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Will conventional Tesla plugs fit into the CCS plug? Or will CCS M3's need an adapter to use SC equipment. How does this fit?

Yes, and Yes. Normal Type 2 plugs will fit, but only for AC charging. You will have to use a CCS plug for DC fast charging. (Tesla has already said that they will add a CCS plug to existing Superchargers before the Model 3s start delivery in the area.)

Of course this only applies to Europe, not to North America.
 
Language has always fascinated me since I was a kid. Grammar and spelling were easy for me in school, so I guess I sort of gravitated into learning more and more about the English language. Words are especially cool because their meanings and usages drift over time. For example, until around the twelfth century, the word "girl" meant any young child of either sex. Another interesting item is that the letter J was not added to the English alphabet until sometime in the 15th-16th centuries. Prior to this addition we had but 24 letters. To spell words with the J sound, the letter I was used before a vowel. So, King James was spelled King Iames way back when. Similarly, there were differences between the V sound and the U sound that were both represented by the classical Latin "V." The rounded U shape made its debut in the Middle Ages.

Here is the story behind Zzyzx, named by that mid-century charlatan and snake-oil salesman, Curtis H. Springer.

Zzyzx: Quack-Founded Town, Last Name In The Atlas, Zzyzx, California
That is the most informative non-Tesla post I've ever read on TMC.
 
Are you sure you are looking at a 2019 calendar? (2/10/2020 is a Monday...)
My trusty Apple had a little burp. Not sure what happened. But is remedied.
Are you sure you are looking at a 2019 calendar? (2/10/2020 is a Monday...)
I was wrong. Or at least my trusty Apple was wrong, briefly. I deleted the original post.
 
If Tesla was willing to throw in the cost of a few extra HVDC contactors, they could have made the Model 3 work with the existing Type 2 Supercharger for HVDC as well as Type 2 CCS. However, it might be less about cost savings and jumping through regulatory hoops requiring Type 2 CCS at new "public charging" installations ... and if they're going to have to implement Type 2 CCS anyways, may as well just go all in on Type 2 CCS and save the money on the extra contactors. There's also some rule about not adapting/modifying Type 2 CCS connectors or something and possibly combining Tesla Type 2 w/ Type 2 CCS would have run afoul of that, forcing the plain vanilla Type 2 CCS move.
 
If Tesla was willing to throw in the cost of a few extra HVDC contactors, they could have made the Model 3 work with the existing Type 2 Supercharger for HVDC as well as Type 2 CCS. However, it might be less about cost savings and jumping through regulatory hoops requiring Type 2 CCS at new "public charging" installations ... and if they're going to have to implement Type 2 CCS anyways, may as well just go all in on Type 2 CCS and save the money on the extra contactors. There's also some rule about not adapting/modifying Type 2 CCS connectors or something and possibly combining Tesla Type 2 w/ Type 2 CCS would have run afoul of that, forcing the plain vanilla Type 2 CCS move.
I read and re-read your message. I must be thick today because I cannot figure out what you said. Could you post a picture of a Type 2 CCS plug and compare it to a type 2 Tesla plug? I cant figure out when its part of the car, part of the station and when its part of an adapter kit. Picture is worth a thousand words...
 
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I read and re-read your message. I must be thick today because I cannot figure out what you said. Could you post a picture of a Type 2 CCS plug and compare it to a type 2 Tesla plug? I cant figure out when its part of the car, part of the station and when its part of an adapter kit. Picture is worth a thousand words...

The usual Tesla usage of Type 2 in EU in other Type 2 regions is shown in the first 3 rows below. Tesla Superchargers basically use DC-Mid for higher than officially rated power output. The Model 3 will ship in Type 2 regions with the Type 2 CCS ("Type 2 DC-High", 4th row), and Tesla seems to have stated that they will add Type 2 CCS cords to Superchargers to match , which implies that the non-CCS upper portion is not wired for DC-Mid usage, or whatever they have done to get away with using DC-Mid at DC-High rates is not possible on the Type 2 CCS (either physically or legally - there's been some discussion about how CCS group doesn't allow adapters and/ or modified ports).

Physically, a Type 2 (AC/DC-Low/DC-Mid) plug (charger side) will fit into a Type 2 CCS receptacle (car side), but the reverse is not true. In theory you could design a Type 2 CCS with retractable DC-High pins and I think I've seen some prototype for that but I've never heard of such a thing going into production - I imagine the added cost and complexity being the reason.

Tesla's Type 2 implementation uses high powered relays commonly called contactors to disconnect the shared AC/DC pins (also true for Tesla's proprietary connector in North America, just different physical layout) from the connector. For each pin that can be either AC or DC, there must be two contactors (one which will be connected to the AC inverter, one that connects to the battery HVDC - and never both connected to the Type 2 connector at the same time which).

