Wiki FSD’s Earliest Adopters Still Waiting

[Saxman]

As I posted late last night,, yesterday morning I drove 120 miles from my home in Vail Valley for a Service appointment in Superior, CO . What I didn't know at that time is the following:

I arrived around 9:30 am to get 4 new tires. Around 11:30am service was completed and began Supercharging for my drive back to Vail. After about 30 minutes I started smelling smoke and seeing ash in the air. The winds became intense and smoke visibility was all encompassing. I finished Charging and waited for my wife to Uber back to Service Center. She arrived around 12:30 pm when the smoke & winds further intensified.

Fortunately the SC is close to US 36, and since we drove 36East to Vail we were able to get on the highway because West was closed.

We never saw any flames just overwhelming smoke & wind. It wasn't until this morning on the Denver news that we heard about the devastating damage done throughout Boulder County and to the Tesla Service Center in Superior,, CO. My wife & I feel very fortunate for ourselves, but saddened for those tragically affected.

Last edited: 9 minutes ago
MX 75D-Midnight Silver-AP2-EAP/FSD-SubZero-20" Chrome-Tow Pkg

 

[Silicon Desert]

As I posted late last night,, yesterday morning I drove 120 miles from my home in Vail Valley for a Service appointment in Superior, CO . What I didn't know at that time is the following:

I arrived around 9:30 am to get 4 new tires. Around 11:30am service was completed and began Supercharging for my drive back to Vail. After about 30 minutes I started smelling smoke and seeing ash in the air. The winds became intense and smoke visibility was all encompassing. I finished Charging and waited for my wife to Uber back to Service Center. She arrived around 12:30 pm when the smoke & winds further intensified.

Fortunately the SC is close to US 36, and since we drove 36East to Vail we were able to get on the highway because West was closed.

We never saw any flames just overwhelming smoke & wind. It wasn't until this morning on the Denver news that we heard about the devastating damage done throughout Boulder County and to the Tesla Service Center in Superior,, CO. My wife & I feel very fortunate for ourselves, but saddened for those tragically affected.

Last edited: 9 minutes ago
MX 75D-Midnight Silver-AP2-EAP/FSD-SubZero-20" Chrome-Tow Pkg

Thanks for that post. I was curious about your situation when I saw where you live. Glad you are doing well under the circumstances, yet the news of what os going on up there is worrisome. Sorry to side-track this thread. Just to say we hope life gets back to normal up there soon.

 

[hybridbear]

You can roll the windows up from 3rd party apps just not the Tesla app. Another thing Tesla put us into Legacy awhile ago. They just don’t want to take the time to program these features in for us, they already got their 100k plus from us we’re old news.

Yes, that’s the difference. It’s a development time issue, not a hardware limitation.

So I assume you are not driving with EAP/NOA on? just TACC?

most of my bad scoring was using EAP.

Any time driving on AP cannot hurt your score.

 

[Cheburashka]

Yes, that’s the difference. It’s a development time issue, not a hardware limitation.

Any time driving on AP cannot hurt your score.

Yea I am still unclear how the score works tbh. I just drove 100 miles mostly on EAP and got 24.5% unsafe following score and a bad score for the trip.

 

[Lowchrg]

I’ll be documenting my retrofit process and updates on Twitter for anyone interested:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1477027748052799488

 

[Silicon Desert]

Yea I am still unclear how the score works tbh. I just drove 100 miles mostly on EAP and got 24.5% unsafe following score and a bad score for the trip.

Interesting. Are you thinking that unsafe score came from EAP and not from the time driving manually?
I have never see this happen to me yet. Actually, I never looked until now that you said it since I don't look at the score often. I went in to the app just now and did see any unsafe following in my last 30 days (which is now down to about 1400 miles). I wonder if it has something to do with the "following distance" set in AP ? I have seen others on here proclaim they get dinged for unsafe following if their distance is set to a low number. Maybe that is why I never see a problem with unsafe following since I have mine set to 7. I just don't like following close to people. Just guessing since I haven't actually tried a shorter distance.

