Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[PeterJA]

And the ship crew would push you off the ship for preventing more people from dumping incoming water overboard. You are rooting for the people at the front of ship to "win" at the cost of increasing the chances of the ship sinking.

The ship of Earth has the best chance of not sinking under climate change if Tesla continues to lead its industries (kicking and screaming) toward sustainability. Anything that threatens Tesla's ability to lead, including industrial espionage, increases the chance of sinking, IMO.

 

[Krugerrand]

I guess so.

Elon If we are on a sinking ship(earth) and we at the front of the ship figure out a superior bucket design it would be just plain stupid to prevent those at the back of the ship from using that same design.

But I guess if those at the back steal their tar formulation or how to recruit ship crew then you file a lawsuit.

You’re being purposely obtuse and you know it. It’s not okay to step all over morals and ethics because ‘hey, you said you’d share anyway so what’s the difference if I steal from you?’

 

[Cherry Wine]

I'm confident Alex would not post monthly numbers from limited geographic areas except to counter the FUD numbers posted in previous months, in those same areas, with the claim they meant Tesla sales were falling off a cliff.

Please think about what you say, in context.

Took the words right out of my mouth.

 

[2daMoon]

Who’s boat is this boat?

Probably will depend upon how "is" will be defined at the trial, right? If the trial is conducted on the boat, an admiralty jurisdiction may complicate things further.


It would appear that some people fall short of having a working understanding of the most basic premise of Common Law, as such matters as these will be governed by that if someone chooses to make a fuss over it in court.

Tesla's patents are freely offered under contract. The terms of that contract are provided for all to see. A use of any patent that is considered in breach of those terms might result in a lawsuit.

A Non-Disclosure Agreement is another form of contract. If it is violated, a lawsuit is the way to deal with this.

Theft of other Intellectual Property (techniques, data, etc.) is also something that can be sued over. This is how businesses protect themselves from others who try to steal what is not theirs in order to get the prize without putting forth the effort to earn it.

Some people with questionable ethics might take the total contents of their neighbor's kitchen just because the neighbor said, "help yourself" to them. Maybe that is how the person posing this argument sees it. This could be why they don't understand why they are wrong.

If, instead, the folks at Rivian had come to the folks at Tesla and asked nicely for these things, Tesla may have been able to come to some arrangement. They don't appear to have done that.

I'm gonna go inventory my booze now, just in case...

 

[GOVA]

Probably will depend upon how "is" will be defined at the trial, right? If the trial is conducted on the boat, an admiralty jurisdiction may complicate things further.


It would appear that some people fall short of having a working understanding of the most basic premise of Common Law, as such matters as these will be governed by that if someone chooses to make a fuss over it in court.

Tesla's patents are freely offered under contract. The terms of that contract are provided for all to see. A use of any patent that is considered in breach of those terms might result in a lawsuit.

A Non-Disclosure Agreement is another form of contract. If it is violated, a lawsuit is the way to deal with this.

Theft of other Intellectual Property (techniques, data, etc.) is also something that can be sued over. This is how businesses protect themselves from others who try to steal what is not theirs in order to get the prize without putting forth the effort to earn it.

Some people with questionable ethics might take the total contents of their neighbor's kitchen just because the neighbor said, "help yourself" to them. Maybe that is how the person posing this argument sees it. This could be why they don't understand why they are wrong.

If, instead, the folks at Rivian had come to the folks at Tesla and asked nicely for these things, Tesla may have been able to come to some arrangement. They don't appear to have done that.

I'm gonna go inventory my booze now, just in case...

One of the best posts I've seen lately. Thank you.

 

[Blue horseshoe]

I guess so.

Elon If we are on a sinking ship(earth) and we at the front of the ship figure out a superior bucket design it would be just plain stupid to prevent those at the back of the ship from using that same design.

But I guess if those at the back steal their tar formulation or how to recruit ship crew then you file a lawsuit.

Your hypothetical is so poorly constructed I've forgotten the point you were trying to even make. Sinking ships, people are designing buckets, others are stealing tar formulations, and some goof is trying to hire new employees for a sinking ship! Signal to noise ratio man!

 

[Mengy]

Probably will depend upon how "is" will be defined at the trial, right? If the trial is conducted on the boat, an admiralty jurisdiction may complicate things further.


