For anyone who ordered a Model X this year after seeing Tesla drop the price on Model Y -$16K in January, they had fair warning and reasonable notice that Tesla is willing to price bomb the competition. The economic climate (see interest rates, etc) is worse now than earlier this year. Recently, someone in my neighborhood is driving a refreshed Model X LR (solid black) with matrix headlights (already has license plates). You know he feels the -$20K price burn as he bought before the Sept 1 price drop, but at least he got matrix lights and hw 4.
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Model S&X Price Adjustments
- Thread starter Cars 97
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Thank you! People don’t get it. All I hear is what Tesla did makes perfect sense. Except NO ONE ELSE is doing this. Only Tesla because they had a rare opportunity and decided to gouge their customers.
The point is the price should never have been set that high that they are able to reduce something by nearly 40% in the matter of months. That is not due to supply issues. That’s just plain bad practice of extreme price gouging.
The issue again is why did Tesla overprice them to such ridiculous amounts that they are able to slash them by 40%.
The real issue is the prices should never have been hiked up like they did. Not to those levels.
Customers are used to prices being fairly steady. iPhones have gone up over the years but that’s a slow change. Never has apple overnight slashed their phone price 40%. That would make for a LOT of unhappy customers.
Price changes that happen over longer periods of time are expected or when a new model comes out.
What no one is used to is when you go buy a Tesla it’s like playing the stock market. No product is like that. But I guess Tesla is one of them and I wished I realized this sooner.
I do get your point. It would bother me, I won't pretend it wouldn't, because you do lose some money that you otherwise wouldn't have when you go to sell.
I'm not sure what some expected Tesla to do, though; when supply chain was screwed and demand was absurdly high they raised prices to maximize profit--as other manufacturers have done (if the manufacturer hasn't their dealers have). Now they are lowering prices. Are they supposed to keep them high forever to offset some resale challenges of customers? They certainly cannot give prorated rebates or anything to recent-but-elevated-price customers.
If the complaint really is that they inflated prices before, why did people buy them? I wanted a model 3 since 2017 but as tesla kept cranking up prices I decided it simply wasn't worth it until recently.
There are people who paid $100k for an F150 lightning, or $10k over sticker for a tacoma recently or $5k+ for a rav4 hybrid because they lacked the patience to wait for a market correction. Or "market adjustment" on a Kia telluride. All of those people will be hosed when they resell.
TLDR: I get your irritation and it would irritate me, but as glib as it sounds ultimately this is a feature (or bug as some might consider) of a market economy. Just be glad you didn't buy an arizona house for $500k in 2006 and have to sell it for $300k a couple years later
Well stated! Real estate, stocks, Cars all follow market economies. If a stock goes down, people double down if they believe in the stock. If you need another car, right now is the time to buy.I do get your point. It would bother me, I won't pretend it wouldn't, because you do lose some money that you otherwise wouldn't have when you go to sell.
I'm not sure what some expected Tesla to do, though; when supply chain was screwed and demand was absurdly high they raised prices to maximize profit--as other manufacturers have done (if the manufacturer hasn't their dealers have). Now they are lowering prices. Are they supposed to keep them high forever to offset some resale challenges of customers? They certainly cannot give prorated rebates or anything to recent-but-elevated-price customers.
If the complaint really is that they inflated prices before, why did people buy them? I wanted a model 3 since 2017 but as tesla kept cranking up prices I decided it simply wasn't worth it until recently.
There are people who paid $100k for an F150 lightning, or $10k over sticker for a tacoma recently or $5k+ for a rav4 hybrid because they lacked the patience to wait for a market correction. Or "market adjustment" on a Kia telluride. All of those people will be hosed when they resell.
TLDR: I get your irritation and it would irritate me, but as glib as it sounds ultimately this is a feature (or bug as some might consider) of a market economy. Just be glad you didn't buy an arizona house for $500k in 2006 and have to sell it for $300k a couple years later
What other car company is trying to grow at 50% volume per year? I don’t think any. That kind of growth requires nimble reactions to the market- dilly dallying won’t work.
