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Who Does Not Experience Phantom Braking

Midnightsun

Member
Nov 29, 2020
653
721
Canada
I keep reading about problems with phantom braking however in over a year of ownership, and 24,000km I have never experienced it yet. I realize one hears about problems on a forum as opposed to no problems but how wide spread is it. Are there only a hundred vehicles or so that have this problem? Not too many people will post about not having this issue so I figured I would ask.

I have experienced what I call premature automatic braking when the car judges things are too close for comfort in both my Mercedes and Ridgeline though yet not on the Y.

Am I alone here or are there others who have never experienced phantom braking.
 
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swt2c

Member
Jan 31, 2021
124
78
VA
I keep reading about problems with phantom braking however in over a year of ownership, and 24,000km I have never experienced it yet. I realize one hears about problems on a forum as opposed to no problems but how wide spread is it. Are there only a hundred vehicles or so that have this problem? Not too many people will post about not having this issue so I figured I would ask.

I have experienced what I call premature automatic braking when the car judges things are too close for comfort in both my Mercedes and Ridgeline though yet not on the Y.

Am I alone here or are there others who have never experienced phantom braking.
Do you use TACC and/or Auto Steer? Also, phantom braking seems to be related to the roads you drive on rather than anything to do with a specific vehicle.
 

Tam

Well-Known Member
Nov 25, 2012
10,121
9,211
Visalia, CA
...never...

You may have a different definition of "phantom braking" so you may "never" know it.

I experience it because my definition is very broad: Any slow down that I didn't slow down before I got the automatic system. It could be for any reason such as ghosts, wrong speed sign recognition, slowing down, or sitting like a duck if the automation system missed a turn...

You also might anticipate a slow down such as when the car in front starts to turn, the automation system would slow down but I already know that so I just accelerate as if there is no Autopilot.

I can compensate for the slow downs but it's definitely not smooth!
 

Tam

Well-Known Member
Nov 25, 2012
10,121
9,211
Visalia, CA
My concern is only with radical braking that is dangerous and/ or jarring for occupants of the vehicle.

If it just jiggles the speed a bit I really don’t care and I just don’t see how it matters.

I adjust to Tesla slowdowns very well and I've thought none of it. Until I've got passengers. Every single one of them complains. No exceptions: From preschoolers to senior citizens.

That makes me very conscious and makes me care.
 
My concern is only with radical braking that is dangerous and/ or jarring for occupants of the vehicle.

If it just jiggles the speed a bit I really don’t care and I just don’t see how it matters.
The fact it is doing it all in the first place means something isn't right.

I have had numerous issues to the point a lot of the time I don't want to use TACC. I have more issues on secondary highways but even have had it on some 4-6 lane interstates as well.

I have had them on sunny, well-lit days, where it mistakes a shadow as a "threat" and applied moderate to intense pressure on the brakes. I have almost been rear ended several times. This is my biggest regret about the car to date. When they took out the radar, I think it made the car a lot worse. I drove demo cars on the same roads, similar conditions that had radar. Never had phantom braking issues. My car, sans radar, I have a lot more.

I signed the little disclaimer saying I was getting the car that had changed from when I ordered it. If I had known how bad it would have been, I likely would have tried to find one that still had radar. The amount of phantom braking from TACC means the cruise control is more stress/hassle than it is worth. On long trips I'll likely have to go to the dumb cruise method with it.
 

bruce4000

Member
Jul 8, 2019
238
423
Seattle
I have a vision only MY. I only use tacc and Only had what I would call moderate phantom braking a couple of times on freeway. Usually in construction zone where was speed limit confusion. Never on overpasses no matter if sunny or not. On the other hand, tried it on winding 2 lane highway and definite fail but not really appropriate for tacc it seams.
 

AlexHung

Member
Mar 13, 2021
392
395
Santa Cruz, CA
I keep reading about problems with phantom braking however in over a year of ownership, and 24,000km I have never experienced it yet. I realize one hears about problems on a forum as opposed to no problems but how wide spread is it. Are there only a hundred vehicles or so that have this problem? Not too many people will post about not having this issue so I figured I would ask.

I have experienced what I call premature automatic braking when the car judges things are too close for comfort in both my Mercedes and Ridgeline though yet not on the Y.

Am I alone here or are there others who have never experienced phantom braking.
8000+ miles. Phantom braking = 0. Premature automatic braking = 1.
 
