Tesla won't send me my own logs

[jonman]

Aww man, totally dislike that video, poor guy.

I was a passenger in a WRX going 70 that hit a deer and totaled the car. Learned a lot during the experience, most importantly that you are NOT supposed to swerve to avoid hitting it. People have really hurt themselves doing that. Insurance classified it as "an act of God" and paid for the whole thing.

Also, in some areas like where I was in Colorado, (according to the tow truck driver) there is an overpopulation of deers that is harming the environment.

Exactly! I never swerve.

 

[maximus16]

AP handled that impact very well.. Some people would of jerked the wheel, over compensated and ran into the ditch.

 

[cgiGuy]

Here's the YouTube link of the video:

Let me know if the link works or not. I was having some troubles with it earlier.

Looks like he was "loitering" in the middle of the road, so there's a chance future firmware may have helped. Of course, he had his back to your car too, reducing his radar signature. Stealth deer.

 

[jonman]

AP handled that impact very well.. Some people would of jerked the wheel, over compensated and ran into the ditch.

It really did. I'm glad AP kept me in my lane too instead of trying to dodge it. But then again, it never saw the deer anyway.

I wonder why it kept going after impact though? I had to disengage AP on my own, but other alerts chimed in the IC. Maybe the impact wasn't hard enough??

74 MPH hitting a medium sized doe brings a pretty good impact I'd say. Force = Mass * Acceleration ??

 

[jonman]

UPDATE:

SC pulled the logs, which are hosted in CA after being sent there from the vehicle, and is looking over everything. Rep I spoke with was optimistic that I could also be provided a copy of the logs surrounding the incident via email, but we shall see. I have yet to receive them.

 

[lklundin]

This is a matter of some contention. Tesla has publicly stated in the past the the data belongs to them, not you, even though it resides in your car. They will not release it, except with a court order. Apparently there's some federal rule about event data recorders which that opinion contrasts with, but they have stated the rule doesn't apply as they log EVERYTHING and the rule is only for event data recorders.

Splitting hairs but the point is as per my first sentence.

Will all the data that all kinds of gadgets from all kinds of companies collect about their user, I think it would only be fair with a consumer protection law, mandating that the owner has the right to a copy of all data that their device collects about them.

The USA would not have to be the first to do so.

 

[SureValla]

Will all the data that all kinds of gadgets from all kinds of companies collect about their user, I think it would only be fair with a consumer protection law, mandating that the owner has the right to a copy of all data that their device collects about them.

The USA would not have to be the first to do so.

From what I understand all cars have a "black box" type recorder. Anyone know how much and what kind of data these hold? Do manufacturers regularly download it to their databases when you bring your car in for service at the dealership/service center?

 

[lklundin]

This is a matter of some contention. Tesla has publicly stated in the past the the data belongs to them, not you, even though it resides in your car. They will not release it, except with a court order. Apparently there's some federal rule about event data recorders which that opinion contrasts with, but they have stated the rule doesn't apply as they log EVERYTHING and the rule is only for event data recorders.

Splitting hairs but the point is as per my first sentence.

When I think about it, Tesla's collection of data from a Model S/X has a lot in common with the data that a telcom routinely collects from a persons smart phone, since the car is basically a networked computer on wheels.

And in Denmark a journalist citing a law that companies (not just telcoms) must release data they store regarding their customers just managed to get a copy of the (extensive positional) data the telcom had collected from his use of his phone.

So it seems that at least in one jurisdiction the data that Tesla collects and claims to own is something the affected person has a right to get a copy of.

 

[msnow]

When I think about it, Tesla's collection of data from a Model S/X has a lot in common with the data that a telcom routinely collects from a persons smart phone, since the car is basically a networked computer on wheels.

And in Denmark a journalist citing a law that companies (not just telcoms) must release data they store regarding their customers just managed to get a copy of the (extensive positional) data the telcom had collected from his use of his phone.

So it seems that at least in one jurisdiction the data that Tesla collects and claims to own is something the affected person has a right to get a copy of.

Not sure about Germany but what if you agreed, in writing, to Tesla not providing this data to you?

 

[lklundin]

Not sure about Germany but what if you agreed, in writing, to Tesla not providing this data to you?

IANAL, but if a law is phrased such that you could simply sign away your rights, then it seems to me like that law is fundamentally broken. Not that that would rule out the scenario.

This forum has mentioned a so called lemon law. It seems inconceivable to me that a car manufacturer would be able to get around that law simply by having the purchase contract include a clause that the buyer would never claim the right afforded to them by this law.

 

[msnow]

IANAL, but if a law is phrased such that you could simply sign away your rights, then it seems to me like that law is fundamentally broken. Not that that would rule out the scenario.

This forum has mentioned a so called lemon law. It seems inconceivable to me that a car manufacturer would be able to get around that law simply by having the purchase contract include a clause that the buyer would never claim the right afforded to them by this law.

Two different things. Yes, certain states here have Lemon Laws and they vary but in general if Tesla can't fix something under warranty after a certain amount of time they either can buy back the car or go to arbitration. That's all in your owners packet if your local state or jurisdiction has such laws.
Second is the data. If your point is that the data is needed to support your claim I think they have to provide it. Certainly a court can order them to provide it. But if you just want the data for your own purposes you may be stuck by what you agreed to when you read and signed the contract.

