ALL CyberTruck discussion

[StealthP3D]

This video just re-enforces my decision to reserve the Triple, with 500 miles of range. Most of the trucks in this comparison exceed 500 mile of range, but the quickly drop for the same reasons the EV range drops. The smallest Ford gas tank is 23 gallons * 20 MPG - yields 460 miles of range, the next tank up is 26 gallons * 20 MPG yields 520 miles and the largest tank is 36 gallons (RAPTOR), which gets 16 MPG yields a 576 miles (downhill with a tailwind driving the speed limit - never seen a RAPTOR do that in my life), so the CT is highly competitive.
Source: Gas savings will sell every truck Tesla can make until 2024

Thank you @Electroman for mentioning TLDR, I had never heard of them before.

Comments on the video: Off-roading with street tires on the X which is essentially a minivan was stupid. The trailer form factor they chose for the test couldn't have been worse, but it did represent a worst case scenario, however they never changed their speed to accommodate their goals (which as all Tesla owners know can happen when pushed to the limit).

This video re-enforces what I already knew, the Bollinger range is useless (200 Miles), the Rivian too small, the Model X is a minivan, however the CyberTruck pretty much fits my use case for weekend towing of a car to Summit Point Raceway, getting firewood, camping with 16 inches of ground clearance and 35" wheels, and being a suburban homeowner. I don't need a Diesel long hauler, to tow a horse trailer up a 7% grade here in Virginia. Most trucks and SUV's here in NVA are mommy mobiles going to soccer, you bet they will buy a Tesla.

2 Triples reserved (wife wants one too, just please make the damn seatbelts height adjustable)

I can't believe you posted that video!

Do you know that guy is friends with Anton Wahlman, the author of probably around 100 anti-Tesla articles on Seeking Alpha? No data frrom him is credible or worth wasting your time on. He will do everything in his power to make the numbers look bad for Tesla. He's the same guy that was behind the fake crash of a Model 3 to demonstrate how long it takes to get a Tesla repaired. Not credible info.

 

[Electroman]

Ha. No idea on the Whalman connection.

It might help if you posted your comments on that YT video so that others might learn.

 

[lascavarian]

There is speculation on the impact of winter/cold on the battery. This will be an issue for the semi as well so we should presume that Tesla has has had years to work on the issue related to pack thermodynamics.

It seems to me the large pack will have the ability to use a portion of it’s stored energy to thermally condition the pack and reduce range impact due to cold. Once pulling a large load, the pack will tend to self-heat much more than an auto pack.

Unless I missed it, we don’t know the exact location of the pack. We don’t know if it is thermally insulated. We don’t know much about the long range battery at all 3 years down the road.

Battery day will reveal something of this.

 

[jerry33]

What percentage of truck buyers actually tow? As you're out driving notice the percentage of pickup trucks with a trailer, it's tiny. What percentage of trucks are actually used for work? What percentage of those work trucks ever tow anything, and of those that do, how many do more than local towing of medium sized equipment trailers? And finally, of all those trucks that actually do meaningful towing on a regular basis, what percentage of those have to deal with severe winter temperatures? I think the percentage of trucking which can't be served by the Cyber is rather small, and thus the Cyber can in fact make a big dent in the big 3 truck sales as more and more people catch on.

It depends on where you look. Now I'll grant you that most of the time pickups aren't towing anything, but anytime I go out of town I see a lot of pickups pulling trailers, boats or have large campers. So sure, any individual pickup that tows probably only tows a few times a year, but it's those few times that are important to the owners. What I'm sure of is that Tesla can sell every Cybertruck they make. Some won't buy because of range fear when towing, but that won't stop folks from flocking to the Cybertruck. And the towing range is all speculation until we actually see the Tri come into production (the only one that you'd want for any significant amount of towing).

 

[VT_EE]

Well, keep rolling the 'Disagrees', but I will say this:

CT will sell well beating Rivian, F150 EV and other imposters. it will make some money for Tesla at some point. But it will NOT make dent on the big 3 truck sales.