Nah - the real issue is you the buyer are made aware of what exact transaction amounts other buyers are now able to pay today, which is giving you buyer's remorse and driving the bad-feels that others are acquiring the same utility for a fraction of the cost. The real issue is NOT that the supply-side is profit-seeking and able to set its own prices.
The USA free market is built on the assumption that companies that are privately run are profit-seeking. If you don't like that... then there is some dude that snuck into North Korea for some reason.
On the topic of this thread, one of the things that potentially sucks for anyone buying a Tesla is that Tesla's pricing is transparent. While this isn't really an issue when prices are going up, it is a huge issue when prices are going down.
Normal automakers that manage net pricing through individual negotiations, rebates, and incentives to clear inventory can obfuscate average vehicle transaction prices behind the veil of the normal American auto industry. Take this EQS in my avatar for example, The MSRP is $120,000. I know some people paid over MSRP for these things when they made their debut a few months ago. But Mercedes this year has an over-supply, and their financial services arm was willing to help fire-sale some to clear the floorplan of local dealerships.
Mercedes Financial + the federal government are stacking massive amounts of paper on the hood to clear the car on a lease. AND, Mercedes Financial was willing to eat an outrageously inflated residual. Based on how these EQS are performing at auction, someone's going to be taking a massive loss when I turn in this car. And it sure as hell isn't going to be me. All-in there is around $50k of value sitting in this lease structure that isn't coming from me. So this EQS leases like a car that costs about $65k (after taxes!); not $120k (yes, I know holdback and dealer margin are things; but I don't care).
Is that fair to the people who paid $120k for the car a year ago? Probably not. But do they know? Probably not. I mean, they'll know if they try to sell their EQS in 3 years, but that's a problem for tomorrow.
TLDR, ignorance is bliss. And you are no longer ignorant to what other people are paying for a Tesla Model X right now.
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Yep. Bought a MYLR June 2021 for 49000, sold it January 2022 (with 9000 miles) for 62000. Bought a MXP January, 2022 for 119000, unfortunately, still have it. You win some, you lose some…..
A year ago I put down a deposit on a rav4 prime. A week back the salesman finally said my vin is available. Since last year the MSRP of the XSE is up about $3k I think. The entire car is now $51k plus dest + tax. For a Rav4! I balked at this (just emailed the guy saying I'll take back my deposit instead)--but interestingly despite an ostensibly high demand car, toyota has just recently announced $6500 lease cash incentive on the prime. That's directly against the capitalized cost, so although the price has not "officially" been reduced, it is in fact $6500 less I would need to come up with to lease the thing (and my buy-out stays the same).
Local dealer by me is selling a 6000 mile model 3 base, 2023 for....$39,995. I mean I can literally order that exact same car right this moment from Tesla for $36,220 (which by the way is $2k less than I paid for the same car 6 weeks ago), then take $9500 more off in state/federal credits, the damn thing is $27k!
They also have a 2021 performance for $200 more than a brand new one from Tesla.
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I feel extremely bad for all the people that have been scammed here. I agree with everything you are saying. The people that are disagreeing with you have enormous amounts of money and just dont care or they get off on disagreeing with very basic facts.
Tesla is the only company that pulls this stuff to this extreme. Tell me another brand of car that major car manufacturers have a stop purchase on? My friend who is trying to trade her MX in with Land Rover was told (and shown) the mass communication that went out to all Land Rover dealers to NOT take in any Tesla trade ins due to the "extreme" uncertainty around pricing. She then went to a local MB dealer and was told the same thing.
I will never purchase a Tesla again.
In all other auto manufacturers there is a known change date, the next years model. There is typically an approximately known price reduction time (late in the model year). Every other car you can be educated as to what the manufacturers are planning for the following model year or at least that a change is coming. Tesla customers are totally blind. Tesla has no flow, no cadence to the models and pricing which is the quickest way to create buyers remorse. We are not talking about a $2000 rebate that is now available. It is great they update cars when they can, it also stinks we cannot know about it to make an educated decision.
This used 2021 plaid with 51K miles for $73K is the cheapest Plaid for sale anywhere in the US making a brand new still look like a bargain. Used listings haven't budged any since the last $20K MSRP drop.