 

[apacheguy]

Yeah I've tried it before. Tesla won't release logs as the are considered "proprietary information."

 

[NeverFollow]

Except moose.
Tesla’s new Autopilot would automatically brake for a moose, but not for a small deer

Would Tesla’s new Autopilot automatically brake for a motorcycle, but not for a small bicycle or a pedelec?

Jump to the 0:30 to see the car running away, and the bus then blocking the run away car.



Not: A pedelec (from pedal electric cycle) is a bicycle where the rider's pedalling is assisted by a small electric motor.

 

[demundus]

Tesla's AP has a blackbox style feature that dumps highly compressed frames after detecting an impact event to both Tesla's servers and the "memory" of the MCU. See Jason Hughes twitter for sample footage

Jason Hughes on Twitter

 

[CmdrThor]

Here are instructions on how to download logs to a USB drive: Log Upload. Whether they are in a format that you can view is another story. I've never tried this myself.

 

[vandacca]

Here are instructions on how to download logs to a USB drive: Log Upload. Whether they are in a format that you can view is another story. I've never tried this myself.

How to download the log file to a USB flash drive:

• Use a USB flash drive that is 4GB or smaller.
• Ensure the key is turned OFF and the vehicle is not charging.
• Create a top-level folder on the flash drive called "VehicleLogs" (case-sensitive). This naming convention is very important.
• Insert the flash drive into the vehicle's USB port (on the center console). The Touch Screen displays an alert asking you not to remove the memory stick and providing status of the transfer. If the Touch Screen goes to "sleep," tap the screen to "wake it up." The process takes from 10-15 minutes.
• When the alert is no longer displayed, remove the flash drive.

The log file will be located on your flash drive in VehicleLogs/VIN/YYYYMMDDHHMMSS.tar (where VIN is your Vehicle Identifi cation Number).

Thanks, I thought I'd give this a try with a 1GB and 2GB USB drive I had sitting around. What does it mean by "Ensure the key is turned OFF"? The only way I could figure out how to do this is to get into the vehicle and not press the brake pedal. There is a "Car Off" message on the console, which is replaced by "D N R" as soon as you press the brake pedal.

Anyway, I never got any pop-up message on the main screen regarding writing log files. I couldn't get this to work. I even tried both USB ports in the center console, and the two that is accessible for the 2nd row. Maybe it's for Model-S only? Anyone know of a Model-X way of doing this?

 

[MP3Mike]

Here are instructions on how to download logs to a USB drive: Log Upload. Whether they are in a format that you can view is another story. I've never tried this myself.

That is only for the Roadster.

 

[CmdrThor]

That is only for the Roadster.

Thanks for the info. I guess the rest of us have to beg for our logs

 

[Canuck]

I was a passenger in a WRX going 70 that hit a deer and totaled the car. Learned a lot during the experience, most importantly that you are NOT supposed to swerve to avoid hitting it. People have really hurt themselves doing that. Insurance classified it as "an act of God" and paid for the whole thing.

Also, in some areas like where I was in Colorado, (according to the tow truck driver) there is an overpopulation of deers that is harming the environment.

We have tons of deer where I drive. Many live right in the towns I pass through regularly. The fields on the way to my cabin often have too many count. The fact I haven't hit one is amazing but if I followed your advice, I'd have hit a few by now. While your advice has some merit, and I have told my wife and daughters to be prepared to hit one if swerving is not safe, such as if you have to swerve into oncoming traffic, or off a cliff. But I never made the "no swerving" advice categorical since in many cases swerving to avoid hitting a deer is not more dangerous, plus if you train yourself not to swerve and you hit a moose, it's like hitting a brick wall, and you'd wish you'd swerved.

When I watch the video I wonder if AP played a part in allowing the driver to not pay as much attention. Yes, the deer comes up abruptly but it's standing on the road. I don't care how dark and fast I am going, I am looking at the road with enough time to stop if there's something there. The deer that dart out I can understand but this accident looked somewhat preventable to me. Then again, I wasn't there so perhaps I am wrong.

 

[MrJones390]

We have tons of deer where I drive. Many live right in the towns I pass through regularly. The fields on the way to my cabin often have too many count. The fact I haven't hit one is amazing but if I followed your advice, I'd have hit a few by now. While your advice has some merit, and I have told my wife and daughters to be prepared to hit one if swerving is not safe, such as if you have to swerve into oncoming traffic, or off a cliff. But I never made the "no swerving" advice categorical since in many cases swerving to avoid hitting a deer is not more dangerous, plus if you train yourself not to swerve and you hit a moose, it's like hitting a brick wall, and you'd wish you'd swerved.

When I watch the video I wonder if AP played a part in allowing the driver to not pay as much attention. Yes, the deer comes up abruptly but it's standing on the road. I don't care how dark and fast I am going, I am looking at the road with enough time to stop if there's something there. The deer that dart out I can understand but this accident looked somewhat preventable to me. Then again, I wasn't there so perhaps I am wrong.

The deer that we hit literally ran in front of the car like a linebacker tacking a runningback. Not a chance to even see it or swerve.