Tesla has indicated that the Model 3 will not support (this may be a misunderstanding or legal fiction) using the Type 2 CCS port for Tesla's modified Type 2 DC-Mid implementation, which a naive interpretation implies that simply the pins nominally shared between AC and DC-Mid/Low are permanently wired to the inverter and the upper portion can only operated in AC modes. For safety, the bottom CCS DC-High pins are probably run through contactors anyway as otherwise touching them with the port open would treat you to the direct power of the battery.

Nominally the S/X must have either 4 or 6 contactors (depending on how many pins are used in modified DC-Mid, I'm not sure) - for every shared pin, times 2 (one for each shared pin to disconnect from AC, and to disconnect from DC). Keeping this existing configuration and adding Type 2 CCS would need 2 more contactors for the DC-High pins. However, assuming the 3 really can't use existing Type 2 Supercharger connectors, then it would make sense that they would ditch all the unneeded contactors, which would get them down to possibly just 2 for the charging connector (vs 6 or 8 if it really is physically capable of using DC-Mid still). This was why I commented that assuming it's not a legal problem, it's only a couple more contactors they'd need to equip the car with in order to keep existing S/X connector compatibility plus add CCS.

3.png


Here below you'll see pictures of actual plugs, that you would connect to the car. The Type 2 on the upper right is physically the same as what Tesla uses in EU and other Type 2 reasons. The Model 3's receptacle would look like a combination of the "Type 2" (Type 2 CCS) and "Type 2 without optional pins" (Type 2 non-CCS, AC/DC-Low/DC-Mid), seen below that in official renders. The one labeled Tesla is what is used in North America.

JDuGus9.jpg


Model-3-CCS-charging-port.jpg


Render with the new Type 2 CCS supercharger connector. If a real CCS connector then the DC will go through the two big pins on the bottom, only.

Tesla-Model-3-CCS-fast-charging-charger.jpg
 
The usual Tesla usage of Type 2 in EU in other Type 2 regions is shown in the first 3 rows below. Tesla Superchargers basically use DC-Mid for higher than officially rated power output. The Model 3 will ship in Type 2 regions with the Type 2 CCS ("Type 2 DC-High", 4th row), and Tesla seems to have stated that they will add Type 2 CCS cords to Superchargers to match , which implies that the non-CCS upper portion is not wired for DC-Mid usage, or whatever they have done to get away with using DC-Mid at DC-High rates is not possible on the Type 2 CCS (either physically or legally - there's been some discussion about how CCS group doesn't allow adapters and/ or modified ports).

Physically, a Type 2 (AC/DC-Low/DC-Mid) plug (charger side) will fit into a Type 2 CCS receptacle (car side), but the reverse is not true. In theory you could design a Type 2 CCS with retractable DC-High pins and I think I've seen some prototype for that but I've never heard of such a thing going into production - I imagine the added cost and complexity being the reason.

Tesla's Type 2 implementation uses high powered relays commonly called contactors to disconnect the shared AC/DC pins (also true for Tesla's proprietary connector in North America, just different physical layout) from the connector. For each pin that can be either AC or DC, there must be two contactors (one which will be connected to the AC inverter, one that connects to the battery HVDC - and never both connected to the Type 2 connector at the same time which).

Tesla has indicated that the Model 3 will not support (this may be a misunderstanding or legal fiction) using the Type 2 CCS port for Tesla's modified Type 2 DC-Mid implementation, which a naive interpretation implies that simply the pins nominally shared between AC and DC-Mid/Low are permanently wired to the inverter and the upper portion can only operated in AC modes. For safety, the bottom CCS DC-High pins are probably run through contactors anyway as otherwise touching them with the port open would treat you to the direct power of the battery.

Nominally the S/X must have either 4 or 6 contactors (depending on how many pins are used in modified DC-Mid, I'm not sure) - for every shared pin, times 2 (one for each shared pin to disconnect from AC, and to disconnect from DC). Keeping this existing configuration and adding Type 2 CCS would need 2 more contactors for the DC-High pins. However, assuming the 3 really can't use existing Type 2 Supercharger connectors, then it would make sense that they would ditch all the unneeded contactors, which would get them down to possibly just 2 for the charging connector (vs 6 or 8 if it really is physically capable of using DC-Mid still). This was why I commented that assuming it's not a legal problem, it's only a couple more contactors they'd need to equip the car with in order to keep existing S/X connector compatibility plus add CCS.

3.png


Here below you'll see pictures of actual plugs, that you would connect to the car. The Type 2 on the upper right is physically the same as what Tesla uses in EU and other Type 2 reasons. The Model 3's receptacle would look like a combination of the "Type 2" (Type 2 CCS) and "Type 2 without optional pins" (Type 2 non-CCS, AC/DC-Low/DC-Mid), seen below that in official renders. The one labeled Tesla is what is used in North America.

JDuGus9.jpg


Model-3-CCS-charging-port.jpg


Render with the new Type 2 CCS supercharger connector. If a real CCS connector then the DC will go through the two big pins on the bottom, only.

Tesla-Model-3-CCS-fast-charging-charger.jpg
Now THIS is an answer. I asked and you delivered in spades. Thanks.
 
