Plaid 21” rear tire woes - factory defect?

[bkcyk]

I did the 275, cause less is more when it comes to performance. Im looking for a car that hooks in the 1/4mi, and mine does just that . Runs consistent 9.2's 5.90's 1/8 and 1.40's 60ft. While maintaining some efficiency on daily driving. Plus the ability to rotate if needed (but it's not I come to find out)

Uhhh you want as much mechanical grip as possible especially with four digit power output. I also like awesome braking and handles ya dig?

275s… on a Miata!

 

[Muzzman1]

Uhhh you want as much mechanical grip as possible especially with four digit power output. I also like awesome braking and handles ya dig?

275s… on a Miata!

You dont wanna put down more rubber than you need. Friction. It's a thing. On the top end you lose MPH (and races). Ya dig.

You got head up and a ass whooping with your 305's. lol

 

[bkcyk]

You dont wanna put down more rubber than you need. Friction. It's a thing. On the top end you lose MPH (and races). Ya dig.

You got head up and a ass whooping with your 305's. lol

You’re weird man lol

 

[PR0FESSOR]

Short update.

The inside edge of my driver’s tire was down to the fabric and I was not comfortable driving the two hours to Charlotte for fear of blowing out my tire, so I asked Tesla for another way to get the tires replaced, Tesla responded by deleting my service appointment and not replying to my request, except to say that they would not cover the replacement under warranty… after they initially said that the tire replacement would be covered under warranty.

Here is an image of Tesla service saying that the tires would be covered under warranty:

And here is Tesla service indicating that the tire replacement would not be covered under warranty:

So, I ordered replacement tires and will replace them myself. I also ordered the Unplugged Performance adjustable camber arms so that I can fix this issue permanently.

Tomorrow, I am going to go get the paperwork from our local court to take Tesla to small-claims court. I am going to seek compensation for the replacement tires and the Unplugged Performance adjustable camber arms.

By the way, I opted out of arbitration by sending Tesla the appropriate opt-out form when I purchased my Tesla.

Standby for more.

Joe

 

[Sam1]

Short update.

The inside edge of my driver’s tire was down to the fabric and I was not comfortable driving the two hours to Charlotte for fear of blowing out my tire, so I asked Tesla for another way to get the tires replaced, Tesla responded by deleting my service appointment and not replying to my request, except to say that they would not cover the replacement under warranty… after they initially said that the tire replacement would be covered under warranty.

Here is an image of Tesla service saying that the tires would be covered under warranty:

View attachment 1000349

And here is Tesla service indicating that the tire replacement would not be covered under warranty:

View attachment 1000350

So, I ordered replacement tires and will replace them myself. I also ordered the Unplugged Performance adjustable camber arms so that I can fix this issue permanently.

Tomorrow, I am going to go get the paperwork from our local court to take Tesla to small-claims court. I am going to seek compensation for the replacement tires and the Unplugged Performance adjustable camber arms.

By the way, I opted out of arbitration by sending Tesla the appropriate opt-out form when I purchased my Tesla.

Standby for more.

Joe

Don't go in guns blazing telling them it's a camber issue when it's probably a too much toe out issue exacerbated by excess camber.

And also, assuming you are making these statements without having an alignment sheet or other factual data that supports your claim other than statements by random people on the internet while they also do not have any data?

 

[PR0FESSOR]

Thanks for the advice. I will definitely be ready. I have been lucky enough to have won two lemon law cases pro per, and I am an engineer by training. I will be fully prepared.

Joe

Don't go in guns blazing telling them it's a camber issue when it's probably a too much toe out issue exacerbated by excess camber.

And also, assuming you are making these statements without having an alignment sheet or other factual data that supports your claim other than statements by random people on the internet while they also do not have any data?

 

[TSLA Pilot]

Thanks for the advice. I will definitely be ready. I have been lucky enough to have won two lemon law cases pro per, and I am an engineer by training. I will be fully prepared.

Joe

I hope you have also retained your original tires for "show and tell" in court?

The actual delamination of the tread at the sidewall, while the tread itself often has a large amount of tread, should be of great use in court.

Lastly, did you ever apply for replacement with Michelin? It worked well for us FWIW as the provided two new tires at about 11k, with my only expense being mounting and balancing at Discount Tire.