It would appear that some people fall short of having a working understanding of the most basic premise of Common Law, as such matters as these will be governed by that if someone chooses to make a fuss over it in court.

Tesla's patents are freely offered under contract. The terms of that contract are provided for all to see. A use of any patent that is considered in breach of those terms might result in a lawsuit.

A Non-Disclosure Agreement is another form of contract. If it is violated, a lawsuit is the way to deal with this.

Theft of other Intellectual Property (techniques, data, etc.) is also something that can be sued over. This is how businesses protect themselves from others who try to steal what is not theirs in order to get the prize without putting forth the effort to earn it.

Some people with questionable ethics might take the total contents of their neighbor's kitchen just because the neighbor said, "help yourself" to them. Maybe that is how the person posing this argument sees it. This could be why they don't understand why they are wrong.

If, instead, the folks at Rivian had come to the folks at Tesla and asked nicely for these things, Tesla may have been able to come to some arrangement. They don't appear to have done that.

I'm gonna go inventory my booze now, just in case...

Excellent post 2daMoon.

 

[JustMe]

Who’s boat is this boat?

Gavin MacLeod, RIP

 

[elasalle]

Gujarat Government To Tesla: Here's 1,000 Acres To Set Up A Plant. - CleanTechnica

Sign up for daily news updates from CleanTechnica on email. Or follow us on Google News! The Gujarat government is offering Tesla 1,000 acres of land to set up a plant in India, News18 reports. The location of the land is both inside and outside of Adani Ports and Special ... [continued]

cleantechnica.com

 

[M|S|M MYP]

Sad part is he actually believes in what he says...."Exact same thing" SMDH....

 

[GOVA]

^ Frankly, those 2 should get married. No need to give them any more I/O.

 

[MartinAustin]

No offense to Alex, but while this is good news of course, and finally Tesla's European sales charts look as they should, with the UK, Germany and France being the Top 3, not some smaller countries with a special subsidy or tax circumstance, I am not necessarily a fan of him posting this in this context. If we are - rightfully - pointing out how misleading it is for media or TSLAQ to take the first or second month of a quarter and claim Tesla sales are down, we can't do the same in the other direction by picking out the last month of the quarter. It's just like how people are re-posting that the Model 3 was the number 1 car in the UK in June. Awesome, but we do know what happens 3rd month of the quarter and we should be much happier/prouder that it is #11 YTD.

We will be able to do it with much more certainty once the Berlin factory has ramped up. And the FUDsters will have less ability to cherry-pick European- and China-sourced deliveries at that point too.

(not to mention, when Berlin is ramped up, Tesla might be at #1 in all markets )

 

[JRP3]

If we are - rightfully - pointing out how misleading it is for media or TSLAQ to take the first or second month of a quarter and claim Tesla sales are down, we can't do the same in the other direction by picking out the last month of the quarter. It's just like how people are re-posting that the Model 3 was the number 1 car in the UK in June.

Fight fire with fire.

 

[MC3OZ]

IMO for paid Supercharging we need to make some guesses and assumptions about fixed costs and margins,..

Here are my guesses, which may be the right order of magnitude.

Supercharger V2 - fixed costs: (per day per stall) Equipment $3 Site $5 margin $0.10 kWh - kWh to breakeven. = 80
Supercharger V3 - fixed costs: (per day per stall) Equipment $7 Site $5 margin $0.15 kWh - kWh to breakeven. = 80

Both coming out at 80 kwh per day sold to break-even is a coincidence, we do need to multiply that by the number of stalls to get the site figure...
Underutilization may be a bigger problem than overutilization in some sites.

What evidence to I have for a margin?
.These are rough Australian figures Residential $0.25 kWh, Supercharging ?? ($0.40-$0.50 kWh) - I paid $0.42 last time).
Residential demand charges (proposed by utility) $0.08 kWh + peak monthly usage charge..

I can't remember all the details, but a bulk deal with peak charges normally has a signicantly lower per KWh cost than a standard residential tariff.

Tesla also knows the utilization at any time and can throttle charging to stay within peak usage limits.

From a customer point of view low utilization is best, from a ROI point of view high utilization is best. The optimal outcome is a happy compromise where charging is at least break-even in the quieter periods, but can handle the busy holiday loads...

The Tesla fleet is growing rapidly other cars using chargers are likely to be a rounding error...

But there is little doubt bigger Supercharger V3 sites with some solar and lots of stalls, give the best combination of margin, utilization and customer service.

