M3 Refresh - Are Indicator buttons really poor design?

[WannabeOwner]

The Drive stalks are used only two times in a drive

If I'm manoeuvring into a tight space and have to do several back-and-forth's I really like that I can throw the drive/reverse (whilst still moving ... accelerator then initially becomes slow-down and then opposite-direction), makes it much quicker / easier than when I had, e.g. stick-shift.

Moving that from stalk to screen is, I expect, going to remove that benefit for me

 

[pdk42]

If I'm manoeuvring into a tight space and have to do several back-and-forth's I really like that I can throw the drive/reverse (whilst still moving ... accelerator then initially becomes slow-down and then opposite-direction), makes it much quicker / easier than when I had, e.g. stick-shift.

Moving that from stalk to screen is, I expect, going to remove that benefit for me

I agree. It works really well at the moment. The best implementation I’ve used in any EV. But a slider on the screen? - no thanks.

 

[Drew57]

My wife has been OK with the loss of parking sensors but she absolutely will not accept any car without fixed location indicators. On telling her friends, they are incredulous that Tesla would do this to such a popular vehicle.

With many other EV options available, Tesla ownership was already moving away from older generation early adopters however I'm not convinced that overall this will have as much negative impact as we would like.

 

[MkPotato]

My wife has been OK with the loss of parking sensors but she absolutely will not accept any car without fixed location indicators. On telling her friends, they are incredulous that Tesla would do this to such a popular vehicle.

With many other EV options available, Tesla ownership was already moving away from older generation early adopters however I'm not convinced that overall this will have as much negative impact as we would like.

This is the problem with any mass-market car. It’s alright assuming tech-savvy early adopters will just “get used to it”, but messing with something as fundamental to the basic driving experience as indicating is going to really alienate the average non-techie user. Particularly if they use other, conventionally controlled cars. Madness.

Maybe they should introduce a “Convenience Pack” (or more accurately a “Non-Inconvenience Pack”) where you get USS parking and stalks. Most people would pay a grand or so for it.

By the way, I was surprised to learn that in Australia they still get USS sensors, so it shows they can still produce cars with them. It therefore shows what utter contempt they treat the British consumer with, whilst the Aussies don’t take kindly to being treated like ****s.

 

[Zilla91]

By the way, I was surprised to learn that in Australia they still get USS sensors

Really?

 

[cwerdna]

I'm lazy to google search it, but I thought, like many features, e.g: cameras replacing side view mirrors..., it was because a steering column was a requirement from the NHTSA?
If I recall correctly they require a 'mechanical' connection between the steering wheel and the axle, hence the reason why drive-by-wire is not possible there.

AFAIK, steer-by-wire has been available in the US for a long time via Infiniti.

Infiniti Q50 steer-by-wire system took 10 years to develop [w/video] - Autoblog

Infiniti's Direct Adaptive Steering (DAS) is quite a novelty - the system employs no physical connection between the steering wheel and the front wheels under normal circumstances and instead relies on a computer, clutch and steering-angle actuator to guide vehicles down the road with input from...

www.autoblog.com

Direct Adaptive Steering

Direct Adaptive Steering™ is the world's first production steer-by-wire system, providing new levels of control, precision and adaptability. The system uses advanced electronics to streamline the steering mechanism for a more precise feeling behind the wheel.

global.infinitinews.com

Electric Feel: Nissan Digitizes Steering, But the Wheel Remains

So long, mechanical steering linkages. Hello, steer-by-wire.

www.caranddriver.com

Steer-By-Wire Leads to Infiniti Recall

Nissan's recent recall of 23 infiniti Q50s equipped with its electronic steer-by-wire system is a reminder that carmakers need to proceed with the utmost caution on the road to an autonomous future.

www.popularmechanics.com

 

[Mrklaw]

If I'm manoeuvring into a tight space and have to do several back-and-forth's I really like that I can throw the drive/reverse (whilst still moving ... accelerator then initially becomes slow-down and then opposite-direction), makes it much quicker / easier than when I had, e.g. stick-shift.

