Wiki Sudden Loss Of Range With 2019.16.x Software

[liamharry]

Owners who have updated to 40.2.3 are now reporting that the battery cooling fan runs continuously (even when off), if battery is >= 90% SoC !

Still currently on 2019.36.2.7 with 2019.40.2.3 locked and loaded and bugging me daily to pull the trigger .. as away from home on a trip, have resisted the urge so far.

I note on the 2019.40.2.3 for AP1 cars thread, owners are reporting loss of regen for longer in cold temps, as well as car using more energy to get battery up to temp. In addition to the fans running at higher SoC’s. >90% ??

Anyone on here who has taken the leap and done the new update able to confirm effects?

Think I will wait until I get home to do the update.

 

[Todd Burch]

I can confirm the loss of regen. The other night my car was parked outside in approx. 30°F weather. In the morning, the regen limit was at 0 kW (I had almost zero regen) for my first 15 mins of driving or so.

 

[Ferrycraigs]

Yes, I had seen the video before. What he is implying is it shouldn't matter if you AC or DC charge and which one is better or worse since the "highly sophisticated" BMS is supposed to keep the battery healthy (unless the BMS has not been doing its job). I'm not sure whether or not the capacity decline, after relatively linear capacity, he is showing is due to the capping we are talking about. He calls it the result of a harmful OTA software introduced by the "manufacturer". Sounds familiar though.

Their point is close to the mark. And we have had the 'all Charging is DC charging' point raised on here. And it is true, all Charging is DC charging. And it is up to the BMS to stop any damage happening. And the KEY point is, it has done its job apart from 'a small percent of owners'. So if the BMS works well for 95% of cars but for some reason Tesla feel compelled to take pre-emptive action on our cars that must SURELY only mean because there is an 'issue' with our batteries. It may not, yet, be a fault, but it must be an issue. That makes it hardware. That make it Warranty.

 

[raphy3]

Looks like Tesla has removed/altered the warranty info off my account. It only has a link to the "new warranty" and not my original warranty.

Edit: added screenshot

Yep they did that in my account long ago. It doesn't mean anything legally. Also, they have to keep your original warranty available for you to download. Check your original delivery papers. It probably has a direct link to a pdf printed out in it. Check and see if that still works. The updated warranty info on your account page is useless.

 

[Spacey73]

There has got to be a serious worry about the batteries if they are now limiting regen so much.

1: Limited battery voltage

2: Limited charging rate

3: Limited Regen and power in cold.

What on earth is going on???

 

[tga]

especially if you were to charge on something else than superchargers that allow for navigate to suc for heating.

Navigate to supercharger battery heating doesn't appear to be supported on older cars. My battery heater has never turned on when a supercharger is set as a destination (either explicitly or as part of a nav system planned charge stop).

 

[tga]

And we have had the 'all Charging is DC charging' point raised on here.

Which is pointlessly pedantic.

The argument is that, since only DC is fed into the battery, all charging is DC charging. You could just as easily argue that all charging is AC charging, since the power from the grid to run it is AC.

"DC charging" is short for "DC fast charging," and drives 10-20x the power of a typical AC session. It's the higher charging rates that are the issue.

 

[Gixx1300R]

Everyone that is effected needs to file a complaint here File a Vehicle Safety Complaint | Safercar.gov | NHTSA

 

[Ferrycraigs]

Which is pointlessly pedantic.

The argument is that, since only DC is fed into the battery, all charging is DC charging. You could just as easily argue that all charging is AC charging, since the power from the grid to run it is AC.

"DC charging" is short for "DC fast charging," and drives 10-20x the power of a typical AC session. It's the higher charging rates that are the issue.

Indeed but the point is, all Charging INTO the battery is DC. And it doesn’t matter if it started as AC or was generated by Solar, Coal or wind. It’s still DC going into the battery.

I agree that the issue is very likely to be the higher charger rates at mid to low SoC from Superchargers. When I tried that argument Tesla told me that DC Rapid Charging (40kW) for longer was as bad as DCFC (100kW) for shorter. Yep, I didn’t buy that argument either.