Why? Because when you tow with even half the load the range will fall dramatically by as much as 50%. And once the usable range is less than 200, it becomes less useful, more so in winter. So part time trucksters, who occasionally go to Home depot or tow a boat once a year, I am sure CT will be fine. But those that depend on a truck for a living day in and day out, having less than 200 miles range on a cold winter day with 3000 pounds on the bed, is a show stopper.

I thought this is a fair and balanced article: What Ford F-150 owners think of the Tesla Cybertruck

TLDR: F150 owners love what they saw in the reveal, but skeptical about the winter range under load. Unless they actually see it in action through a harsh winter.

I agree. The CT is a tool that will meet the needs of many people, but there are scenarios where it just doesn't make sense. Towing heavy loads, long distances in the Michigan winter would be a pain and a non-starter for most tradesmen. On the other hand, landscapers in Arizona should love this thing. I see this thing selling well.

 

[Fred42]

Yet another YouTube video:

CT is really breaking the Internet now, this one is noticeable because:

• He is a Ram 3500 owner
• He drove his truck 2.5 times around the country
• So this means a real truck owner is switching.
• His channel has 3.3 million sub and has nothing to do with trucks, yet he made a lengthy video about it.

CT as a meme machine already earned back whatever resources were put into it.

You didn't mention he's already in the fold. He has an S P90D.

 

[jebinc]

There is speculation on the impact of winter/cold on the battery. This will be an issue for the semi as well so we should presume that Tesla has has had years to work on the issue related to pack thermodynamics.

It seems to me the large pack will have the ability to use a portion of it’s stored energy to thermally condition the pack and reduce range impact due to cold. Once pulling a large load, the pack will tend to self-heat much more than an auto pack.

Unless I missed it, we don’t know the exact location of the pack. We don’t know if it is thermally insulated. We don’t know much about the long range battery at all 3 years down the road.

Battery day will reveal something of this.

"Battery day"?

 

[JRP3]

It doesn't matter most don't attach any trailer at all, or rarely do.

Actually it does matter. Most people don't buy a vehicle for a task they'll never do. Bottom line: Tesla will sell every Cybertruck they can make as fast as they can make them, that's all that matters.

 

[jerry33]

It doesn't matter most don't attach any trailer at all, or rarely do.

Expanding on this a bit. It depends on how you define rarely. Take a typical suburbanite with 25 miles each way commute and likes to camp, fish, hunt, or other similar activities. That's 10K miles per year for commuting. Going on two trips a year pulling a camper, and counting days, that's 14/365 to 28/365 3% to 7% is rarely in anyone's book. However, if each vacation trip is 2K miles (assumes 2 trips/year), that's 28% of the total miles--not so small. So the chances of seeing this truck are small because there are very few days where it's traveling towing something, but the percentage of use is not small at all. I suspect that most who say "rarely do" are thinking days, not miles. Of course there's a big percentage of those who never tow, but that's a different set of people. For the people who do tow, it's actually a much larger concern than many think.

 

[PACEMD]

It's always a compromise, no vehicle has all advantages, or will do everything. The Cybertruck is not setup to haul 20k lb loads like the F350 but the F350 has horrible efficiency, no better range than the Cybertruck, is way too big for most folks, has a diesel ICE motor and mechanics, and absolutely sucks off-road. Hell, the F250/F350 can get stuck on wet, flat, grass.

 

[Nocturnal]

Expanding on this a bit. It depends on how you define rarely. Take a typical suburbanite with 25 miles each way commute and likes to camp, fish, hunt, or other similar activities. That's 10K miles per year for commuting. Going on two trips a year pulling a camper, and counting days, that's 14/365 to 28/365 3% to 7% is rarely in anyone's book. However, if each vacation trip is 2K miles (assumes 2 trips/year), that's 28% of the total miles--not so small. So the chances of seeing this truck are small because there are very few days where it's traveling towing something, but the percentage of use is not small at all. I suspect that most who say "rarely do" are thinking days, not miles. Of course there's a big percentage of those who never tow, but that's a different set of people. For the people who do tow, it's actually a much larger concern than many think.