 

[n2mb_racing]

I hope you have also retained your original tires for "show and tell" in court?

The actual delamination of the tread at the sidewall, while the tread itself often has a large amount of tread, should be of great use in court.

Lastly, did you ever apply for replacement with Michelin? It worked well for us FWIW as the provided two new tires at about 11k, with my only expense being mounting and balancing at Discount Tire.

I only got 50 percent credit since Michelin has realized it's a Tesla problem.

 

[PR0FESSOR]

I received 55% credit from Michelin. I have photographs of the tire and proof of tire wear from the Michelin warranty process.

 

[dev_lvl80]

I only got 50 percent credit since Michelin has realized it's a Tesla problem.

That's tricky question. If you have official response that your vehicle inspected and alignment conforms specs, then you can state it's Michelin issues.
T2 on tires says that tires designed for tesla, to be precise to Tesla S. If Tesla says alignments is fine, Micheline should say the same, but obviously they cannot do that.
It's not fair game, but Michelin pays for Tesla's bullshit.

 

[n2mb_racing]

That's tricky question. If you have official response that your vehicle inspected and alignment conforms specs, then you can state it's Michelin issues.
T2 on tires says that tires designed for tesla, to be precise to Tesla S. If Tesla says alignments is fine, Micheline should say the same, but obviously they cannot do that.
It's not fair game, but Michelin pays for Tesla's bullshit.

The Michelin rep had a specific note in their system blaming Tesla for the issue. They initially refused entirely saying I needed to bring it to Tesla and get them to cover it. After calling back a few times I eventually got someone who agreed to do 50 percent.

 

[dev_lvl80]

The Michelin rep had a specific note in their system blaming Tesla for the issue. They initially refused entirely saying I needed to bring it to Tesla and get them to cover it. After calling back a few times I eventually got someone who agreed to do 50 percent.

It's business, nobody wants to pay. But ball on Michelin side. To make claim that it's Tesla's issue, they must to perform same operation as Tesla - find issue with suspension. For sure Michelin won't do that.
Second remember, T2 mark on tire- is approved tires for MS. How Michelin & Tesla agreed, as a customer I do not care. One of them should take responsibility.

 

[lbowroom]

Nowhere in anyone’s policy does it cover dynamic toe change under acceleration, the tendency for the rear to toe out under hard acceleration.

 

[PR0FESSOR]

Nor does it need to. Vehicles have dynamic operating envelopes, and all components on the vehicle should be safe under the dynamic operating envelope.

Let me put it to you another way which may make my point clear. Nowhere in anyone’s policy does is specifically cover torque induced bolt flex leading to stress fracture and failure during the warranty period. However, if the bolt fails due to normal use during the warranty period, Tesla should fix it. This is a failure, not normal wear.

Joe

Nowhere in anyone’s policy does it cover dynamic toe change under acceleration, the tendency for the rear to toe out under hard acceleration.

 

[Sam1]

Nor does it need to. Vehicles have dynamic operating envelopes, and all components on the vehicle should be safe under the dynamic operating envelope.

Let me put it to you another way which may make my point clear. Nowhere in anyone’s policy does is specifically cover torque induced bolt flex leading to stress fracture and failure during the warranty period. However, if the bolt fails due to normal use during the warranty period, Tesla should fix it. This is a failure, not normal wear.

Joe

You may want to read the Tesla warranty coverage before pursuing this venture. I just skimmed it and it specifically states tires are not covered by the Tesla warranty and have their own specific warranty. Which means the Michelin warranty.

Trying to sue Tesla for a partially used up $500 tire isn't worth the effort even if they were responsible for it.

 

[lbowroom]

Nor does it need to. Vehicles have dynamic operating envelopes, and all components on the vehicle should be safe under the dynamic operating envelope.

Let me put it to you another way which may make my point clear. Nowhere in anyone’s policy does is specifically cover torque induced bolt flex leading to stress fracture and failure during the warranty period. However, if the bolt fails due to normal use during the warranty period, Tesla should fix it. This is a failure, not normal wear.