Moving that from stalk to screen is, I expect, going to remove that benefit for me

not just how often you do it -you can do that with eyes on road at all times, at a critical time where that is vital. having to swipe across at the screen you'll need to look away and then potentially reassess surroundings each time. Horrible

 

[Jason71]

not just how often you do it -you can do that with eyes on road at all times, at a critical time where that is vital. having to swipe across at the screen you'll need to look away and then potentially reassess surroundings each time. Horrible

ironically I would kinda be OK if they had put this on the steering wheel
A whole stalk ( good as it is) just for this never seemed very Tesla in the first place.

 

[MkPotato]

Really?

Tesla Vision Update: Replacing Ultrasonic Sensors with Tesla Vision | Tesla Support Australia

Safety is at the core of our design and engineering decisions. In 2021, we began our transition to Tesla Vision by removing radar from Model 3 and Model Y, followed by Model S and Model X in 2022. Today, in most regions around the globe, these vehicles now rely on Tesla Vision, our camera-based...

www.tesla.com

Apparently so. According to a member of a different forum from Oz as per this article, they’re still producing USS cars for that market. Makes us feel like a bunch of mugs, doesn’t it? They’ve downgraded the cars functionality, but we keep buying them. It’s the RyanAir “treat the customer like *sugar*, and they’ll love it” model.

 

[Mrklaw]

ironically I would kinda be OK if they had put this on the steering wheel
A whole stalk ( good as it is) just for this never seemed very Tesla in the first place.

good point, agreed. Auto boxes went from lots of notches to really only D/P/R so drive buttons or up/down would have done the trick I think - with touchscreen for neutral etc

 

[GeorgeSymonds]

The idea is the car automatically knows if you want to go forward or backwards. Its a beta feature the the default is off according to the Model S manual. I've not really seen many people talk about it and how good it is, but it seems to be a "shift out of park" feature, so 3 point turns or reversing into a parking space aren;t presumably covered.

 

[C225]

The auto select on my very limited experience actually worked well, and picked the correct direction everytime, and the drive select on screen is really no more hardship than the stalk

 

[Adopado]

The auto select on my very limited experience actually worked well, and picked the correct direction everytime, and the drive select on screen is really no more hardship than the stalk

Does it work for multi point turning in a tight space?

 

[C225]

Does it work for multi point turning in a tight space?

It only auto did it on first moving off from park so i guess not unless you go into park after every point??

 

[Jason71]

The idea is the car automatically knows if you want to go forward or backwards. Its a beta feature the the default is off according to the Model S manual. I've not really seen many people talk about it and how good it is, but it seems to be a "shift out of park" feature, so 3 point turns or reversing into a parking space aren;t presumably covered.

I have a bad feeling about this.

 

[Adopado]

It only auto did it on first moving off from park so i guess not unless you go into park after every point??

eek ... we do a bit of jiggery pokery every time we park up at home ... snicking back and forth with the stalk is easy peasy ... I don't have high hopes for the new setup.

 

[WannabeOwner]

It only auto did it on first moving off from park so i guess not unless you go into park after every point??

I don't. I'm moving into a space, I am going to make it (just) so FORWARD is OK ... except that I judge when I get there I won't be able to get out of my door, so (at that point) and whilst still rolling forwards I select REVERSE, dab the accelerator to apply reverse-thrust until (momentarily) stationary, and then accelerator again for the reverse direction (and plenty of right-hand-down), then whilst still rolling backwards I select FORWARD (and some left-hand-down) so I now have my steering angle ideally set for the parking bay.

If you haven't tried it I recommend it. It works a lot better than it takes me to describe! The amount of reverse-thrust "dab" is easy to get used to. Maybe try it the first time in an open space,

I reckon both those direction changes are not going to be anticipatable by software.

There must be times when I'm doing this FORWARD/REVERSE throw, and when I am NOT parking, but I can't think of one off hand ...

... so I suppose if auto-park worked that would do instead, 'coz the car could then decide on the reverse-throw moment.

 

[pdk42]

Looks like the S3XY button people will have an after-market solution for the lack of stalks on Highland. I think they'll sell a ton of them!

ð² S3XY Stalks coming mid 2024

 

[browellm]

3rd party indicators

 

[Jason71]

Looks like the S3XY button people will have an after-market solution for the lack of stalks on Highland. I think they'll sell a ton of them!

ð² S3XY Stalks coming mid 2024

given the number of cars Tesla sell there might even be some competition in the market at some point I would think.