The data I've seen says that 75% of trucks tow once a year or less. And yes for sure, heavy users have very different needs. I hope the CT works for some of them but if not then oh well. Small portion of the market and they will be handled by Gen 2 EV trucks for sure.\

There is speculation on the impact of winter/cold on the battery. This will be an issue for the semi as well so we should presume that Tesla has has had years to work on the issue related to pack thermodynamics.

It seems to me the large pack will have the ability to use a portion of it’s stored energy to thermally condition the pack and reduce range impact due to cold. Once pulling a large load, the pack will tend to self-heat much more than an auto pack.

Unless I missed it, we don’t know the exact location of the pack. We don’t know if it is thermally insulated. We don’t know much about the long range battery at all 3 years down the road.

Battery day will reveal something of this.

I think that's the key. Cold batteries suck when I'm driving to work for 30 miles, but far less of an issue when you are hauling a trailer for 8 hours. ​

 

[jerry33]

The data I've seen says that 75% of trucks tow once a year or less. And yes for sure, heavy users have very different needs. I hope the CT works for some of them but if not then oh well. Small portion of the market and they will be handled by Gen 2 EV trucks for sure.\

I think that's the key. Cold batteries suck when I'm driving to work for 30 miles, but far less of an issue when you are hauling a trailer for 8 hours. ​

Agreed that no one vehicle will work for everyone. The point I was trying to make was that the "once a year" might be a significant part of the miles driven. This doesn't count the many boat owners, who don't drive so far to the lake but drive often. The 16" ground clearance and tilting bed will be a real boon for them.

Typically we go on two or three trips a year. Distance varies from 2K to 5+K miles. Overall it's about 50% of the total miles on the S. The Cybertruck will be even better than the S for our purposes, but we're in the group that doesn't tow.

 

[ZsoZso]

Actually it does matter. Most people don't buy a vehicle for a task they'll never do. Bottom line: Tesla will sell every Cybertruck they can make as fast as they can make them, that's all that matters.

I agree with the first part of your bottom line, but not the last. Yes, Tesla will sell every CT they can make, because it attracts a lot of people who want something "different" and it also has very attractive specs for its price point. It is also a very good impact (in terms of reducing CO2 emissions) if it can switch some of those "urban warriors" who drive around in pickup trucks for the tough image but never/rarely actually need the hauling/towing capacity.

However, selling all CTs that Tesla can make is not all what matters. Changing the minds of most pickup truck owners to go electric would matter too, and that is not going to happen with this polarizing design. A lot of conservative thinking pickup truckers will not go anywhere near such futuristic looking truck, but they would have considered a more traditional looking EV truck if the specs and price are competitive.

I believe the problem Tesla was facing is that they could not put together a truck that was competitive both on specs and price at the same time with a more traditional look. They had to go to this extreme (form follows function) in order to be able to lower the cost while delivering good hauling and towing capacity.

ps: Rivian and Bolinger offer traditional looking EV pickups, but their prices are way too high for the specs they provide. They will appeal to some niche, but they will not sell in the volumes that matter.

 

[Nocturnal]

Agreed that no one vehicle will work for everyone. The point I was trying to make was that the "once a year" might be a significant part of the miles driven. This doesn't count the many boat owners, who don't drive so far to the lake but drive often. The 16" ground clearance and tilting bed will be a real boon for them.

Typically we go on two or three trips a year. Distance varies from 2K to 5+K miles. Overall it's about 50% of the total miles on the S. The Cybertruck will be even better than the S for our purposes, but we're in the group that doesn't tow.

