Model S price justification (why so expensive?)

[shokunin]

Don't be upset. . I likeTesla. To be more precise, I like the idea of 100% electric car. So far I am not very happy with implementation. OK. It's fast. But it must be fast by definition - it has electrical motor. And it very difficult to impress me with fast car. My personal car sequence in last 10 years: E55 AMG, SL 500, BMW M5 and now 911. Sorry, I just love fast German cars.
I'm just trying to understand for myself: why the car which in terms of luxury is so behind is so expensive? I've got used to some standards in luxury cars and I want to understand if very questionable advantage of electrical power overweights obvious lack of basic luxury options - sports seats, seat ventilation, storage space (luxury?), memory seats, heating steering wheel... Not talking about absence of modern safety features. If I'm about spending about $70000 I must be sure that I do it for reason other than "just cool". It's cool, no doubts. And?

Honestly, you have to drive it to understand the enthusiasm behind the S. Did you get a test drive on the recent Get-Amped tour in Los Angeles? It is fast, but it's really the acceleration that gets you going. It's like a roller coaster that maxes out at 40mph. I's not the speed but the g-forces that make the ride. The model S provides some outstanding G-forces in acceleration. Instantaneous acceleration the millisecond the pedal is pressed and keeps going without any shifting.

Not going to disagree that there are still some compromises in luxury features and safety amenities in the current price range. Only you can decide if those shortcomings are worth the price. There are features only the Model S will have vs the comparable cars and vice versa. To justify the price differential is personal decision.

Tesla's a young company that needs to profit in order to fund new R&D, payback it's government loans and provide shareholder value. It's all about free market and it's priced where it believes the market will accept. It's priced just high enough to be a rather unique vehicle for some time if that appeals to you.

 

[clmason]

AlexSV,
With the Model S you are paying for cutting edge technology. The features you listed that the Model S lacks are luxury options. Model S is not a luxury car. Simple as that.

 

[AlexSV]

Actually, yes. I just signed a 20-year lease with Solar City. The zero-down option basically means immediate break-even. It will supply 115-125% of my energy consumption including 80 miles worth of charging a day.

Cool. Me too. Moreover, they finished the installation the day before yesterday. But it wasn't for free, I have to tell you. Upfront 20 years lease costs me $9K. Your system is probably even more expensive. The same as you payed for your gas upfront.

 

[c2tb]

I think this is an interesting thread and reflects the diversity of Tesla enthusiasts and their reasons for being willing to purchase a Model S. The plain truth is that for less than $50K (Im being generous) you can purchase a brand new vehicly that has 99% of the functional capacity of any car more expensive than that. Of course that excludes specialty cars with bullet proof glass, smoke screens etc but I giess that doesnt represent function capacity. With that in mind any body purchasing a car for more than that amount cannot be justified from a purely practical standpoint. Every one who spends more than that will have their own personal reasons to justify the additional expense. It is illogical to try to tell one who finds a value in the beauty of a Picaso that their choice is a poor one.
One may decide that environmental concerns drive their decision or that the love the beauty or the novelty of the car. Some may quote the unique driving experience.
For me its a little of all of the above. First and foremost I believe in climate change and the role humans play and so I believe anything I can do to lower my carbon foot print is doing my part. I also believe in evil big oil and the efforts they will go through to thwart any efforts for this technology to survive. It pains me to see how much they can get away with and how duped we are to continue to supprt them. The only way for this technology to get over the hump is for early adopters to take the relative risk necessary to reach critical mass so that the infrastructure necessary to make it practical will be built. Lastly, I flat out love the beauty, elegance, power, performance and cutting edge technology of Model S. All of those factors have a value to me for which I am willing to pay $100K

 

[AlexSV]

Honestly, you have to drive it to understand the enthusiasm behind the S. Did you get a test drive on the recent Get-Amped tour in Los Angeles? It is fast, but it's really the acceleration that gets you going. It's like a roller coaster that maxes out at 40mph. I's not the speed but the g-forces that make the ride. The model S provides some outstanding G-forces in acceleration. Instantaneous acceleration the millisecond the pedal is pressed and keeps going without any shifting.