 

[BornToFly]

This is pre-2019 deja vu to me. Nothing but good news from Tesla and various sources on Twitter and TMC, but a lot of negative fake news/FUD from traditional news outlets, and the stock going down when it should be shooting up. I was rage buying shares for 4 years and then made out like a bandit when the stock finally broke out. With 20 Million cars/year in the not too distant future, another big jump is inevitable. My advice - keep buying shares with every pay check and HODL. If we are stuck here for a while, buying options will = money flushed down the toilet. If we aren't over 700 by ER, I'm going to start selling covered calls again even if the SP is low, because I will see that as a sign that nothing will happen for a while.

 

[gabeincal]

It looks like they have cleared a spot and started to build forms for something. Maybe another GigaPress?

View attachment 682286

Or maybe just a structure to hold all of the excess castings they produce? It will be interesting to watch this space.

Well spotted, I was wondering about this and your post made me go back to previous videos. It is progressing rapidly, on the Jun 23 video there was no sign of it yet.

 

[Carl Raymond]

I‘m impressed with the data methods of “my Tesla weekend” channel. He suggests in the first video that Austin is maybe a month out from start up. (Says “next month”, not sure if referring to July or August, given it’s a week old.)

If anybody has an inside ear, a friend of a friend who has applied for one of the many jobs going, I’d love to hear of any proposed start date.

The market is expecting November, afaik. If it turns out to be 3 months sooner, it would be pretty cool to learn it on this forum first.
Cheers

Edit: keep in mind that finishing the factory is NOT a prerequisite to start of production.

 

[Artful Dodger]

Seems like MM's are pushing down before earnings announcement.
Should start to run when that is announced - I keep refreshing the Tesla IR page waiting to see it (along with refreshing this page constantly)

Question- is the announcement 2 weeks before earnings or 3 weeks?

I expect a PR this Friday for an Earnings Call on Wed, July 21st.

 

[pitabun]

"And unlike in, say, a Model Y, there's no learning curve for driving a Mach-E"

Learning curve as in regen braking where you take your foot off the gas and the car slows down or too much tech that you can't figure out? Someone please explain this to me like i am 5 please.

Boomers go boom. “iPads are for angry bird, not cars”

 

[kbM3]

FWIW, I commented on the Skoda version because, IIRC, all three were/are built in the Skoda factory. VAG has been badge engineering most models of those brands plus a few others since they acquired them. For curiosity VW acquired SEAT in 1986, which since WWII had produced Fiat models under license. They bought a third of Skoda in 1986 and full control in 2000. From time to time VAG has tried to differentiate the VW, Skoda and Fiat models but those have never really meant much. Now the three are true badge engineered.

My personal habit has been to refer to all three by the brand most identified with their production, if I know it. Now it is becoming more difficult since Bugatti is becoming Rimac.

All this has worked well for VAG but BEV’s are far harder to treat as piecework than are ICE, where components are mixed and matched from bottom to top (some components are shared from Bentley, Lamborghini and Bugatti to Fox). Few of them, except for the pure badge-engineered ones, share basic systems. Even for Porsche none can do OTA firmware updates, mostly because they really do nit have a ‘firmware’ concept.

Tesla is the only one that cohesively shares core design and control between models. Surely producers like Rivian, Lucid, Nio and other, mostly Chinese brands will be there soon.

All major OEMs resemble VAG more than they do Tesla.

As we continue to evaluate competitive threat and Tesla competition, examining the VAG structure and that of other legacy OEM will prove that in everything from basic function to operating efficiency and vehicle features it is highly unlikely that any of them can adapt well enough to preserve their dominance.

During the next five years Tesla will have an increasing proportion of profit and a decreasing market share. For a recent analogy Apple is probably the closest one.

That means there will be continuing ‘true believers’ in other brands, but most will go the way of Nokia, Blackberry, Siemens, Ericsson, Motorola, Microsoft, Sanyo, and now LG. Anybody who doubts how disruptive systems integration can be need only consider Apple.

Tesla has far deeper technology than has had Apple. After all Tesla manufacturing and materials advances are accelerating. Those have not been factors for Apple.

Decreasing market share?

how?

Tesla should grow at 75-80% this year the next two. Unless the weighted average of ALL other competitors exceeds that, Tesla will gain, not lose share.