I think both those points ignore the fact that regardless of whether it’s DCFC, DCRC or AC, the BMS is meant to reduce the rate to a level that doesn’t do any damage. Near the top end, regardless of what rate it started at, the BMS is meant to, and does, restrict the rate eventually to single figures. It seems that system has worked fine in, most, cars. For me the issue is purely why hasn’t the BMS done it’s magic on my battery? If Tesla felt the need to restrict 100% of cars that would indicate a faulty BMS. The fact that it only restricts some cars indicates a faulty battery.

 

[Droschke]

If Tesla felt the need to restrict 100% of cars that would indicate a faulty BMS. The fact that it only restricts some cars indicates a faulty battery.

Of course. These batteries are faulty and being band-aided. The conditions X and Z (post#1), we should not forget.

 

[ran349]

Owners who have updated to 40.2.3 are now reporting that the battery cooling fan runs continuously (even when off), if battery is >= 90% SoC !

It's doing that to my car even at 80% charge. It's annoying because I see my rated miles disappearing before I even drive my car.

 

[iRia]

It's doing that to my car even at 80% charge. It's annoying because I see my rated miles disappearing before I even drive my car.

77% and it’s doing that too.

The rated miles are one thing but what about the longevity of the pump?

 

[KidDoc]

Are the fans the constant high pitched humming noise? My s85 has been doing that for at least several weeks when charged to 90%- at least when it is plugged in and in the garage.

I changed my daily SOC to 60% and I no longer hear the buzz.

 

[Chaserr]

When I tried that argument Tesla told me that DC Rapid Charging (40kW) for longer was as bad as DCFC (100kW) for shorter. Yep, I didn’t buy that argument either.

Tesla told you why they are limiting regen. It turns our 60kW regen charging was happening for longer than everything else and they probably realized their regen was killing batteries.

They saw this coming years ago, my car used to regen at 80+ kW before they lowered it to 60kw. I'm wondering if 60kW will return in the summer or not?

 

[Droschke]

77% and it’s doing that too.

The rated miles are one thing but what about the longevity of the pump?

My experience as well. Supercharging (with the Nav Dest. set) and starting @40% SoC, I was pulling only 36kW till 60% SoC when the charge rate started to dip. Charged to 90%, drove home, car parked in the garage for hours and the pump is still running. The temp outside is 50F. The car is plugged in but the pump is running off the main battery (4 miles range loss already). I think with 2019.40.2.3 the charging profile is getting worse for us for sure.

Tesla does not care about the longevity of the pumps. That is the owners' problem to deal with. It's the battery replacement under warranty that they are doing their best to avoid. Whatever it takes to avoid facing the warranty issues. Caring about positive user experience/convenience is not even considered.

Sad to say it folks, but the dream was definitely short lived.

 

[Droschke]

Are the fans the constant high pitched humming noise?

Exactly.

 

[Chaserr]

I have noticed the new buzz most of the year but didn't connect it to this. Is it the cooling pumps? Does this mean Tesla thinks parkign with over 60 % charge can lead to thermal runaway that caused the fires and sparked the capping?

 

[Droschke]

Is it the cooling pumps?

Yes it is.

Does this mean Tesla thinks parkign with over 60 % charge can lead to thermal runaway that caused the fires and sparked the capping?

Makes sense if the battery is faulty/damaged to start with.

 

[Chaserr]

Is there any batterygated owner, who lives in the cold climate, who still can see the battery warming icon on the Tesla app while preheating the cabin? I don't.

No matter how long I preheat the cabin I'm unable to see the icon. This is definitely a new behavior and I'm trying to see if it only applies to the capped batteries. No regen anymore for a cold battery and no battery preheating while the cabin is being preheated. A very weird combination. You would have guessed they would have left the battery preheating alone or even make it more aggressive to alleviate the new zero-regen behavior for a cold battery.

Everything I learn about batterygate seems to be about lowering the energy state of the battery. Heating increases the amount of battery energy. Whatever the reasoning, Tesla is still over reacting.

 

[T.R.T.e.s.l.a.]

There has got to be a serious worry about the batteries if they are now limiting regen so much.

1: Limited battery voltage

2: Limited charging rate

3: Limited Regen and power in cold.

What on earth is going on???

Tesla is basically screwing every older Tesla car owner, one way or the other.
Really ruining the experience of owning an "older" Tesla