I made my way to Fort Stockton SC last week. Went by Iraan also, just to see what it looked like and to check out the most productive oil well in the Permian Basin according to my son-in-law (Yates Oil Field - Wikipedia) and take a few photos of windmills from a different angle.
I met 2 Model 3's at the Fort Stockton and invited them to the February 9, 2019 Golden Spike ceremony, but they were just visiting family for Thanksgiving. They did not seem interested. We are still very interested. I love the preliminary plans so far.

Interesting off-topic explanation of the various chargers and charging systems. I went to buy a CHAdeMO adapter but it would not work with my Model X and I did not want to visit the Service Center to see if they could get it to work, so I passed on buying or renting it. There is a whole procedure on how to get it to work even if my X doesn't have a glitch, but I am fairly certain we followed the procedure. I did not need it, but I have had to wait for others to move their cars so I could get a charge on a trip or two, so I thought having a backup way to get a charge might be a good idea. I will wait and see if I ever need it first. I am afraid if I go to the SC they will update my car and I do not want anymore updates, lol.
FYI:
The J1772 adapter was indeed named for the committee that passed it as a standard, the SAE Hybrid J1772 Task Force. SAE J1772 - Wikipedia

The CHAdeMO association was formed by the Tokyo Electric Power Company, Nissan, Mitsubishi and Fuji Heavy Industries(the manufacturer of Subaru vehicles). CHAdeMO is an abbreviation of "CHArge de MOve", equivalent to "move using charge" or "move by charge" or "charge 'n' go", a reference to the fact that it's a fast charger. The name is derived from the Japanese phrase O cha demo ikaga desuka, translating to English as "How about a cup of tea?", referring to the time it would take to charge a car.[3] CHAdeMO can charge low-range (120 km, or 75 mi) electric cars in less than half an hour. It plans to introduce 400 kW ‘ultra-fast’ charging in the coming years.[4] . CHAdeMO - Wikipedia
 
Met with the Hotel Limpia/Holland Hotel/Maverick Inn people today.
February 9 is a "go". Need head counts for several items - please see next post.

Group rates for rooms are available if we have enough participants.


Fort Stockton Golden Spike Ceremony - Tesla Supercharger

Saturday, February 9:

4:30pm
Meet at the Flying J in Fort Stockton. Pics, charge, then on to Fort Davis.

7:00pm
Cocktails and dinner at the Blue Mountain Bistro in Fort Davis
Cordials and such around the hotel's fireplace after dinner.

Sunday, February 10:

Breakfast buffet at Blue Mountain Bistro or at the Fort Davis Drug Store, Lupita's Place in Fort Davis (Mexican food), or Judy's Bread and Breakfast in Alpine (bring an appetite, allow extra time)

10:00 am
group photo in front of the the courthouse in Fort Davis

noon
Marfa: group photo in front of the Presidio County Courthouse
lunch at the Hotel St. George - Bar St. George
(charging available at the El Cosmico)

Please see similar post for the Tesla EV Rally in August: (should be posted by 10pm tonight)
Far West Texas Charging
 
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Head Count as of 12/29/18 - Golden Spike Ceremony - Fort Stockton

Meet-up at Flying J, Fort Stockton - 4:30 pm
charliepmayer - 2 guests

Hotel rooms at the Hotel Limpia, Fort Davis (call (432) 426-3237 to make your reservations):
Friday: no commitments
Saturday: no commitments
Sunday: no commitments

Drinks and dinner at Hotel Limpia on Saturday, February 9:
charliepmayer - 2 guests

Breakfast buffet at the Blue Mountain Bistro on Sunday, February 10, 7:30-10:00:
charliepmayer - 2 guests

Lunch at the Bar St George in Marfa, Sunday, February 10, noon:
charliepmayer - 2 guests

Please update directly, or let me know and I'll update the list and re-post.
 
Head Count as of 12/29/18 - Golden Spike Ceremony - Fort Stockton

Meet-up at Flying J, Fort Stockton - 4:30 pm
charliepmayer - 2 guests

Hotel rooms at the Hotel Limpia, Fort Davis (call (432) 426-3237 to make your reservations):
Friday: no commitments
Saturday: no commitments
Sunday: no commitments

Drinks and dinner at Hotel Limpia on Saturday, February 9:
charliepmayer - 2 guests

Breakfast buffet at the Blue Mountain Bistro on Sunday, February 10, 7:30-10:00:
charliepmayer - 2 guests

Lunch at the Bar St George in Marfa, Sunday, February 10, noon:
charliepmayer - 2 guests

Please update directly, or let me know and I'll update the list and re-post.

Very nice itinerary, Charlie. Thanks for putting this together.

I'm in for the Golden Spike Ceremony on Saturday, with the intention of getting there 20 minutes early to start handing out golden spikes. Let's say a party of one (plus top hat and 50 spikes) from my end for now as I won't have confirmation for my guest until the end of January at best.

FYI, this post didn't show up in my feed - but the other one for the August event did. Evidently, the TMC notification algorithms are still broken.
 
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