For all other auto manufacturers there is no guaranteed price. There is a piece of fiction that the manufacturer advertises for national audiences and then there is the price you pay for the product. The two are only loosely related. With no change in either national or local advertising 2 consumers can purchase the car for prices that differ by several thousand dollars - 5-10% in some cases - only a few hours apart from the exact same dealer.
How can there be any comparison there?
(I will note that at least one high profile out-of-business manufacturer had a no-negotiations policy and some of the newer automotive startups already embrace and even legacy manufacturers are looking to embrace that policy. But the most common policy amongst car manufacturers is "here is about what we think it is worth" and there is "the price you actually pay" and you shouldn't confuse the two.)
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Price gouging is commonly defined as
What emergency or disaster forced people to purchase a Model S or X over the past few months? Even if you include "climate change" as an answer, the point is to buy some EV, not specifically a Model S or Model X. There are so many reasonable alternatives - perhaps not as good in some ways, but equally able to meet the "climate change" needs - that these models can't be considered "essential goods or services"...
What emergency or disaster forced people to purchase a Model S or X over the past few months? Even if you include "climate change" as an answer, the point is to buy some EV, not specifically a Model S or Model X. There are so many reasonable alternatives - perhaps not as good in some ways, but equally able to meet the "climate change" needs - that these models can't be considered "essential goods or services"...
Note that I speak as someone who bought a very expensive Tesla a few years back and despite public statements that "such and such will never be offered as a product", that alternative was indeed offered very soon after my purchase and then the price slowly slid down until I could have bought a similar car with some updated technology for $NNk less within a year.
I feel you, but there is a lot of rhetoric on here that needs to dial down and realize that these are luxury products meeting the laws of supply and demand and Tesla's goal is to have enough cash to grow by a huge percentage over the next few years in order to push EVs to be the dominant automotive choice. They have a long way to go on that front even if they are leading the industry and so I'm not going to take offense when they turn high demand into gross income that they can reinvest in their ... more specifically in THAT (EV dominant) ... future.
I feel you, but there is a lot of rhetoric on here that needs to dial down and realize that these are luxury products meeting the laws of supply and demand and Tesla's goal is to have enough cash to grow by a huge percentage over the next few years in order to push EVs to be the dominant automotive choice. They have a long way to go on that front even if they are leading the industry and so I'm not going to take offense when they turn high demand into gross income that they can reinvest in their ... more specifically in THAT (EV dominant) ... future.
I think the subtle difference is that there are some number of folks out there that think sticker price (plus mandatory floor mats, wheel locks, and tint) is the actual price. Those folks may prop up used car sales.
How long do folks think it will take for used car dealers (and private sellers) to drop their prices?
I had some good laughs today perusing the used market, even some that were posted this weekend. I assume the biggest resellers already know and are hoping the folks coming in don't, but would be willing to negotiate a lot more now.
As for the fairness of it, I only buy used so I don't feel the brunt of it, and one can grab relative bargains that way (FSD + FUSC from a dealer that knows about neither and neglects to post pics) even if the market is high at the time. Mine is worth a bit less today, but looking to trade a used S for a used X and the price movements are pretty in sync, so not sure that I care too much. (Except to the extent that if used X prices drop too slowly..)
I was at a bmw dealership recently servicing my wife’s car and the sales people over there were wishing the Bmw would do the same for iX. Drop prices…their argument was that an EV buyer is the online buyer who wants to pay and just drive off the lot. The “cash back” tactics of regular dealer to reduce price may not work with majority of ev buyers who don’t want to deal with dealer BS.
There were 10 sitting in the lot and with MSRP of 90k plus..no one is touching those. If the price was close to 60k, you would see some movement. Point being that Tesla is changing how we buy cars and dropping prices like they do is what other automakers should adopt.
There were 10 sitting in the lot and with MSRP of 90k plus..no one is touching those. If the price was close to 60k, you would see some movement. Point being that Tesla is changing how we buy cars and dropping prices like they do is what other automakers should adopt.
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