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Trading in my M3
- Thread starter thaian207
- Start date
Tesla does not match Carmax.....on Teslas. Tesla will match on everything else as far as I know.
Also, can't say enough about ev-cpo. If you're in the market for a used Tesla, set yourself up an alert for what you're looking for, and be ready to pounce. Good deals go quick.
yerEVan
Active Member
lencap
Member
Thank you Lencap, this information is very helpful.
We live in Orlando so 240 mi range is more than enough for daily driving. Our problem is that we do take long-distance trips very often. 192 mi, in theory, is great but in real-life situations
192 x .05 (battery degradation) = 182 mi (less than 6 months I'm at 3-4% already)
182 x 15-20% (driving at 70mph) = ~150mi and even less if we factor in AC/Heat and other road conditions.
150mi is usually more than enough between supercharger stations, but the problem we ran into on our last trip was the last Supercharger station was 120mi away from the final destination. We arrived with 120 miles left, we were able to add another 40mi using 110v charger at our cabin. With the vampire drain and some driving in the city, we were down to 115mi range when it was time to leave. We found some public chargers but they were all broken. I didn't want to wait for another 2-3 to get another 12-15mi so we headed back to the supercharger. I was doing 35-45mi/h on a 55/60 limit on a one-lane road the whole way and made it to the Supercharger with 1 mile left. Needless to say, it was an experience I do not want to repeat
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Thanks for your kind comments, and added info. Given your need for frequent trips to your cabin I believe that the suggestion to add a 50 AMP circuit to your cabin is the best solution, but I'd suggest either a 40AMP or 60AMP circuit instead. Here's why: The SR+ onboard charger is limited to 7.7KWH speed - which would be a 40 AMP circuit - that should be even a bit less expensive than the 50 AMP circuit (smaller wire) to install.
I installed a ClipperCreek 40AMP charger in my home to power my Nissan Leaf and BMW i3. It works fine with the Tesla M3 using the supplied J1722 adaptor that comes with the car. If you might buy the Model Y you may want to spend a bit more and install the Tesla charger with a 60 AMP circuit. Both the LR and Model Y can use that full power - the SR can't because of the slower onboard charger.
My M3 LR charges at 31 miles/hour using the ClipperCreek - more than enough for my needs, and your car should charge at a similar rate, even with the 7.7KWH onboard charger. Frankly 25-30 miles/hour range on a 40 AMP circuit is fine for pretty much anything. An overnight charge should easily get you to your SuperCharger without concern. Even with my LR I don't see the need to upgrade to a 60 AMP circuit and 44 miles/hour range pickup.
This is the link for the ClipperCreek charger: Buyer's Guide to Home EV Charging Stations
The HSC40 model should be fine for your needs. It connects directly to the charger, no need to add a separate plug connector. It's the model I bought. Works fine. It's $565. Adding an electrician to do the wiring (plan carefully - run as short a wire as you can to the EVSE to minimize costs - my connector is only 5 feet from my electric service box - install was under $500). Including the ClipperCreek charger the entire install was roughly $1000.
You'll likely get 25/miles of range/hour with a 40AMP ClipperCreek (or other brand) charger and your SR onboard charger. You also won't need any additional adapters, keeping your costs very reasonable. Compared to a $10K hit on resale, installing a charger at the cabin seems like a good option for you.
Development costs are not "free", so this is not and will never be a 'free' option. However, like all technology, the cost should go down over time.
I think you missed the point - this is not about giving to someone for free but whether they would pay the previous owner more for a software package that s/he purchased that they could provide to a new buyer at no new cost to Tesla
I think the point is that Tesla can provide that same package to the new buyer at no cost whether they pay the previous owner or not. Therefore, they would not be wise to pay the previous owner.
Interesting to see how attitudes on range are changing now that newer cars have much longer range. I have a 2016 75S and its original advertised range of 249 is more like 230-235. (I seldom charge to 100%, so that’s only a good guess.)
I also have an early (VIN 47xx) LR 3 and when I bought it threads were full of posts saying the additional LR range wasn’t a big deal and other options like EAP were more important. My 3 is nearly two years old and I do tend to prefer it when heading to various distant locations around AZ. Long distance between chargers and extreme elevation change are major reasons but also I am not a person who ever felt comfortable driving on 1/8 tank of gas either.
However, in spite of my range anxiety related to every car that I have owned I wouldn’t even think of selling my less than three year old S to get more range. That would be burning money for a perceived problem that seldom is really a problem. As for selling any six month old car, it would have to be endangering my life for me to take that kind of a financial hit.
I also have an early (VIN 47xx) LR 3 and when I bought it threads were full of posts saying the additional LR range wasn’t a big deal and other options like EAP were more important. My 3 is nearly two years old and I do tend to prefer it when heading to various distant locations around AZ. Long distance between chargers and extreme elevation change are major reasons but also I am not a person who ever felt comfortable driving on 1/8 tank of gas either.
However, in spite of my range anxiety related to every car that I have owned I wouldn’t even think of selling my less than three year old S to get more range. That would be burning money for a perceived problem that seldom is really a problem. As for selling any six month old car, it would have to be endangering my life for me to take that kind of a financial hit.
Fernand
Active Member
@lencap, no offense, but I must be missing something. I understand that you already had the ClipperCreek, but for a Tesla-only driver, it seems redundant. As far as I know the "mobile charging cable" that comes with the M3, if fitted with the (now optional $35 14-50 plug), will charge at 32 amps from a 240 volt circuit. So I don't see the need for this extra $500 ClipperCreek. You just need a 14-50 wall jack, like what the electrician would install. That's about $500 as per above.
