Autopilot punishment

[BerTX]

try driving down here in south florida and you will change your opinion.

for reference the lockout above 90 is a "feature" which was introduced with AP 2.

AP 1 will flash the red hands to remind you to take over but there is no lockout of autopilot which can be re engaged as soon as the speed is less than 90.

When did this change? I have AP1 and the only time I have exceeded 90 mph with AS engaged, it definitely locked me out.

 

[davidc18]

Have to still be on firmware 7.1 - You are right, I forgot that it changed for AP 1 cars with FW 8.0. Since we have stayed on 7.1 I was associating AP 2.0 with Firmware 8.0 which was in error.

 

[AMPd]

I'm gonna call BS on the need to occasionally exceed 90mph on US public roads for "safe operation of the vehicle".

Then you haven't driven by the Harris Ranch cow farm on i5 in California.

Just drove by and had to do over 100 to safely get through the scent.

 

[oktane]

This may not quell your outrage, but how about disengaging the AP when you want to accelerate past 90 mph?

In this one scenario I didn't have time to mess with the AP controls, just steer the car and mash the accelerator.

In CA highway traffic routinely exceeds 85mph. Passing maneuvers should be conducted by at least 15% speed differential. Unlike trucks passing each other at 1mph differential at the detriment of everyone behind them.

 

[chillaban]

try driving down here in south florida and you will change your opinion.

for reference the lockout above 90 is a "feature" which was introduced with AP 2.

AP 1 will flash the red hands to remind you to take over but there is no lockout of autopilot which can be re engaged as soon as the speed is less than 90.

That's not true at all. This limitation came in firmware 8.0, and I hit it first on AP1 before I learned not to do that.

 

[McRat]

Accelerating past the speed in which Autopilot operates, which exceeds the speed limit in nearly all situations in the US, results in being locked out until you pull over and reset by placing in park and exiting the vehicle. Seems reasonable to me.

Seems reasonable as long as you never drive another brand of car for a day out west. The car actually tries to punish you for bad manners? AP3 will just call the cops on you? AP4 will not restart if skip a suggested service date?

 

[Dublin 'Eer]

I agree it's a pain, but all you have to do is take the next exit, stop, quickly turn off the car, and turn it back on. Your AP will be back. I've had to do it a time to two after speeding up to pass idiots who think the left lane is for driving leisurely and not for passing.

 

[kort677]

try driving down here in south florida and you will change your opinion.

for reference the lockout above 90 is a "feature" which was introduced with AP 2.

AP 1 will flash the red hands to remind you to take over but there is no lockout of autopilot which can be re engaged as soon as the speed is less than 90.

not right at all, hit 91 mph with AP 1 and in the penalty box you go
in addition there is no need to go over 90 for any reason, IMHO if you encounter a driver that you need to go over 90mph to pass it would be wiser to slow it down a bit and let the guy go on his way

 

[kort677]

Seems reasonable as long as you never drive another brand of car for a day out west. The car actually tries to punish you for bad manners? AP3 will just call the cops on you? AP4 will not restart if skip a suggested service date?

what nonsense! if you want to go over 90 mph, fine, you just can't do it with the AP on

 

[ucmndd]

In CA highway traffic routinely exceeds 85mph. Passing maneuvers should be conducted by at least 15% speed differential. Unlike trucks passing each other at 1mph differential at the detriment of everyone behind them.

More silly excuses that always revolve around some supposed special case where local conditions demand excessive speed to be "safe". In this thread alone we've already surfaced the special cases of "South Florida", "California", and "the west".

BS. I'd wager that 99 out of every 100 times you accelerate past 90mph in the name of safely operating a vehicle, there are multiple safer options that involve decelerating.

I'm not exactly a slow driver, but come on. Let's give up on the idea that we excessively speed because we have to for safety.

The AP behavior seems reasonable to me.

 

[AnxietyRanger]

You guys forget there are countries where exceeding 90 mph actually is legal.

But be that as it may, nobody has still offered a good reason why this is.

AP disengaging would do the same trick and would be understandable. Why the lockout?

Lockout for avoiding nags is understandable. It assumes you are not paying attention, fine. Take those nags seriously is reasonable for a Level 2 system.

