Edgewood Dome
Member
My battery was replaced in mid 2013 due to an 'impedance issue'. P1895. Did I get an A or B?
That's an "A" battery pack Chris.
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My battery was replaced in mid 2013 due to an 'impedance issue'. P1895. Did I get an A or B?
You forgot to highlight one important word there - "fully".Now from Tesla's May 2013 press release:
The new technology, which is in beta test mode now and will be fully rolled out to customers this summer, will allow Model S to be charged at 120 kW, replenishing three hours of driving in just over 20 minutes.
So you aren't upset that you got something other than what was promised at the time you bought your car, you are upset that Tesla raised your hopes about something after you bought your car, based upon your interpretation of the word "customer", that turned out not to be true. Disappointment doesn't rise to the level of deserving a new battery, as others are suggesting. I'm not picking on you, just using your viewpoint as an example as it is probably shared by others. I'm trying to be logical here and to separate facts from emotion.
You forgot to highlight one important word there - "fully".
Given that Tesla is well known to push out over-the-air updates, "fully rolled out to customers" clearly means that _all_ customers will get an update the enables 120 kW charging.
I don't even have any skin in the game (no Model S yet) and can clearly see how Tesla screwed up fully here.
I think all Tesla really needs to do is acknowledge that they screwed up in their announcement of the Supercharger improvement and mislead all of their existing customers into thinking that the improvement applied to them. Instead, the rep was just too defensive of their position, even going as far as saying I got the car before so and so price increase so they should use the older parts. It's just an uncomfortable feeling. I honestly didn't think it was a huge deal before they called me.
(Emphasis mine.) Bingo. When that happens I'll stop reading this thread.
No.
I personally talked with engineers about Supercharging as far back as 2011. I had a very clear understanding of what they were working on, and what they were testing, and it was not just 90kW, long long before the May 2013 announcement. You may not have been in "the know" but that does not mean that it was some top secret item that was just unveiled and those of us prior to May 2013 didn't know anything about it.
Every person here, and just about every Tesla Employee, expected my car to charge at 120kW. Trying to parse the words from the May 2013 announcement to show that we shouldn't have expected anything from our cars is disingenuous as every person that heard it expected all cars to support 120kW charging. It is only with 20/20 hindsight that you can make such an argument. Furthermore, I would be careful with that type of argument because Tesla tends to be very loose with it's statements and the number of questions that type of viewpoint brings up would bring the forum to a standstill.
You speak of the vocal members of this thread. Perhaps you should take a moment to see that many of those that are very vocal here are some of Tesla's oldest and longest supporters. Many for between 5 years and a decade. Each has personally helped to sell dozens of cars. The fact that many of those supporters see such a large issues with the communication and handling of this should give you pause to take off your fanboy hat and ask yourself if the company is heading in the correct direction. It certainly has me.
Peter
You forgot to highlight one important word there - "fully".
Given that Tesla is well known to push out over-the-air updates, "fully rolled out to customers" clearly means that _all_ customers will get an update the enables 120 kW charging.
I don't even have any skin in the game (no Model S yet) and can clearly see how Tesla screwed up fully here.
I respectfully disagree. The word "fully" means that starting in the summer the technology will no longer be a beta trial, but will then be a steady-state deployment ("beta" is limited release, "fully" is...well, full release.) What is actually missing is the word "all", as in all customers, past and future, will get the new functionality. I read these words to clearly say that the new functionality will be fully deployed for customers starting in the summer, not fully deployed retroactively for all customers starting one year ago.
How about this? nothing new here, just a spin
from:
Teslas Supercharger page FAQ's:
Q:I am Supercharging, but not as quickly as I expected, what could be wrong?
A:The Supercharging rate may vary due to battery charge level, current use of the Supercharging station and extreme climate conditions.
or an old version battery maybe? without knowing what we know I would be concerned if my car was only getting 90kW at a 120 station and temps were Ideal and I was at ~ 20% SOC. I know this is exactly what happened to a few people and they were told firmware upgrade would bring 120kW charge rates.
AmpedRealtor... I don't think you understand that most of us agree with you that Tesla did nothing wrong from a legal/contractual standpoint. After the sale, they don't owe us anything that wasn't promised in writing. That is clear. But what they did do was mislead (perhaps unintentionally) their existing customers with the Supercharging improvement announcement. And the fact that nearly every owner and many Tesla employees expected that the improved charge rates applied to existing vehicles shows that this isn't just some quirky mis-interpretation of their announcement by one or two individuals. It's clear that it was misleading. And I (and many of us) don't demand a replacement/upgraded battery. We just demand that Tesla acknowledge their screw-up and take steps improve in the future.
The early-supporters "sold" a lot of cars because they honestly believed in Tesla. You say they shouldn't expect anything in return. But that's not true. They have a right to expect that the company stay true to their values and retain the integrity and honesty that moved early-supporters to emphatically recommend the company and its products.
After wading through all 105 pages of postings, I just realised that I actually have something to contribute to this thread.
I've got a recent build, with a D-type battery. I've gotten ~120kW charging at Superchargers before, so I know my car is completely capable of it. Yet, at exactly the same Supercharger, I've gotten 120kW just once out of four charges. The other times, I topped out around ~90kW. There may be a broad systemic benefit to 120kW-capable Superchargers. The actual benefit to me, as a driver, has been minimal. I don't know how representative that experience is, but I'm willing to believe it's probably not too far off the norm. And I'm OK with that.
