-
Want to remove ads? Register an account and login to see fewer ads, and become a Supporting Member to remove almost all ads.
Model Y - Gigafactory Texas Production
- Thread starter Ron J.
- Start date
Similar update for Berlin. This also implies that the LR and P won't be getting the 4680s anytime soon (if ever).
Europe: Berlin-Brandenburg Production at Gigafactory Berlin-Brandenburg started in March 2022, using nonstructural packs with 2170 cells for the start of production. Ultimately, Gigafactory Berlin-Brandenburg will be able to produce Model Ys using both structural packs with 4680 cells as well as non-structural packs with 2170 cells.
ZenRockGarden
Active Member
Very interesting. Lines up with my assumption that they are no where near ready to do 4680 MYLR
Which again, posits that the 4680 is really their budget battery and not (yet?) suitable for the higher range/performing models.
ZenRockGarden
Active Member
I'd spin it more that they don't yet have the 4680 production capacity to keep up with MYLR demand, and they'd rather not ship a weird mix of 2170+4680 cars when they can initially max out 4680 supplies with the MYAWD while making 2170 MYLR's in parallel
Not sure why they didn't just start with the 2170s in the first place to get the backlog down.
Probably because they want to get the 4680 production equipment tuned, and want to get 4680 cells in the wild so that they can get real world data back on the performance. (Packs with new cells/formulas seem to always start out nerf'd on charging performance, and then get adjusted as they get data back.)
Don't see why they don't use cast front chassis with , 2170 and provide some rigidity and weight saving with better tolerances and Dave themselves some money at same time as it would be faster and less prone to supply issues. Unless all their much vaulted ideas do not really work and are just smoke and mirrors.
ZenRockGarden
Active Member
I think they totally can (and may) use front casts with 2170. They already put the rear casts in there...
They will at GigaTexas. They haven't at Fremont because they don't have enough casting machines there, I'm not even sure they have space for more, and it would take significant downtime to rebuild the body in white line.
Once GigaTexas and GigaBerlin are at full speed, they might take the downtime to improve things at Fremont.
More interestingly they didn't start GigaBerlin with front casting... My only guess for that is that they didn't get enough casting machines setup in time to do that. But maybe they will switch to that during the rumored October downtime as they switch to 4680s.
Tesla documents posted for today's earnings call includes the following info:
"In April 2022, we began Model Y deliveries from our new factory in Austin, Texas. At our Cyber Rodeo opening party, we delivered the first vehicles with 4680 in-house made cells, single-piece front body castings and structural battery packs. This is an important milestone for our capacity growth efforts. Later this year, we expect Gigafactory Texas will be able to produce Model Ys using both structural packs with 4680 cells as well as non-structural packs with 2170 cells."
I suspect those later MYs with 2170 cells will be the LR and P versions and those models will eventually transition to the 4680 structural battery packs once gigatexas 4680 cell production really ramps up (perhaps later this year or next).
"In April 2022, we began Model Y deliveries from our new factory in Austin, Texas. At our Cyber Rodeo opening party, we delivered the first vehicles with 4680 in-house made cells, single-piece front body castings and structural battery packs. This is an important milestone for our capacity growth efforts. Later this year, we expect Gigafactory Texas will be able to produce Model Ys using both structural packs with 4680 cells as well as non-structural packs with 2170 cells."
I suspect those later MYs with 2170 cells will be the LR and P versions and those models will eventually transition to the 4680 structural battery packs once gigatexas 4680 cell production really ramps up (perhaps later this year or next).
Last edited:
Basically they have not really moved forward, talked a good game but sadly not delivered. At least we know where we are another year of 2170 without structured pack. All the chat here about 4680 was smoke. At least I can order my accessories at the current discounts and know they will fit. Fine with me.
ZenRockGarden
Active Member
I'd say they're sincere about moving all Y's to structural pack, but certainly were misleading about the pace at which they'd get there - most specifically not telegraphing in any way that Austin would only make a standard-range AWD model for 4680 while rather purposely saying "4680" all the time and knowingly letting everyone assume that meant MYLR. But hey - they'll get there eventually
Mrbrock
Well-Known Member
Berlin is at 350 cars per week. 50 per day. Started in March so Austin is a month behind. Be very easy to follow the Berlin ramp and equate to Austin.
Likely another production line that they haven’t built yet. Get started with the 4680s because there has been so much hype and promises so with those fulfilled, they can get the infrastructure ready for the non structural packs and build.
This to me says they don’t anticipate 4680 ever being as good as 2170 in terms of range/performance or you wouldn’t invest in infrastructure for a temporary technology. Or they have 4680 not reaching that threshold for 2 or 3 years and need to make more cars at Austin so 2170 it is. And they haven’t seen the benefits of structural otherwise they’d do an intermediate structural 2170 at austin until the 4680s are perfected because then there wouldn’t be any real change in production line other than the packs themselves. Rest of the car would be the same.
Mrbrock
Well-Known Member
Yes, and spending $0 on ads and getting more sales the day after the super bowl from other EV ads.
Tesla is like the house in Vegas. They always win.
The front casting probably doesn’t do anything for rigidity. That improvement was going to come from the structural pack, which Elon said could make a convertible as rigid as a coupe all by itself, which is impressive if even half true.
A reasonable question is whether the 2170 pack that would be used at Austin between the two castings -- which is how it will be used -- will add weight. It will have to be in the same ballpark for stiffness as the “structural pack” as the chassis will be the same one set up for castings, which has no floor. So there prob will be some extra steel required.
In the paperwork for the earnings call it says this pack isn’t “structural” which I take only to mean the batteries themselves aren’t bonded into the skins at top and bottom to create a giant trussed beam as they are with 4680 packs. It will of course be structural in the classic sense of the word, in that the pack itself will be a structural element to make up for the bottom of chassis being missing as compared to Fremont cars.
Don't know about you guys but to me it's quite a relief. My problem as a MYP buyers was not knowing what I likely to get not so much what I was getting. Interesting that they were talking about Berlin using front castings by Autumn with 2170. Another dream I guess. Perhaps Elon needs to stop trying to spin so many plates on top of stick at one time. With what's due from the competition in the next 18 months he need to concentrate on His car production because once the magic begins to slip it be be a bumpy road down the hill.
ZenRockGarden
Active Member
My best reading of the silence and carefully chosen words is this:
They've gotten past the ability to efficiently MAKE 4680's and are seeing the cost savings / manufacturing efficiency gains. Which is great!
They DON'T yet have a good grip on overall increased performance - power density, weight savings, charge rates - that kind of stuff. They are likely to figure it out over time as they gain experience with the new cells and structure, but they don't want to promise it and they for sure are not betting the entire MYLR production on it.
scottf200
Well-Known Member
Similar threads
