[UK] ‘Highland’ order discussion

[Drew57]

An article from Drive Tesla Canada suggests HW4 may not have the longevity of HW3 (article refers to the Model Y but no reason to believe that the 3 will be different).

“Tesla has been shipping the Model Y equipped with the latest Hardware 4 (HW4) computer in the US for a few months now, but hacker Green (@greentheonly) has discovered the automaker has scaled back the HW4 computer compared to its predecessor.

After getting his hands on another HW4 computer, this time from a Model Y, Green discovered that Tesla had downsized the RAM and storage capacity. The HW4 computer in the Model Y had 8 GB of RAM and 128 GB of storage, half of what is found in the previous generation HW3 computer (16 GB, 256 GB). As Green points out, this all but eliminates the possibility of Steam gaming coming to the Model Y, as it appears to require at least 16GB of RAM on the Model S/X.

One might speculate that Tesla’s decision to reduce the Model Y’s HW4 capabilities stemmed from cost considerations. As Green pointed out, Tesla opted for cost-effective NVMe storage units in the AMD-based systems, which could potentially compromise their longevity in the demanding automotive environment.

While the the specs may be enough when you first receive the vehicle, as time passes concerns arise about potential performance degradation due to insufficient RAM. The Model Y’s 8 GB of RAM could force users to resort to hard resets or endure lag from data swapping on the NVMe storage.

There is still no sign of HW4 in Model Y vehicles being built at Giga Shanghai. For now, only Tesla’s Fremont and Giga Texas factories are building Model Ys with HW4.”

https://twitter.com/i/redirect?url=...def&uid=1351053399010242560&nid=244+272699400

 

[AndyFov]

Is Steam Gaming really of importance to anyone?

 

[randompixel]

It would certainly be appreciated if it was there

 

[GeorgeSymonds]

An article from Drive Tesla Canada suggests HW4 may not have the longevity of HW3 (article refers to the Model Y but no reason to believe that the 3 will be different).

“Tesla has been shipping the Model Y equipped with the latest Hardware 4 (HW4) computer in the US for a few months now, but hacker Green (@greentheonly) has discovered the automaker has scaled back the HW4 computer compared to its predecessor.

After getting his hands on another HW4 computer, this time from a Model Y, Green discovered that Tesla had downsized the RAM and storage capacity. The HW4 computer in the Model Y had 8 GB of RAM and 128 GB of storage, half of what is found in the previous generation HW3 computer (16 GB, 256 GB). As Green points out, this all but eliminates the possibility of Steam gaming coming to the Model Y, as it appears to require at least 16GB of RAM on the Model S/X.

One might speculate that Tesla’s decision to reduce the Model Y’s HW4 capabilities stemmed from cost considerations. As Green pointed out, Tesla opted for cost-effective NVMe storage units in the AMD-based systems, which could potentially compromise their longevity in the demanding automotive environment.

While the the specs may be enough when you first receive the vehicle, as time passes concerns arise about potential performance degradation due to insufficient RAM. The Model Y’s 8 GB of RAM could force users to resort to hard resets or endure lag from data swapping on the NVMe storage.

There is still no sign of HW4 in Model Y vehicles being built at Giga Shanghai. For now, only Tesla’s Fremont and Giga Texas factories are building Model Ys with HW4.”

https://twitter.com/i/redirect?url=https://twitter.com/DriveTeslaca/status/1688584354937942017?cxt=HBwWgsDdlcehh-8uAAAA&cn=ZmxleGlibGVfcmVjcw%3D%3D&refsrc=email&t=1+1691447222599&cn=ZmxleGlibGVfcmVjcw==&sig=09dd6586ff93fa6a4757d4a2b00d11281174d370&iid=c28f383a687345979780635042cbfdef&uid=1351053399010242560&nid=244+272699400

Are we mixing up the computers here?

I'd have thought steam gaming was performed on the MCU like all previous gaming and has nothing to do with the autopilot computer.

 

[Leejmoff]

An article from Drive Tesla Canada suggests HW4 may not have the longevity of HW3 (article refers to the Model Y but no reason to believe that the 3 will be different).

“Tesla has been shipping the Model Y equipped with the latest Hardware 4 (HW4) computer in the US for a few months now, but hacker Green (@greentheonly) has discovered the automaker has scaled back the HW4 computer compared to its predecessor.

After getting his hands on another HW4 computer, this time from a Model Y, Green discovered that Tesla had downsized the RAM and storage capacity. The HW4 computer in the Model Y had 8 GB of RAM and 128 GB of storage, half of what is found in the previous generation HW3 computer (16 GB, 256 GB). As Green points out, this all but eliminates the possibility of Steam gaming coming to the Model Y, as it appears to require at least 16GB of RAM on the Model S/X.

One might speculate that Tesla’s decision to reduce the Model Y’s HW4 capabilities stemmed from cost considerations. As Green pointed out, Tesla opted for cost-effective NVMe storage units in the AMD-based systems, which could potentially compromise their longevity in the demanding automotive environment.

