.
I don't see how Tesla solves this without a camera closer to the front. Perhaps Tesla will just have to identify this turn as problematic and reroute the drive.
In my case the car was not crossing the double yellow line. It stayed left and the road was wide enough that cars pulled up alongside me (still perpendicular to the cross road) to make their right turn. My car did not move right until it creeped into the intersection prior to turning.
I actually noticed improvement in this regard. When leaving my subdivision (stop sign intersection with trees obscuring the view) the car now angles slightly as it approaches the stop sign so it has a better view. Under 10.4, it would remain perpendicular then execute a hard 90 degree turn.
My first 10.5 drive left me with the following observations:
Good:
Good:
- Stays to the right of unmarked roads much better than previous versions (opposite of @vanjwilson here).
- Starts slowing much sooner for stop lights (opposite of someone else's stop sign experience I couldn't find again, possibly on a previous page).
- Still cuts across oncoming lane when creeping from stop signs for left turns on unmarked roads.
- Propensity to hug/swerve toward/cross over double-yellow on narrow roads with no side lines seems worse.
This is a good point. Stop light slowing is very nice. But stop SIGN slowing is really off. It slows too early, and takes forever to get to the stop sign.
Stop sign experiences seem to be all over the board. I had it stop right where it theoretically should with a stop sign that is arguably too far from the intersection, but this was in a low speed subdivision. I also had it behave just like previous versions at another stop sign that is on a higher speed marked road. Others have indicated that it stops way before signs, and in one case someone indicated that it didn't get stopped until it was encroaching upon the crossing road.
My first impressions:
Good:
Bad:
Also noteworthy:
Overall:
10.5 is awesome! This is a massive step in the right direction. It addressed many of the worst problems of previous versions, and makes for a much more fun and comfortable drive than 10.4.
It just feels smarter.
Good:
- Much better at driving down my long curvy driveway. Previous versions were very slow, and had a lot of steering wheel hunting, and tended to try to drive onto the lawn at one point. 10.5's only issue was slowing and actually stopping at a narrow part until I pushed the accelerator a bit
- Much smoother lateral control in general. The steering wheel was fixed in place when driving straight.
- Doesn't steer wide of mailboxes anymore, and didn't hug the centerline to the point where it had to steer around every oncoming car like it had before
- Stayed more to the right when there was no painted centerline, and stayed somewhat right reaching a stop sign on that road (more right would be even better)
- Smooth speed control in general
- Better confidence in turns (far less swinging too wide on right turns, natural acceleration throughout turn once it commits)
- Very little phantom braking
Bad:
- Poor lane choices continue
- It started changing lanes to the left at the exact moment I expected to hear the blinker turn on for it to move to the right into a turn lane for an upcoming turn
- It entered a short left turn lane and wanted to go straight through the top of a T-intersection with no stop sign
- Tried to "block the box" (wanted to pull up to queue behind last car in line for a traffic light, but doing so would leave my car blocking another intersection)
- Nav route still included a left turn that's illegal during the time of day I was approaching it. I manually took another route, so I can't say if FSD would have actually taken the turn.
- Blinker control is still mediocre
- Failed to signal when changing into a turn lane
- Failed to signal when merging as it's lane ends
- In a parking lot, FSD signaled right and turned left at the end of an aisle
Also noteworthy:
- Skidded slightly on some unexpected ice during a right turn. It was only the slightest of slip, and I don't think I could have done it any better myself on that black ice (both in avoiding slipping and in maintaining control), but it still happened. FSD didn't beep or bail or anything - it just kept on driving
Overall:
10.5 is awesome! This is a massive step in the right direction. It addressed many of the worst problems of previous versions, and makes for a much more fun and comfortable drive than 10.4.
It just feels smarter.
coreylista
Member
Initial drive this morning on 10.5:
Overall the car seems to make more confident decisions, way less hesitation, hence less gas pedal intervention... whether they are correct or not is still a mix.