Not going to disagree that there are still some compromises in luxury features and safety amenities in the current price range. Only you can decide if those shortcomings are worth the price. There are features only the Model S will have vs the comparable cars and vice versa. To justify the price differential is personal decision.

Tesla's a young company that needs to profit in order to fund new R&D, payback it's government loans and provide shareholder value. It's all about free market and it's priced where it believes the market will accept. It's priced just high enough to be a rather unique vehicle for some time if that appeals to you.

I drove Model S. I like Model S. It's only one reason why I'm still here. But I'm not sure yet that I like it enough to buy. I understand Teslas' problems. Unfortunately I'm not American Reserve. I don't print money.

 

[dsm363]

Here's a counterpoint. 5K is plenty serious to me, and I'll be getting the base model S, my only option will probably be blue paint. At 50K after rebate it's already twice what I've paid for my current car in 1999 dollars.

At 50K I'll have essentially the same 100K car. By the time the "Porsche 911 or BMW M5 or E63 AMG or S550" has had its head gaskets, timing belt (plus tensioner), distributor, oxygen sensors, exhaust system and water pump replaced, I will buy a new battery (for a lot less than it costs now) and I will have quite nearly the same performance & range of that 100k Tesla.

-A

Excellent point. Congrats on your reservation if you've already locked it in. I'd consider the tech package too since I don't think they should sell the car without it but they were trying to hit a price point.

 

[sp4rk]

Sorry, I don't believe a word AlexSV says.

Clearly English is not first language, even though "he" suggests he is from California.

You are all being wound up ... by a naysayer.

Each round he comes up with a new argument.

Sure admins can see his IP address and I'll put my $5k on the table (scratch that, $1) to suggest the country!

 

[dsm363]

I drove Model S. I like Model S. It's only one reason why I'm still here. But I'm not sure yet that I like it enough to buy. I understand Teslas' problems. Unfortunately I'm not American Reserve. I don't print money.

I'm sure you realize this but you are paying a certain early adopter penalty with the Model S. Even though it is more mature than the Roadster it still is basically Tesla's first car. You need to think of this more as a $60,000 car than a $100,000 car since the battery is such a big percentage of the cost to make the car. A well optioned 85 kWh car is around $83,000 so less than the 100k+ you quoted (that would be performance Signature models). You're paying to be free from gas which is awesome. I've had my Roadster since Dec. 2010 and can't ever see buying another gas car again. If I do, it would be a used car to keep in the garage for the occasional really long trip (at most once a year) but would probably just rent in that case anyway. Since you live in California, you're lucky since the Supercharger network will be much better there than probably anywhere in the US to start.

 

[smoothoperator]

Sorry, I don't believe a word AlexSV says.

Clearly English is not first language, even though "he" suggests he is from California.

You are all being wound up ... by a naysayer.

Each round he comes up with a new argument.

Sure admins can see his IP address and I'll put my $5k on the table (scratch that, $1) to suggest the country!

Canada?

 

[jbherman]

Sorry, I don't believe a word AlexSV says.

Clearly English is not first language, even though "he" suggests he is from California.

You are all being wound up ... by a naysayer.

Each round he comes up with a new argument.

Sure admins can see his IP address and I'll put my $5k on the table (scratch that, $1) to suggest the country!

I have to agree with sp4rk. I find it a bit fishy that AlexSV just joined this board about 2 weeks ago. To me, this smells like a board "troll." Maybe it's just a language barrier issue...maybe it's all just a joke.

The sum of it is that no matter how much money you have, this is an expensive purchase. It's a personal decision for each of us. We all have different reasons for wanting or not wanting to move forward. I don't think that Tesla needs to justify their price point. That's for each individual consumer to decide. If Tesla prices themselves out of the market, they'll find out soon enough. Honestly, for many reasons, this is kind of a "stupid" purchase for me, despite the fact that I can afford it. I just can't seem to help myself (especially after the test drive)! I keep finding ways to rationalize the whole situation!