While the the specs may be enough when you first receive the vehicle, as time passes concerns arise about potential performance degradation due to insufficient RAM. The Model Y’s 8 GB of RAM could force users to resort to hard resets or endure lag from data swapping on the NVMe storage.

There is still no sign of HW4 in Model Y vehicles being built at Giga Shanghai. For now, only Tesla’s Fremont and Giga Texas factories are building Model Ys with HW4.”

https://twitter.com/i/redirect?url=https://twitter.com/DriveTeslaca/status/1688584354937942017?cxt=HBwWgsDdlcehh-8uAAAA&cn=ZmxleGlibGVfcmVjcw%3D%3D&refsrc=email&t=1+1691447222599&cn=ZmxleGlibGVfcmVjcw==&sig=09dd6586ff93fa6a4757d4a2b00d11281174d370&iid=c28f383a687345979780635042cbfdef&uid=1351053399010242560&nid=244+272699400

well that is a little worrying. Is this another reason not to get a new Tesla? Sounds like. No USS, lower spec computer etc.

 

[Drew57]

well that is a little worrying. Is this another reason not to get a new Tesla? Sounds like. No USS, lower spec computer etc.

Thinking about, purchasing & owning a Tesla is such a worrisome experience the original factory should be renamed Fretmont.

Having this & your Palo Alto HQ in Silly-Con Valley is just so appropriate for Tesla.

 

[qwickshot]

Are we mixing up the computers here?

I'd have thought steam gaming was performed on the MCU like all previous gaming and has nothing to do with the autopilot computer.

It sounds like it.

Likewise the AMD computer is pretty powerful and the OS and tasks it’s running are very light by modern standards.

What do you need more than 8gb of ram for to run a web browser, Google maps and some music/vid streaming?

Also what’s the problem with NVME storage? NVME is just a communication protocol, it has no impact on ‘longevity in automotive applications’. What matters is the quality of the NAND flash, the controller and the ancillary components. Modern NAND is also really fast and shouldn’t be causing slow downs with swap files if the OS is doing its job properly.

 

[qwickshot]

well that is a little worrying. Is this another reason not to get a new Tesla? Sounds like. No USS, lower spec computer etc.

Specifically what are you concerned about?

The current AMD system in a model 3/Y is orders of magnitude faster than the Intel one in my older 3. It’s also several orders of magnitude faster than you’ll find in any other car at that price point. It’s just slower than the one in the current Model S/X which has additional features one of which is playing games.

 

[pdk42]

Specifically what are you concerned about?

The current AMD system in a model 3/Y is orders of magnitude faster than the Intel one in my older 3.

How many orders of magnitude faster? An order of magnitude is 10x. So if it’s one, then it 10x faster; two orders of magnitude means it’s 100x faster. Get to three and it’s 1000x faster. I find any of these improvements hard to accept. It might be twice as fast, but that’s probably all.

 

[Drew57]

How many orders of magnitude faster? An order of magnitude is 10x. So if it’s one, then it 10x faster; two orders of magnitude means it’s 100x faster. Get to three and it’s 1000x faster. I find any of these improvements hard to accept. It might be twice as fast, but that’s probably all.

For those who choose the Tesla as a car rather than a games console there's no noticeable difference in the screen responsiveness of my former Model 3 compared to the current Model Y (Netflix and YouTube likewise on the occasions that I've used them).

 

[UrbanSplash]

I agree with the above. Zero difference from a year 1 model 3 to a current Y in screen responsiveness etc.

 

[qwickshot]

You may not feel the speed difference but it is there, particularly when loading more demanding apps such as the web browser or and of the streaming apps which ultimately just use a web browser. You are talking >10 seconds chopped off the loading time. It was widely reported at the time it was released, people like Bjorn were A-B testing them on release day.

The Intel Atom E8000 was pretty slow when it was released back in 2016. It’s a significant upgrade over the old Tegra system but it is still slow.

It’s not exactly clear which AMD Ryzen CPU is being used other than it’s a quad core. AMD has a track record of custom solutions but anything they have produced with that architecture blows the Intel CPU out of the water in terms of performance, in particular it’s integrated GPU.

Ultimately the concern is that the MCU in the 3/Y is somehow sub standard which couldn’t be further from the reality. It’s bar far the most powerful infotainment system in a car that is actually attainable. Just because it doesn’t have a ‘full fat gaming’ computer in it, doesn’t make it bad.

8gb of ram is plenty for what the MCU is being asked to do which is basically a web browser, a few very lite 3D games and display some rudimentary driving visualisations on the screen which are passed to it from the autopilot computer.

There are plenty of very serviceable windows and mac laptops out there which only have 4gb of ram.

I’m yet to understand what the criticism of using the NVME protocol for storage is yet.

Likewise the person was talking about ‘hardware 4’ which is autopilot cameras and processing but then discussing the specs of the MCU which has nothing to do with autopilot leads me to suggest they are not a reliable source of information.

 

[GRiLLA]

An article from Drive Tesla Canada suggests HW4 may not have the longevity of HW3 (article refers to the Model Y but no reason to believe that the 3 will be different).