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ftmaybe

Member
Feb 11, 2020
285
436
San Joaquin
I've put about 40k miles across 3 teslas since Dec 2019. Initially the phantom braking was pretty annoying and happened regularly but it has definitely gotten better over time. Now the full pressure braking happens rarely, leaving only the mild/brief slowdowns occasionally. BUT - all 3 cars have had radar.

I am also concerned about picking up a car without radar (we have a 3LR on order). I have been using cruise control to get to work for 20 years now, that commute is half freeway and half two lane roads. Currently I have almost no issues with my radar equipped teslas. Definitely do not want to end up being unable to use TACC at all due to shortcomings of vision only...
 

ZzzzZ

Member
Sep 1, 2021
73
43
New Jersey
Hello guys, I have 2 MY's, one with radar, and one vision only. For the past 3 months or so I've been driving vision only and the phantom braking is really annoying to me at this point. Like to the point that im thinking of getting an ice car for my wife and keeping radar equiped MY... Now i haven't driven my MY with a radar for the past few months so i don't know if i would be getting the same phantom braking or not, but I'm going to switch it up this week and drive earlier MY with radar and report back here soon. I don't remember having phantom braking though being an issue at all with radar though, and that was 9 months of driving it.
 

Prime203

Member
Jul 29, 2021
29
22
SoCal
Have a MYP picked up August 2021.. no radar.. phantom breaking regularly on the highway. I’d say one out of every 5 uses, some mild, usually moderate, on rare occasion abrupt and jarring. My wife has a Volvo with pilot assist plus and it honestly does a better job without any phantom breaking though disengages more frequently. Removal of radar seems to have really messed things up. Cali roads with poor lane lines prob don’t help.
 

avs007

Member
May 14, 2021
610
477
PacNW
Tons of miles in Oregon on Autosteer and TACC very few issues with phantom braking.

But I think I’m still driving with the older radar based stack so that might be the difference.
Honestly, I think it's more to do with road conditions, and road layout. I'm also in the PacNW, and there are a few places where I can induce different behaviors 100% of the time...

One place, there is a road with a sweeping turn going down a hill. There is a large power transformer adjacent to the roadway in the middle of the curve... My Acura will slam on the brakes when I round that curve..... My Infiniti does not do this if I drive down that road, however, if I drive on the side street that T's with this road, right where the power transformer is... Half the time, my Infiniti will not only slam on the brakes, it will engage the seat belt pretensioners, as if it thinks a collision is imminent... My Vision Only Y does not phantom brake here at all... However, when I drive down this same road, my Vision Y will have a terrible time with the auto highbeams, as it gets fooled by a few overly reflective signs/reflectors, and hidden mercury vapor lights behind trees... However, my Infiniti does the same thing. The Infiniti is quicker to turn off the brights, but the Y is quicker to turn the brights back on...

There is another section of road, that is another sweeping curve, but this time has a light post right in the middle of the curve. Both my Acura and my Infiniti will momentarily slam the brakes, if I'm in the lane closest to the street light... My Vision Y does not brake in this section...

There is a section of freeway, on my commute... My Vision Y will report the speed limit as dropping from 60 to 25 for a 1/2 mile stretch of freeway, I have no idea why... There are no speed signs whatsover, and there is a burm on the left, and a freeway interchange on the right... I've taken that exit before, and the Y correctly says the speed limit is 60 throught the entire exit.. It only reports 25 if I stay on the freeway, for a 1/2 mile... My Infiniti, as well as Google, and Waze, all correctly report the speed limit as 60 in this section of freeway. I have no idea why my Y insists the speed limit is 25 on this section of freeway.

The only time so far in all my driving (which includes road trips for work every month), that I can get my Y to momentarily hit the brakes, is when I'm in the far right lane of a freeway, and there is a large vehicle merging. Sometimes if the other vehicle drives in lockstep with me in the merging lane, my Y will momentarily brake scrubbing about 10-15 mph off my speed. I can't get it to do it every time, but it seems to have to do with some combination with size of the vehicle, and how wide the lane/merge is, as I know the car has a tendency to drift to the right side, which may have something to do with this.. I haven't really had any problems with AP other than this, so I tend to just stay in the middle lane when using AP if I see/anticipate a car merging on the right.

I haven't tried to use AP on the windy roads near my house, but I use TACC all the time, and have never had my Y hit the brakes on me, which is contrary to my other cars. Those cars I don't even need to be using cruise for it to do that, as the conditions I listed earlier, I can get it to do with just the collision mitigation system.
 
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