Lockout for a momentary speed increase seems pointless.

 

[AnxietyRanger]

I think it's a bit much to expect the current system to understand why you exceeded the safe Autosteer limit and cut you some slack, or to take responsibility for the exceeding of the speed by the driver because of its inappropriate actions.

IMO your message shows why no lockout for excessive speed should exist... the system does not understand, thus it should not be the judge of manual controls or manual corrections. When the driver makes a manual correction, AP should just stand aside for that time.

The system as is encourages to avoid even momentary speeds exceeding 90 mph, while the system at the same time is lacking understanding of the traffic situations in which it does this encouragement. This is not a good thing.

APs responsibility could easily be absolved by disengaging at 90 mph. That is fine and understandable.

Nobody has offered any good reason for the lockout in this scenario IMO. Lockout for missing nags is a completely different (and understandable) thing.

 

[BerTX]

IMO your message shows why no lockout for excessive speed should exist... the system does not understand, thus it should not be the judge of manual controls or manual corrections. When the driver makes a manual correction, AP should just stand aside for that time.

The system as is encourages to avoid even momentary speeds exceeding 90 mph, while the system at the same time is lacking understanding of the traffic situations in which it does this encouragement. This is not a good thing.

APs responsibility could easily be absolved by disengaging at 90 mph. That is fine and understandable.

Nobody has offered any good reason for the lockout in this scenario IMO. Lockout for missing nags is a completely different (and understandable) thing.

I agree that the system "should not be the judge of manual controls or manual corrections". And it isn't. The car was not put in manual control. The car comes out of AS when the brake is pressed or the wheel is moved. I guess it needs to disengage when the accelerator is applied, too.

 

[Argonaut]

Then you haven't driven by the Harris Ranch cow farm on i5 in California.

Just drove by and had to do over 100 to safely get through the scent.

Bioweapon defense mode!

 

[bonnie]

Bioweapon defense mode!

Fact.

 

[croman]

If AP does increase safety, I believe it is reprehensible for Tesla to punish drivers for simply exceeding the safe operating limits. As mentioned, it should simply not operate >90mph and a warning blip should explain (much like holding the accelerator while TACC/AS is engaged will trigger a "cruise will not brake" warning).

Then when the user decelerates back to an acceptable speed, they can reengage TACC/AS.

Tesla on one hand stresses AP is a safety feature but which manufacturer takes away your seat belt if you drive unsafely? Its unconscionable, especially given Tesla's marketing statements.

 

[Electroman]

OP has expressed in so many posts and in so many topics that he hates AP, and it is a scam perpetrated by Tesla and evil Elon.

So now he is upset that AP is temporarily unavailable until he can pull over, press park and resume his drive again ? Now he is complaining about absence of AP even for a few minutes?

And remember this is only Autosteer that is not available. TACC is of course available all the time.

Some folks are perennial complainers.

Tesla on one hand stresses AP is a safety feature but which manufacturer takes away your seat belt if you drive unsafely? Its unconscionable, especially given Tesla's marketing statements.

unconscionable? hyperbole? relax. TACC is always available and that is the bulk of safety what Tesla is referring to. Autosteer is not safety feature as of Level 2, but more of a driver convenience.

 

[croman]

unconscionable? hyperbole? relax. TACC is always available and that is the bulk of safety what Tesla is referring to. Autosteer is not safety feature as of Level 2, but more of a driver convenience.

I see. I thought TACC was also eliminated. I still think AS is marketed as a safety feature primarily based on the NHSTA study that it was responsible for a 40% reduction in accidents for AP1. Thus, I think they should provide that once you resume a safe operational speed. Having TACC does provide most of the safety benefits though, so I concede it is not as dire as I had thought. I've never exceeded the operational speed, so I didn't know.

 

[AMPd]

Bioweapon defense mode!

That's what I told my wife, we NEED to upgrade our '15 to a new one.

 

[dhanson865]

I'm gonna call BS on the need to occasionally exceed 90mph on US public roads for "safe operation of the vehicle".

Then you haven't driven by the Harris Ranch cow farm on i5 in California.

Just drove by and had to do over 100 to safely get through the scent.

Well to be fair, he did call "BS"