“Tesla has been shipping the Model Y equipped with the latest Hardware 4 (HW4) computer in the US for a few months now, but hacker Green (@greentheonly) has discovered the automaker has scaled back the HW4 computer compared to its predecessor.

After getting his hands on another HW4 computer, this time from a Model Y, Green discovered that Tesla had downsized the RAM and storage capacity. The HW4 computer in the Model Y had 8 GB of RAM and 128 GB of storage, half of what is found in the previous generation HW3 computer (16 GB, 256 GB). As Green points out, this all but eliminates the possibility of Steam gaming coming to the Model Y, as it appears to require at least 16GB of RAM on the Model S/X.

One might speculate that Tesla’s decision to reduce the Model Y’s HW4 capabilities stemmed from cost considerations. As Green pointed out, Tesla opted for cost-effective NVMe storage units in the AMD-based systems, which could potentially compromise their longevity in the demanding automotive environment.

While the the specs may be enough when you first receive the vehicle, as time passes concerns arise about potential performance degradation due to insufficient RAM. The Model Y’s 8 GB of RAM could force users to resort to hard resets or endure lag from data swapping on the NVMe storage.

There is still no sign of HW4 in Model Y vehicles being built at Giga Shanghai. For now, only Tesla’s Fremont and Giga Texas factories are building Model Ys with HW4.”

https://twitter.com/i/redirect?url=https://twitter.com/DriveTeslaca/status/1688584354937942017?cxt=HBwWgsDdlcehh-8uAAAA&cn=ZmxleGlibGVfcmVjcw%3D%3D&refsrc=email&t=1+1691447222599&cn=ZmxleGlibGVfcmVjcw==&sig=09dd6586ff93fa6a4757d4a2b00d11281174d370&iid=c28f383a687345979780635042cbfdef&uid=1351053399010242560&nid=244+272699400

Model Y and 3 don't have a GPU, so Steam is simply not going to happen on HW3 or 4, the amount of RAM is immaterial.

 

[randompixel]

When green refers to HW4, I think he's meaning the entire physical unit from a car marked as "with HW4"

https://twitter.com/x/status/1686146086144991232

From the MX HW4 teardown he again talks about all the chips as a whole in the unit

https://twitter.com/x/status/1625905196579663912

The criticism of the NVMe is here and based more on the quality of what Tesla are using

https://twitter.com/x/status/1687966755459571714

 

[Medved_77]

Why wait?

 

[AndyFov]

It's looking like the 0% APR offer has been pulled. It's showing 8.9% on PCP deals.

I think a second hand I-Pace is what I wanted all along.

 

[Adopado]

You may not feel the speed difference but it is there, particularly when loading more demanding apps such as the web browser or and of the streaming apps which ultimately just use a web browser. You are talking >10 seconds chopped off the loading time. It was widely reported at the time it was released, people like Bjorn were A-B testing them on release day.

The Intel Atom E8000 was pretty slow when it was released back in 2016. It’s a significant upgrade over the old Tegra system but it is still slow.

It’s not exactly clear which AMD Ryzen CPU is being used other than it’s a quad core. AMD has a track record of custom solutions but anything they have produced with that architecture blows the Intel CPU out of the water in terms of performance, in particular it’s integrated GPU.

Ultimately the concern is that the MCU in the 3/Y is somehow sub standard which couldn’t be further from the reality. It’s bar far the most powerful infotainment system in a car that is actually attainable. Just because it doesn’t have a ‘full fat gaming’ computer in it, doesn’t make it bad.

8gb of ram is plenty for what the MCU is being asked to do which is basically a web browser, a few very lite 3D games and display some rudimentary driving visualisations on the screen which are passed to it from the autopilot computer.

There are plenty of very serviceable windows and mac laptops out there which only have 4gb of ram.

I’m yet to understand what the criticism of using the NVME protocol for storage is yet.

Likewise the person was talking about ‘hardware 4’ which is autopilot cameras and processing but then discussing the specs of the MCU which has nothing to do with autopilot leads me to suggest they are not a reliable source of information.

RAM is in GB (gigabytes) not gigabits ... there are no serviceable laptops with 4gb of RAM

 

[Zilla91]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1691468388806410240

Curious bit of taping on the rear. Maybe it will be a hatch?

 

[EVMeister]

It's looking like the 0% APR offer has been pulled. It's showing 8.9% on PCP deals.

I think a second hand I-Pace is what I wanted all along.

Seems to be 0% PCP for the Performance model only, making it the cheapest Model 3 on PCP at the moment.

 

[Lord Farquad]

Highland production now in full swing in Shanghai?

Could we see deliveries in Q4? Probably too late for Q3.

Tesla Giga Shanghai Fully Switches to Model 3 Highland Production: Report

Giga Shanghai is fully switching to Model 3 Highland production, according to the information. The production target for August is 7,000 units with a gradual increase in the following months. Production of the updated Model 3 in Fremont could also begin soon.

www.tesmanian.com