 

[fbitz777]

Interesting. Are you thinking that unsafe score came from EAP and not from the time driving manually?
I have never see this happen to me yet. Actually, I never looked until now that you said it since I don't look at the score often. I went in to the app just now and did see any unsafe following in my last 30 days (which is now down to about 1400 miles). I wonder if it has something to do with the "following distance" set in AP ? I have seen others on here proclaim they get dinged for unsafe following if their distance is set to a low number. Maybe that is why I never see a problem with unsafe following since I have mine set to 7. I just don't like following close to people. Just guessing since I haven't actually tried a shorter distance.

I was getting tons of unsafe following on EAP (even with set at 7) and also a lots of Autopilot disengage.. As well every time car would cross double lines on country roads and I'd have to take over.

 

[Jackman]

Any chance you could post a short dashcam clip? That would help us be sure.

But based on your description (and the fact that you got the beta), I agree, most likely they installed 1120520-00-B despite listing 1089531-00-C on your invoice.

Had they installed 1089531-00-C 1) they would have replaced your existing camera with the exact same model 2) your forward colors would still look like they used to/not match your other new cams.

I'm not quite sure how to get a dash cam clip, but I've attached a cellphone camera pic from my screen. The left and right portions look a little better than the Front view IMHO. So I'm not sure what I've got.

 

[scarelli]

Any chance you could post a short dashcam clip? That would help us be sure.

But based on your description (and the fact that you got the beta), I agree, most likely they installed 1120520-00-B despite listing 1089531-00-C on your invoice.

Had they installed 1089531-00-C 1) they would have replaced your existing camera with the exact same model 2) your forward colors would still look like they used to/not match your other new cams.

It’s possible to see the PN if you pop the trim around your mirror ( at your own risk)

Bottom left facing down

 

[valem]

Yea I am still unclear how the score works tbh. I just drove 100 miles mostly on EAP and got 24.5% unsafe following score and a bad score for the trip.

EAP does not ding you for anything at all... What happens when a trip is mostly on EAP you may not accumulate any safe following time.
The % of unsafe following is calculated by dividing the amount of Unsafe following time (less than 1s following distance) by the amount of safe following time (following distance between 2s and 3s)
So if you don't accumulate any safe following time, you end up with a very small denominator; if you don't have much safe following time, all it takes is just a brief amount of time when someone is in front of you at 1s following distance while not on EAP and you end up with a large % of unsafe following time.
This may happen on an on or off ramp while EAP is not engaged for example.
When that happens, you need to follow someone at a 3s distance at a speed > 50mph to accumulate safe following time to reduce the % of unsafe following.
If you don't follow anyone or follow at a greater distance than 3s while not on EAP, you don't accumulate any safe following time.

 

[KArnold]

I was getting tons of unsafe following on EAP (even with set at 7) and also a lots of Autopilot disengage.. As well every time car would cross double lines on country roads and I'd have to take over.

Read through the topic "Safety Score" - this is well documented. Your bad score is due to what you describe. "Unsafe Following" is a ratio of non-AP, speed >50 with a follow distance of 1 second divided by the following distance of >1 and <3 seconds. If nobody is in front of you or >3 seconds it has no effect.

So, if you enter a freeway going more than 50 MPH (start AP while on the entrance ramp, prior to reaching 50 MPH BTW) - someone cuts you off and you tap the break. But you immediately go back to AP. That's 100% Unsafe Following - none of your AP time counted and manually you had 1 second of driving with Unsafe following for 1 second of unsafe following. Just do the math. Mitigate by manually following > 50 MPH using TACC, not AP, with a set speed higher than the actual speed and following distance set to 5. If someone cuts you off, engage AP quickly and set it up again going back to TACC.

Pressing the "go pedal" while on AP is the same as manual driving and the aggressive following Calc is being done.

For Aggressive Turning, don't take any 90-degree turn > 18 MPH regardless of what speed you may consider to be safe, including multi-lane turns. Mitigate by taking more safe turns.

