2018 Nissan Leaf - $29,990. 40kWh battery

[Chuq]

Yes, that's why I said base. The $29,990 vehicle will charge at 3.3 kW, neutering the perceived price advantage. As with the current-gen Leaf, the mid-tier trim will be the true base, and that will surely cost a few thousand more.

Ah.. here in Australia the only Leafs are 2012 models with the same trim - 3kW charger only. We never got the 360 camera, the 6kW charger, the 30kWh battery. I thought all new Leafs in other countries were 6kW - didn't realise they flogged this as an optional extra! :-(

 

[Zaxxon]

In the US there are currently 3 trims: S, SV, and SL. The S has no DCFC and a 3.3 kW charger. And no nav.

The SV is the true usable base, with DCFC, 6.6kW charger, and the top-end infotainment. The info released today makes me think 2018 will bring a similar setup, with the base being something no one will really want but allows Nissan to claim a sub-$30k entry point.

 

[EV-lutioin]

Why is it so hard for these large companies to create a fast-charging network? All they have to do is put some chargers at every Nissan/Chevy dealership in the U.S. and the shazam they have a charging network. Tesla's Supercharging network essentially ends the comparison between Tesla and other EV's. Honestly, who wants to spend tens of thousands of dollars on a car you can't travel long distances in?

 

[Zoomit]

Yeah you are right it says "alert to 80%" in 40 minutes. At 40kWh that works out to ~48kW. So no sign of the "150kW" rumored next gen CHAdeMO. Maybe the 60kWh version will do better.

Per Car & Driver, the e-Plus (60kWh) version will take 100kW via CHAdeMO.

 

[dhanson865]

40 kWh battery with 3.x KW charger is stupid.

40 kWh battery with no active cooling is stupid.

Combine the two and you have a hot battery pack getting hotter every hour it sits using that stupidly slow L2 charger.

Add parking in the sun in the southern US and it's a recipe for degradation of range.

In 2018 they'll have a higher kWh option that will cost even more and still have no active cooling. I can't imagine anyone who knows about the heat/degradation issue spending the money it will take to buy one in the southern US.

 

[mblakele]

Why is it so hard for these large companies to create a fast-charging network? All they have to do is put some chargers at every Nissan/Chevy dealership in the U.S. and the shazam they have a charging network. Tesla's Supercharging network essentially ends the comparison between Tesla and other EV's. Honestly, who wants to spend tens of thousands of dollars on a car you can't travel long distances in?

I think you're right, but Nissan has made a little progress by partnering with a private charging network:

Nissan No Charge to Charge | EVgo

Apparently (some) Nissan owners can sign up to get two years of free chademo access, 30 minutes at a time. Looking at the evgo map, I don't think you could cross the country that way — not easily. But it looks functional enough for intercity travel in some areas, especially the northeastern US and California.

That's a positive development, I think. And I hope alternative networks will continue to expand. In the long run it isn't good for anyone if Tesla has a monopoly. But for now I'll stick with SuperChargers.

 

[Zaxxon]

Again, I own one. I have the No Charge to Charge access.

It's not at all comparable. If you're lucky enough to be traveling a route where there are EVGo locations, each generally has one unit. If someone else is charging, you're waiting. If it's down, you're using L2. If it works, you're charging at 30-50 kW. After you scan the card and hope it works. If it doesn't, you're calling an 800 # to authenticate.

They're trying on some level, but it's the minor leagues.

 

[Xminus6]

Why is it so hard for these large companies to create a fast-charging network? All they have to do is put some chargers at every Nissan/Chevy dealership in the U.S. and the shazam they have a charging network. Tesla's Supercharging network essentially ends the comparison between Tesla and other EV's. Honestly, who wants to spend tens of thousands of dollars on a car you can't travel long distances in?

I think one of the issues is that Corporate doesn’t really have that much power over the dealers. The dealers are independent businesses and must be compelled in some way to install chargers. Considering EVs are paving the way to dealerships losing their main source of income, I could see that being a sticking point. In LA, the Nissan dealerships have the chargers because so many of them are Leaf-certified dealers. But I think they’d receive a considerable amount of pushback on mandating that dealerships all install DCFC chargers.

 

[stopcrazypp]

Why is it so hard for these large companies to create a fast-charging network? All they have to do is put some chargers at every Nissan/Chevy dealership in the U.S. and the shazam they have a charging network. Tesla's Supercharging network essentially ends the comparison between Tesla and other EV's. Honestly, who wants to spend tens of thousands of dollars on a car you can't travel long distances in?

They are already doing that to some extend, but this is not a viable solution. Dealerships simply aren't good charging locations for many reasons: many of them aren't near places you want to spend 30 minutes to 1 hour at, aren't at optimal location for road trips, open only during business hours, chargers installed somewhere that is easily blocked by other cars, charger may be prioritized for dealership use, etc.

A serious network needs to be installed away from dealerships.