Joe

It’s not like I don’t understand what you’re saying. Ultimately it is a symptom of the rear suspension design, but calling it a Michelin issue or a simple camber issue is incorrect. Sam and I went a few rounds on this and I think we’ve landed on agreement of the root cause. I recently had the track package installed and Tesla set the rear toe at 0.2 per side. They do this at default ride height. I suspect they are doing this to compensate for the toe turning out the lower it squats. I have replaced my lower arms eliminating the flexy bushing and haven’t had any tearing issues since.

 

[Sam1]

It’s not like I don’t understand what you’re saying. Ultimately it is a symptom of the rear suspension design, but calling it a Michelin issue or a simple camber issue is incorrect. Sam and I went a few rounds on this and I think we’ve landed on agreement of the root cause. I recently had the track package installed and Tesla set the rear toe at 0.2 per side. They do this at default ride height. I suspect they are doing this to compensate for the toe turning out the lower it squats. I have replaced my lower arms eliminating the flexy bushing and haven’t had any tearing issues since.

I'm not a rocket surgeon by any means, I just break a lot of parts and go through replacements so I've experienced the progression of things being worn out and reaching the point of total failure.

For example, I just had an alignment done on the car two weeks ago and I put the rear toe back at near 0. When I inspected over the weekend, I noticed the inside corner on my driver's rear tire was scrubbing just like it was from the factory before the arms were installed, but my passenger side tire was not. So I'll be adding a bit more toe in to fix that in a few weeks.

 

[bkcyk]

I recently had the track package installed and Tesla set the rear toe at 0.2 per side. They do this at default ride height. I suspect they are doing this to compensate for the toe turning out the lower it squats. I have replaced my lower arms eliminating the flexy bushing and haven’t had any tearing issues since.

I have a hard time believing Tesla Service Center slobs, nor Tesla hq, are anywhere near fastidious enough to set toe or any alignment setting to where they think it should be to ameliorate excessive rear tire wear especially when all they're doing is installing a brake kit. The variance in even the level of service documentation or extreme lack of just shows you how they roll - careless at best, negligent at worst.

So the onus is on you, the owner/customer, to protect yourself at all times.

Yet supposed Tesla enthusiasts, who willingly register and visit this forum, struggle with getting an actual alignment check to factually understand the hand that their MS was dealt. Fact is, there is no camber adjustment from factory. Fact is, the allowed factory range toward negative will absolutely obliterate even the most rugged rubber on Earth.

So you can spend your time chasing after $1200, but unless you address the root cause (suspension modification), in perhaps less than half a year of normal driving, you're going to be likely rolling on egg shells yet again.

(Team T2 PS4S)

 

[terranx]

The service manual does show different alignment settings between the track pack and standard, though most of the changes are in the front. Whether the service center actually bothers with adjusting the alignment, I don’t know.

 

[PR0FESSOR]

I suspect that Tesla is responsible for the issue which precipitated increased abnormal wear on the tire leading to premature replacement. This is not a tire failure, this is a vehicle failure leading to abnormal wear. I think, when Tesla indicates that they do not warranty tires, they mean, they do not warranty tire defects. I am absolutely confident that Michelin is not responsible for the abnormal wear, Tesla is. I mean to hold them accountable if I can. I am going to charge Tesla for the Unplugged Performance hardware I need to correct this issue as well.

I have owned Porsche, BMW, Lexus, Nissan, Toyota, Subaru, Chevrolet, Ford, Jeep, Chrysler, and other manufacturers of vehicles, and I have never experienced the disregard for the customer that I have experienced thus far with Tesla. I am certain there are plenty of vehicle owners who have experienced better service with Tesla than with other manufacturers, but for me, it isn’t even close…. Tesla is hands-down the worst for me.

This said; I love my Model S, and I will make it right and charge Tesla whatever it costs me to make it right. Others may choose to live with this behavior, which is perfectly understandable… but for me, accepting Tesla’s incompetence and disregard for this customer is untenable.

Joe

You may want to read the Tesla warranty coverage before pursuing this venture. I just skimmed it and it specifically states tires are not covered by the Tesla warranty and have their own specific warranty. Which means the Michelin warranty.

Trying to sue Tesla for a partially used up $500 tire isn't worth the effort even if they were responsible for it.