Tesla as a company (and Musk as an individual) has made lots of claims and promises through its history. Some of them have panned out, some have not. By absolute count, and with careful parsing of these statements, it's certainly possible to make the case that Tesla has misled, mischaracterised, and otherwise prevaricated at least as much as (if not more than) other car companies. But weighting those claims by actual impact to me and the world at large, I'm forced to conclude that Tesla has largely delivered -- and certainly more so than I would expect any other company to manage. I'm missing lighted mirrors on my visors, my car doesn't crouch as much on the freeway as it used to, and some owners can't make full use of a charging feature that occasionally saves some time. But I have a fully-electric vehicle that I can drive from Seattle to Las Vegas, by any measure in more comfort and elegance than I have a right to be used to, for virtually no cost in energy, and with a comparatively minimal impact on the environment -- and which I used yesterday to bring home a 170lb package that was 7 feet long, a feat that would have eluded my other vehicle (a Hybrid Escape).
For what it's worth, I'm a happy customer (A+++++, would buy again, etc).
I'm with 100% you one this Umuhk.
I have supercharged 5 times now, and only once have I gotten full 120kW charging (even when visiting the same exact charger). The one time I got the full 120kW was when I arrived with the perfect conditions of an nearly empty, warmed battery, a cold day (34 degrees), and a non shared SuperCharger. If I cannot use upgraded 135kW superchargers at full power later this year, so be it. That does not take away the amazing (and free) charging I have now. I absolutely love my Model S, and can't imagine going back to any other car now.
... my mom has been ill...
Sorry to take the thread off topic, but I hope your mother gets better soon epley.
AmpedRealtor... I don't think you understand that most of us agree with you that Tesla did nothing wrong from a legal/contractual standpoint. After the sale, they don't owe us anything that wasn't promised in writing. That is clear. But what they did do was mislead (perhaps unintentionally) their existing customers with the Supercharging improvement announcement. And the fact that nearly every owner and many Tesla employees expected that the improved charge rates applied to existing vehicles shows that this isn't just some quirky mis-interpretation of their announcement by one or two individuals. It's clear that it was misleading. And I (and many of us) don't demand a replacement/upgraded battery. We just demand that Tesla acknowledge their screw-up and take steps improve in the future.
The early-supporters "sold" a lot of cars because they honestly believed in Tesla. You say they shouldn't expect anything in return. But that's not true. They have a right to expect that the company stay true to their values and retain the integrity and honesty that moved early-supporters to emphatically recommend the company and its products.
I think it's time for some tough love...
From Tesla's September 2012 press release:
The Supercharger is substantially more powerful than any charging technology to date, providing almost 100 kilowatts of power to the Model S, with the potential to go as high as 120 kilowatts in the future.
This statement clearly says that 120 kW is a potential future functionality. Not only is it in the future, it's potentially in the future - that hardly rises to the level of a promise, feature, or commitment. The only existing capability mentioned is "almost 100 kW" which is absolutely correct. I'm not sure how anyone reading this press release would expect to receive 120 kW supercharging. The press release clearly delineates current capability from potential future capability.
Now from Tesla's May 2013 press release:
The new technology, which is in beta test mode now and will be fully rolled out to customers this summer, will allow Model S to be charged at 120 kW, replenishing three hours of driving in just over 20 minutes.
Again, the language is clear. 120 kW was in beta testing as of May 2013 and Tesla's plan was to roll it out to customers in the summer. That doesn't mean all customers, past customers, Sig customers, or anyone who bought before this announcement customers. It says "rolled out to customers this summer". That means customers who buy the car "this summer". Really the only people who should be upset are those who received A batteries after May 30th... oh wait, there aren't any.
At the risk of offending some of the vocal members of this thread, it seems that those who are most upset are angry because others got a newer part at the same time and are now trying to go back in time to parse Tesla's words in an attempt to have their part upgraded. There are undoubtedly many other components in your cars that have seen later iterations that you don't even know about. Later shipments may have received touch screens with lower latencies, later shipments may contain slightly different cellular radio configurations based on whatever was the newest shipping part from the distributor, etc. Are you going to demand that Tesla update every component once you learn that someone in your time frame received a better or more capable component, even though the one everyone received performed to the specifications promised by Tesla?
You can't become retroactively upset over something that was never promised, can you? Nothing Tesla has done is decreasing your charging rate or increasing your charging time. Nothing Tesla has done has taken away your ability to charge at the rate that was promised and which you have been enjoying since taking delivery. Tesla never promised anyone prior to May 2013 that they would get 120 kW supercharging - it was clearly stated as a future functionality. I don't know how anyone could interpret that same press release and construe it as a promise or commitment of some sort, unless that interpretation was performed in hindsight and with the intent to find a wording technicality or ambiguity to construe in the owner's favor. Unfortunately, that's disingenuous.
To those who are claiming that Tesla's position rises to the level of a lie, I suggest you take a deep breath and calm yourselves. That's a lot of drama over having received exactly what Tesla promised you at the time you ordered your vehicle. The only complaints that are legitimate, in my opinion, are from those who received A batteries after the May 30th, 2013 press release announcing the summer rollout. Except, there are none that we know of. Everyone else got what was promised.
Can we move on?
haha, ya , compared to other auto companies claims I think Tesla is Golden. They are super scandalous
Anyways, the worst part of the SC's is the topping off, not the middle /beginning of charge
Summer time temperatures will probably limit many SC's(or cars) below 120kW due to the heat and this problem will be very minor.
The new technology, which is in beta test mode now and will be fully rolled out to customers this summer, will allow Model S to be charged at 120 kW, replenishing three hours of driving in just over 20 minutes.