SS simulator will tell you the desired target in each category to reach your desired score of the day. Total scores (points average) are the average of the last 30 days of (Daily Score * Miles = Points for day). Therefore depending on miles for the day, if you want to mitigate a low score it must be done by midnight of that day.. There are XLSX in the other thread on this topic.

Fell free to PM if you have specific questions.

 

[Saxman]

Thanks for that post. I was curious about your situation when I saw where you live. Glad you are doing well under the circumstances, yet the news of what os going on up there is worrisome. Sorry to side-track this thread. Just to say we hope life gets back to normal up there soon.

@Silicon Desert
Thank you for your concern about me. However, to be clear I do not live in Superior, CO, where the Tesla fire occurred. I live in Vail, CO which is 120 miles, west. Superior SC is the closest to my home.
To your point, I was so surprised to learn on local news station, how widespread the devastation had affected various communities.

 

[GenY]

There should be a poll on how many, I don't know how to create, or if this can be simply a pivot table from the existing wiki google sheet

1. Waiting for Camera Invite
2. Got Invite but waiting for SC Appointment/Parts
3. Got Camera Retrofit done, but waiting for FSD Beta
4. Got FSD Beta
5. After going thru 1-4, lost FSD Beta to 3 strikes

Great idea! I created a poll as a separate thread.

POLL: FSD Camera Retrofit Status

I am curious to see where everyone is at with the status of camera retrofits for FSD beta. I know it has been very frustrating for everyone who hasn’t been able to get FSD beta due to the outdated cameras. Hopefully this poll can give some more clarity on how many people have been invited to get...

teslamotorsclub.com

 

[mach.89]

One last update- got home tonight and sure enough I’ve got the FSD. Taking it for a little test drive, so far the description I’ve heard “it’s like a rollercoaster” is pretty accurate! Anyway, I’ll keep following this thread, good luck to everyone getting their cameras upgraded, then getting FSD. Thank you to everyone in this thread that helped make it happen!

 

[xxMxx]

Yea I am still unclear how the score works tbh. I just drove 100 miles mostly on EAP and got 24.5% unsafe following score and a bad score for the trip.

if you are manually driving at 50+mph on the freeway/highway and someone merges into your lane too closely in front of you (e.g. cuts you off), then you will also get hit with an unsafe following ding (similarly as others have stated, if you manually merge into a lane but do not allow enough distance between you and the lead car in front of you, then you'll get hit with an unsafe following as well)

the way to minimize this from occuring is to engage EAP if you are changing lanes (at 50+mph) and aren't confident enough that the car in front of you is far enough ahead....or if you are manually driving (at 50+mph) and can predict that someone in another lane is planning to cut you off or has their signal on and is planning to change into your lane without enough distance between you and the merging car

If you are driving below 50mph (like in traffic) and you change lanes or others switch into your lane in front of you, you will not get dinged with an unsafe following, but MAY get hit with a forward collision warning if you're too close to the car in front of you

good luck

 

[Cheburashka]

EAP does not ding you for anything at all... What happens when a trip is mostly on EAP you may not accumulate any safe following time.
The % of unsafe following is calculated by dividing the amount of Unsafe following time (less than 1s following distance) by the amount of safe following time (following distance between 2s and 3s)
So if you don't accumulate any safe following time, you end up with a very small denominator; if you don't have much safe following time, all it takes is just a brief amount of time when someone is in front of you at 1s following distance while not on EAP and you end up with a large % of unsafe following time.
This may happen on an on or off ramp while EAP is not engaged for example.
When that happens, you need to follow someone at a 3s distance at a speed > 50mph to accumulate safe following time to reduce the % of unsafe following.
If you don't follow anyone or follow at a greater distance than 3s while not on EAP, you don't accumulate any safe following time.

Ok this makes total sense to me now. It's stupid still but at least now I know why my score is so bad. Thanks.

Edit: my wife was somehow able to get a score of 2 on a 23 mile drive... Impressive.