 

[ophthodawg]

AlexSV,

welcome to the forum, this is an interesting thread for sure. I respect your opinion but wondering what your level of exposure to the Model S has been. I may have overlooked this while reading the comments... have you had the opportunity to drive the car? If not, then I suggest you do so, i think you will be impressed.

I drove it at the Palo Alto "Get Amped" event this past weekend and the car was superb in its driving dynamics and solid feel (vault like). I agree that some fiddly (read: fit and finish) details need to get sorted but what Tesla has accomplished thus far is nothing short of astonishing (in a good way).

If you appreciate the engineering of a Porsche (as I do) I can't understand how you can overlook Tesla's design/engineering achievement with the Model S.

Admittedly I am drinking the Tesla cool-aid but I appreciate their disruptive mind set and engineering acumen, so far they appear to be delivering...

 

[Jeeps17]

Canada?

I resent that !

Pick on someone your own size !

:biggrin:

 

[jerry33]

I resent that !

Pick on someone your own size !

:biggrin:

Isn't Canada larger than any country other than Russia?:smile:

 

[brianman]

OK. It's fast. But it must be fast by definition - it has electrical motor.

Can you please point me to another consumer vehicle that is "fast" and "has an electrical motor" and is available for purchase -- not in a trial market -- throughout the U.S.? I'm honestly curious if there are any. I haven't found any without the "T" badge.

 

[ckessel]

Clearly English is not first language, even though "he" suggests he is from California.

All other items aside, I find this somewhat offensive and xenophobic. Just because someone doesn't have English as their native tongue doesn't mean they can't currently live in Los Angeles (or any US location for that matter).

Just had to get that off my chest.

 

[sp4rk]

All other items aside, I find this somewhat offensive and xenophobic. Just because someone doesn't have English as their native tongue doesn't mean they can't currently live in Los Angeles (or any US location for that matter).

Just had to get that off my chest.

It was not meant that way ... I am a bloody foreigner! Guess where from? So hardly xenophobic!

 

[AlexSV]

Sorry, I don't believe a word AlexSV says.

Clearly English is not first language, even though "he" suggests he is from California.

You are all being wound up ... by a naysayer.

Each round he comes up with a new argument.

Sure admins can see his IP address and I'll put my $5k on the table (scratch that, $1) to suggest the country!

You are right. English is not my first language. Not even the second.

 

[AlexSV]

I have to agree with sp4rk. I find it a bit fishy that AlexSV just joined this board about 2 weeks ago. To me, this smells like a board "troll." Maybe it's just a language barrier issue...maybe it's all just a joke.

The sum of it is that no matter how much money you have, this is an expensive purchase. It's a personal decision for each of us. We all have different reasons for wanting or not wanting to move forward. I don't think that Tesla needs to justify their price point. That's for each individual consumer to decide. If Tesla prices themselves out of the market, they'll find out soon enough. Honestly, for many reasons, this is kind of a "stupid" purchase for me, despite the fact that I can afford it. I just can't seem to help myself (especially after the test drive)! I keep finding ways to rationalize the whole situation!

Same here. . Absolutely stupid purchase but very nice car. Debating. So far my rational half is winning. But my stupid half still has some time.

 

[William13]

The price of any car beyond a Honda Fit for a small car or Chevy Malibu, Toyota Camry, etc for a full size car is a matter of desire. The cost to build an electric car due to battery costs and engineering is very high still today. Thus a limited market.
For me an electric car is a near lifetime desire.

 

[dsm363]

The price of any car beyond a Honda Fit for a small car or Chevy Malibu, Toyota Camry, etc for a full size car is a matter of desire. The cost to build an electric car due to battery costs and engineering is very high still today. Thus a limited market.
For me an electric car is a near lifetime desire.

Exactly. Any car over $35,000-40,000 is hard to justify rationally. It becomes something you just want (like most things I guess) and not something you really need. My most expensive car before the Roadster was a Volvo S80 that I had for 10 years and I loved it. I'd probably still be driving it if the transmission hadn't broken.