 

[schonelucht]

The new leaf would have been a nice EV 18 months ago. Now, much less so. Let's circle back when the 60kWh model comes along. But there is a risk we will come to the same conclusion then : that it would have been a great car 18 months ago or so.

 

[DurandalAI]

48kW is about all I could get from Tesla’s superchargers on our last trip. Tried five different stalls. I guess it was the ambient heat (near 100F)?

I can’t imagine home charging at 3kW though. That seems uselessly slow and ruins the Leaf

The 3.3kW charging rate is crippling. I could get much more utility out of my 2012 Leaf SL if it had a 6.6~kW charger. My commute is 20 miles each way, and there are days where I must go home to get the kiddo, then drive back into town for extracurricular activities, then drive back.
I must make sure I charge at work (something I can do now, I'm not sure with my new job) to be full, drive home, get the kiddo, charge at home as long as I possibly can, take the extra-slow route that saves me 5-7 miles of range to extracurricular activity, then take the freeway at a reduced rate of speed back. That's some serious dedication towards my hatred for gasoline. 6.6kW of charging would make it MUCH easier for the period in which I'm charging at home, waiting for it to get to a high enough SoC so that I can continue the rest of my day.

 

[ggies07]

0 kWh battery with no active cooling is stupid.

ok, so no liquid cooled battery this time eh? I was looking for this info but couldn't find anything....maybe I missed it.

 

[ggies07]

Yes, that's why I said base. The $29,990 vehicle will charge at 3.3 kW, neutering the perceived price advantage. As with the current-gen Leaf, the mid-tier trim will be the true base, and that will surely cost a few thousand more.

And if you are at the mid-trim level for $32,000, why not spring for the base Model 3 and get more range + charging network? .......crazy no one else can make a competitor......

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

In the US there are currently 3 trims: S, SV, and SL. The S has no DCFC and a 3.3 kW charger. And no nav.

The SV is the true usable base, with DCFC, 6.6kW charger, and the top-end infotainment. The info released today makes me think 2018 will bring a similar setup, with the base being something no one will really want but allows Nissan to claim a sub-$30k entry point.

However, with the S you can get the charging option, which for $1,770 adds CHAdeMO and 6.6kW. If the stripper isn't the real base, then S+$1770 is the _real_ base model.

 

[SageBrush]

In the US there are currently 3 trims: S, SV, and SL. The S has no DCFC and a 3.3 kW charger. And no nav.

The SV is the true usable base, with DCFC, 6.6kW charger, and the top-end infotainment. The info released today makes me think 2018 will bring a similar setup, with the base being something no one will really want but allows Nissan to claim a sub-$30k entry point.

My 2013 'S' LEAF came with an option package that included DCFC and 6 kW AC charger. I don't know if the same is offered on current models or the new 40 kWh LEAF2. I want to say that the option cost ~ $1-2k USD, but I'm not positive.

Addendum: Post #154 clarified things.

 

[SageBrush]

In 2018 they'll have a higher kWh option that will cost even more and still have no active cooling. I can't imagine anyone who knows about the heat/degradation issue spending the money it will take to buy one in the southern US.

Even S. California reports accelerated battery degradation.

Just like the earlier generation LEAF1, these cars will be excellent value at $10k. I find it very hard to believe that Nissan will happily supply this market niche.

 

[Zaxxon]

That's true--I forgot they had an add-on to the S to bring the charging up to par with the SV. Still, though, the bottom line is no one who hasn't been duped will buy the $29,990 vehicle. In reality it's a $31k-$32k base for the functional vehicle. As ggies said above, if the choice is $32k for an entry-level Leaf vs $35k for the base Model 3...

 

[mrkisskiss]

I have to say... regardless of the car itself, whoever did the projections for the reveal of the new LEAF should get a cookie... absolutely outstanding stage design and projection (and driving).

 

[Zaxxon]

...And whoever did the translation should be replaced for future reveals. My wife legitimately couldn't tell whether it was a TTS engine or a person. Only the stutters and delays made it apparent to me that it was a person. It was super cringe-inducing until the English-speaking presenters came out.

 

[Jeff N]

Per Car & Driver, the e-Plus (60kWh) version will take 100kW via CHAdeMO.

The actual quote from C&D is:

Next year’s 60-kW Leaf e+ will be the first CHAdeMO-capable car to offer 100-kW charging in the United States (versus a 50-kW max for the standard car).

This doesn't tell us much about what the 60 kWh LEAF's actual charging rate will be but it's a hint that it will be above 50 kW. C&D is likely correct that no existing CHAdeMO vehicle is marketed as charging faster than 50 kW but the Kia Soul EV has been shown to charge at up to around 70 kW at a "100 kW" charger in Norway.

0 kWh battery with no active cooling is stupid.

ok, so no liquid cooled battery this time eh?

A 0 kWh battery with no active cooling actually does make sense.