 

[hybridbear]

So, if you enter a freeway going more than 50 MPH (start AP while on the entrance ramp, prior to reaching 50 MPH BTW) - someone cuts you off and you tap the break. But you immediately go back to AP. That's 100% Unsafe Following - none of your AP time counted and manually you had 1 second of driving with Unsafe following for 1 second of unsafe following. Just do the math. Mitigate by manually following > 50 MPH using TACC, not AP, with a set speed higher than the actual speed and following distance set to 5. If someone cuts you off, engage AP quickly and set it up again going back to TACC.

Pressing the "go pedal" while on AP is the same as manual driving and the aggressive following Calc is being done.

Are you sure that pressing the accelerator while on AP will ding you for unsafe following? I have tested this & have followed closely on AP by pressing the accelerator in order to prompt the car to make a lane change & have shown 0% unsafe following for the trip. I also thought that any time using TACC or AP is not counted, so manually following at >50 MPH using TACC won't increase your denominator. The point is the measure how much following distance the human driver allows when he/she is driving & to not count the following distance when the car is controlling it since the car is supposedly better than the human driver & not rear-ending other vehicles.

One benefit of this whole Safety Score nonsense is that it has made us much more aware of following distance on the freeway. We didn't follow closely before, but this has made me pay much more attention to just how far back is 2 seconds, 3 seconds, etc of following distance. So while this who Safety Score nonsense for months waiting for FSD Beta has been annoying, it has made me more cognizant of following distance.

The one I can't wait to get rid of is aggressive turning. That's the one I got dinged for the most at the beginning. Now I take turns & curves on the road very slowly, likely to the point of annoying other cars based on how I'll get tailgated at times, to make sure I don't get dinged there. I've had trips where I've expected to get dinged & haven't, and trips where I check my score & have no idea where I got dinged for aggressive turning. I can't wait for that one to go away once we get our RCCB cameras & then get FSD Beta. And my wife can't wait for the hard braking to go away. I've never once had hard braking, but that's the one where she most frequently gets dinged.

 

[Saxman]

Are you sure that pressing the accelerator while on AP will ding you for unsafe following? I have tested this & have followed closely on AP by pressing the accelerator in order to prompt the car to make a lane change & have shown 0% unsafe following for the trip. I also thought that any time using TACC or AP is not counted, so manually following at >50 MPH using TACC won't increase your denominator. The point is the measure how much following distance the human driver allows when he/she is driving & to not count the following distance when the car is controlling it since the car is supposedly better than the human driver & not rear-ending other vehicles.

One benefit of this whole Safety Score nonsense is that it has made us much more aware of following distance on the freeway. We didn't follow closely before, but this has made me pay much more attention to just how far back is 2 seconds, 3 seconds, etc of following distance. So while this who Safety Score nonsense for months waiting for FSD Beta has been annoying, it has made me more cognizant of following distance.

The one I can't wait to get rid of is aggressive turning. That's the one I got dinged for the most at the beginning. Now I take turns & curves on the road very slowly, likely to the point of annoying other cars based on how I'll get tailgated at times, to make sure I don't get dinged there. I've had trips where I've expected to get dinged & haven't, and trips where I check my score & have no idea where I got dinged for aggressive turning. I can't wait for that one to go away once we get our RCCB cameras & then get FSD Beta. And my wife can't wait for the hard braking to go away. I've never once had hard braking, but that's the one where she most frequently gets dinged.

@hybridbear

I feel your pain.

Since getting FSD Beta on the 30th, these last few days of driving have been less stressful, with my Safety Scores eliminated. Especially since we have over 2 feet of snow within last few days. Unfortunately I have not been able to Test Drive FSD yet, due to the weather.

One question I have is how do you know your following distance, measured by seconds? Are you referring to the TACC settings 1 to 7?

 

[appleguru]

One question I have is how do you know your following distance, measured by seconds? Are you referring to the TACC settings 1 to 7?

You count.. wait until the car in front of you passes something, then start counting the seconds until you pass it too.

 

[Saxman]

You count.. wait until the car in front of you passes something, then start counting the seconds until you pass it too.

@appleguru

Gotcha...so rather than precise, it's a...one mississippi, two mississippi , kind of thing