Or buy some 2 conductor + ground 10 gauge Romex, a 14-50 receptacle, two 40 amp (?) breakers to tap your circuit breaker box, and connect the two sides (and ground) of a 120 volt home circuit, that be 240v. It looks like even 75 ft of 10/2 is ok at 30 amps, 24 amps per Code. Depending on length of run, that can total around $100. We're around one tenth of the cost. Or for a little more you can go totally "per code" and use #8 wire.
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Austindude
Member
Are you speculating about this or do you have actual information that shows this to be true?
Personally, I wouldn't put in a 40a circuit. The reason is that they make no common 40a outlets. So a 40a circuit will still have a 50a outlet. The incremental cost for installing 50a over 40a is quite small in most cases. I'd rather have something sized 50a all the way through so if someday someone plugs in an RV and expects 50a they are not surprised. One could select a 6-50 over a 14-50 and save one conductor.
My parents asked for a welder plug in their new garage (car work). The electrician gave them a 6-50 outlet on a 40a breaker. It's exactly 1 ft from the breaker box. If I want to fix it I'd have to rip out drywall, etc. Incremental cost at the time of installation would have been a few dollars.
Also, for a remote location, I wouldn't bother with a wall mounted EVSE.
Regarding 60a, I'd ask the electrician to size up the wiring so 60a would be a possibility in the future, but would put on a 50a breaker/outlet.
Finally, if the quote for the 50a was higher than I wanted to spend, I'd get a quote for a 6-30 and a 6-20 outlet.
May really save on the 6-20 if the Tesla is hidden and it's for an air compressor, kiln, or welder.
Fernand
Active Member
Can you explain, please? How does a 6-20 receptacle differ from a 6-30? Why Tesla hidden, is the electrician a servant of some higher power, not just the ultimate power of dollars?
Is there a Code rule that defines the 6-30 as 2 wire? I mean in the end the Mobile Charger plug wants 2 wires of 240 and ground (must be center tap?). But 14-50 demands what else (formally)?
Of course for my own purposes, I'm an engineer not an electrician, I wire stuff up however, and I already have the 14-50 plug on the Mobile Charger contraption, so I wouldn't lose sleep over sticking a 14-50 receptacle on the end of 2 wire Romex connected to, say, Chernobyl.
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The 6 series are all 240v. A lower current requirement might cost less in some cases (like overloaded panels, long runs, etc). They all have pin differences to keep from plugging in the wrong load.
6-20 = 20a (Line1 - Line2 - Ground)
6-30 = 30a (Line1 - Line2 - Ground)
6-50 = 50a (Line1 - Line2 - Ground)
14-50 = 50a (Line1 - Neutral - Line2 - Ground)
- The advantage of the 14-50 is the user can get two 120v circuits out of it easily. That is actually what RVs do.
The Tesla only cars about the power between the two pins (L1-L2 in 240v and L-N 120v) and that there is a ground.
If the Tesla is hidden, the electrician doesn't see fancy car in the driveway and expect more money. All electricians are not like this, but some do see the opportunity and take it. Electricians have been putting in 240v outlets for a long time before EVs were around.
6-20 = 20a (Line1 - Line2 - Ground)
6-30 = 30a (Line1 - Line2 - Ground)
6-50 = 50a (Line1 - Line2 - Ground)
14-50 = 50a (Line1 - Neutral - Line2 - Ground)
- The advantage of the 14-50 is the user can get two 120v circuits out of it easily. That is actually what RVs do.
The Tesla only cars about the power between the two pins (L1-L2 in 240v and L-N 120v) and that there is a ground.
If the Tesla is hidden, the electrician doesn't see fancy car in the driveway and expect more money. All electricians are not like this, but some do see the opportunity and take it. Electricians have been putting in 240v outlets for a long time before EVs were around.
Fernand
Active Member
@brkaus thanks! So, for Halloween, Nicki, my Tesla, is going to have to "come" as a dryer. We could make some serious effort to make it look a bit more like a dryer, using cardboard boxes, but taking a clue from Government, it only takes tweeting it strongly as fact, and it will be true.
-- "Mr Electrician, THAT is a Tesla brand clothes dryer."
If he looks skeptical, we go "Haven't you heard? Elon Musk is the most craziest person ever, he now sells these $200 electric dryers, that's what that is, and I'm not rich, so that's what I got SAD."
Oh, wait is that over 144 characters?
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-- "Mr Electrician, THAT is a Tesla brand clothes dryer."
If he looks skeptical, we go "Haven't you heard? Elon Musk is the most craziest person ever, he now sells these $200 electric dryers, that's what that is, and I'm not rich, so that's what I got SAD."
Oh, wait is that over 144 characters?
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lencap
Member
Brkaus raises a valid point about 40AMP vs 50 AMP circuits. My point was that if you plan to use a EVSE, like a ClipperCreek, and if you have a SR M3, anything over 40AMPS won't increase the recharging speed due to the limitations of the onboard Tesla charger that limits charging to 7.7KWH, about a 40AMP circuit.
Because they had the buyer underwrite the cost with the purchase. If it had intrinsic value at purchase time, that cost should have value later, too. I am sure their margins on cost of development increase over time, so if they charge a current buyer
That would be assuming that there are no new development costs for Tesla and that they've already paid for the development cost that they've encouraged. Neither one is a likely scenario. Development cost will continue, and the proprietary software that they develop has value. If it has enough value for a buyer to pay for it, then it has enough value for Tesla to reimburse it.
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