Good:
Navigated through multiple construction zones (cones forcing you into specific lanes (sometimes crossing lines and driving on top of them) and into the oncoming lane to get around the construction and then back into the regular lane. In this situation it was a million times better than it's ever been.
No random lane changing so far... (need more driving time for this one)
Still stopping a little too far behind most stop signs and still a little too far to the left if no yellow line, but the creeping forward is a LOT better, and once it decides to go, it goes much faster instead of a 2mph pace like before...
Bad:
Still seeing TONS of random slow downs. I believe I've recently been able to understand why it might be slowing down in most cases, (cars or people turning/crossing/not stopping at cross streets/or are angled oddly, where it might calculate that their current direction of travel could come into my lane) but today I saw nothing that would even come close to justifying an easing up on the gas.
One instance, the car in front of me came to a sudden stop, while FSD had plenty of time to stop (not following very closely) it decided to suddenly jerk the wheel to the left as if to either go around, or it thought it needed the extra room to stop? Either way I had to forcefully grab the wheel to stop it from completing whatever maneuver it was trying to attempt...
Turning into my office parking lot has never been a very graceful maneuver on any FSD version, but this morning it might have driven into a curb... I wasn't going to risk the chance of it hitting anything so I took over. I don't know if it would have actually hit the curb or not, but even after intervening I was a about 2 or 3 inches away...
Fingers crossed the next drive will be better!
EDIT:
Also on more narrow roads (like a few older streets in my neighborhood), it seems to really want to stay in the center now... but on roads that are of a typical width of a proper 2 lane road, even without a center yellow line, it definitely stays more to the right like it should... so maybe it has to do with the overall width of the road?
Overall the car seems to make more confident decisions, way less hesitation, hence less gas pedal intervention... whether they are correct or not is still a mix.
Good:
Navigated through multiple construction zones (cones forcing you into specific lanes (sometimes crossing lines and driving on top of them) and into the oncoming lane to get around the construction and then back into the regular lane. In this situation it was a million times better than it's ever been.
No random lane changing so far... (need more driving time for this one)
Still stopping a little too far behind most stop signs and still a little too far to the left if no yellow line, but the creeping forward is a LOT better, and once it decides to go, it goes much faster instead of a 2mph pace like before...
Bad:
Still seeing TONS of random slow downs. I believe I've recently been able to understand why it might be slowing down in most cases, (cars or people turning/crossing/not stopping at cross streets/or are angled oddly, where it might calculate that their current direction of travel could come into my lane) but today I saw nothing that would even come close to justifying an easing up on the gas.
One instance, the car in front of me came to a sudden stop, while FSD had plenty of time to stop (not following very closely) it decided to suddenly jerk the wheel to the left as if to either go around, or it thought it needed the extra room to stop? Either way I had to forcefully grab the wheel to stop it from completing whatever maneuver it was trying to attempt...
Turning into my office parking lot has never been a very graceful maneuver on any FSD version, but this morning it might have driven into a curb... I wasn't going to risk the chance of it hitting anything so I took over. I don't know if it would have actually hit the curb or not, but even after intervening I was a about 2 or 3 inches away...
Fingers crossed the next drive will be better!
EDIT:
Also on more narrow roads (like a few older streets in my neighborhood), it seems to really want to stay in the center now... but on roads that are of a typical width of a proper 2 lane road, even without a center yellow line, it definitely stays more to the right like it should... so maybe it has to do with the overall width of the road?
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Yeah you're right about the inconsistency with stop signs. But def see less inconsistency with stopping for red lights. On 10.5, so far the stopping at a light is near perfect, using regen the entire way.
Excellent. My problem is the B-pillar doesn't have a clear view to the left and IMO the only way FSD can see to the left is to stay perpendicular and creep but that requires a hard 90 degree turn. However there isn't enough road space to avoid crossing the center line and at this intersection FSD will proceed with traffic coming from the right and then has to stop in the road. When that happens I just have to take over early and do the turn myself.
I still have the basic question of how far to the left & right can the front cameras see? 90 degrees, more than 90 or less than 90? Does anyone know?
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