Definitely. I love my 3 so much but that tri motor CT would make family trips better on every metric. The CT specs have me even more bullish on Tesla's future. If they can do that for 69k in a truck, what can they do in a modified S or 3 body?

I'm dying to see if they can make a gooseneck setup work, at least in some fashion.

 

[PACEMD]

However, selling all CTs that Tesla can make is not all what matters. Changing the minds of most pickup truck owners to go electric would matter too, and that is not going to happen with this polarizing design. A lot of conservative thinking pickup truckers will not go anywhere near such futuristic looking truck, but they would have considered a more traditional looking EV truck if the specs and price are competitive.

Converting that crowd will take a little more time but will be no problem at all. Bottom line, cost, and function will win the day, once a few cross the line the rest will follow. The conservative truck crowd here in Montana could give a fu*k about how it looks. If it does a better job at what they need a truck to do and saves money, Bob's your uncle. Solar is huge with the ranch crowd here. If you are talking about urban/rural red necks they will go along with the crowd. Always do.........

 

[Nocturnal]

Converting that crowd will take a little more time but will be no problem at all. Bottom line, cost, and function will win the day, once a few cross the line the rest will follow. The conservative truck crowd here in Montana could give a fu*k about how it looks. If it does a better job at what they need a truck to do and saves money, Bob's your uncle. Solar is huge with the ranch crowd here. If you are talking about urban/rural red necks they will go along with the crowd. Always do.........

Actually truck users then, not urban cowboys who see their trucks like a fashion accessory.

 

[PACEMD]

Right, and fashions are the easiest to manipulate.........

 

[JRP3]

However, selling all CTs that Tesla can make is not all what matters. Changing the minds of most pickup truck owners to go electric would matter too, and that is not going to happen with this polarizing design. A lot of conservative thinking pickup truckers will not go anywhere near such futuristic looking truck, but they would have considered a more traditional looking EV truck if the specs and price are competitive.

There will always be those more resistant to change. When they start seeing more and more Cybertrucks on the road it will look less strange, and when they start hearing and seeing the performance they will have to change or be left behind. Those can buy more conventional looking vehicles from other OEM's, if conventional looking vehicles are still being built. Tesla does not have to be all things to all people.

 

[Sudre]

Mid-west Model S construction worker over here.... All jobs I go to I am, "The Tesla guy." I have not had many conversation about Tesla at work because they make cars. There has been a serious uptick in Tesla queries and they are all about range. Very little about towing.

In the Midwest if you are towing you are buying an F350 as a starter. You have your F150 for your daily driver. The CT is not replacing the vacation travel RV work horse, the F350. I talked to a guy that RV camps and he is towing easily over 15000 and loading up for all the kids, wife and kitchen sink so seriously probably almost 20K#. You need bicycles, the four wheeler, enough flotation devices to blanket the lake and don't forget the garage full of LED xmas lights, streamers and walkway lighting. SO.... once you have loaded the RV onto the 5th-wheel hitch you then pack 90% of the house and garage into the RV, pack the 4 kids into the back of the truck and off you go. Distance? About 200 miles one-way. They've only got a week here guys. No driving for several days. It's a one day drive MAYBE 2 to the Lake of the Ozarks or Mark Twain Forest. The adventurous ones make the extra long drive to the Buffalo National River in Arkansas. Oh.. I forgot the 3 dozen coolers. at least 7 are for beer, a few for the fish (that really never get caught), 1 for the kids soda and the rest the wife has for the pre-planned meals (since it won't be fresh fish).

Those F350 guys are still asking about the CT because they need the daily driver. It is a really hard sell tho because of the looks. I know a few are already sold. The rest are going to start ordering once the first guy shows up and he becomes "the Tesla guy" because they like that attention... I honestly don't anymore. I'll be happy to hand of the torch.

And yes those are dual axle 1 ton F350s.

 

[MichaelP90DL]

Wouldn't this look cool on the roof of a Cybertruck?