Ontario EV Rebates Cancelled July 11, 2018

[ElectronZoom]

I recently received the "Good news!" email explaining that I once again qualified for the EVIP because I cancelled my order after the rebate was cancelled.

Is this a sure thing???

I called the Ministry of Transport. They say they know nothing of it, and that I should speak to the Ministry of Finance.

I call the Ministry of Finance, and they say they haven't heard anything about it, and I should speak to the Ministry of Transport.

Tesla can't tell me who I should speak to in order to get clarification from anyone in the government. There is nothing online. No one I've spoken to knows anything for sure.

Does anyone know anything definitive? Is there a real, live person from the government who can confirm this? Is there anything in writing (other than the "Good news!" email) from either Tesla or the government that we're covered here?

 

[thesteve]

Does anyone know anything definitive? Is there a real, live person from the government who can confirm this? Is there anything in writing (other than the "Good news!" email) from either Tesla or the government that we're covered here?

I think as someone mentioned this may be some sort of hush hush settlement so Tesla gets what they want and Ford gov’t is not in the wrong in news etc

 

[Tertulian]

Well, at long last I get to post my good news...

-Order Date: Nov 20th, ~4:30pm
-Delivery Date: Monday Dec. 3rd
-RN: xxxxxx7649
-VIN: xxxxxxxxxxxxx6635
-Config: Midnight silver, aero wheels, BLACK interior (oh well), EAP

Seems like there are no white interiors. Had I known that I would have likely gone with red paint...but at least I saved $1,300 and - oh yeah! - I'm getting a TESLA!!!!

 

[felixculpas]

I recently received the "Good news!" email explaining that I once again qualified for the EVIP because I cancelled my order after the rebate was cancelled.

Is this a sure thing???

I called the Ministry of Transport. They say they know nothing of it, and that I should speak to the Ministry of Finance.

I call the Ministry of Finance, and they say they haven't heard anything about it, and I should speak to the Ministry of Transport.

Tesla can't tell me who I should speak to in order to get clarification from anyone in the government. There is nothing online. No one I've spoken to knows anything for sure.

Does anyone know anything definitive? Is there a real, live person from the government who can confirm this? Is there anything in writing (other than the "Good news!" email) from either Tesla or the government that we're covered here?

If you got the email, that's as sure a thing as I need. Why would Tesla go to all that trouble otherwise? And to re-jig an assembly line to provide us LR RWD vehicles that qualify?

These were Ontario ministries you were talking to, right?

 

[ElectronZoom]

If you got the email, that's as sure a thing as I need. Why would Tesla go to all that trouble otherwise? And to re-jig an assembly line to provide us LR RWD vehicles that qualify?

These were Ontario ministries you were talking to, right?

Yes, I spoke to various Ontario government officials from both the Ministry of Finance and the Ministry of Transport and they're all perfectly clear - they have NO knowledge of any such agreement and there are NO instructions to issue rebates to us.

I get why things might be hush-hush, but surely the government would have to tell those who are in charge of accepting or rejecting the rebate applications.

As it appears to stand now, they're going to be rejected.

 

[felixculpas]

Yes, I spoke to various Ontario government officials from both the Ministry of Finance and the Ministry of Transport and they're all perfectly clear - they have NO knowledge of any such agreement and there are NO instructions to issue rebates to us.

I get why things might be hush-hush, but surely the government would have to tell those who are in charge of accepting or rejecting the rebate applications.

As it appears to stand now, they're going to be rejected.

Based on what people answering phones are telling you? I think I'd take what Tesla is saying way above that. They probably haven't been told yet.

Furthermore, I had congratulated a Tesla lawyer in California on this victory who was part of the team that won the original lawsuit and they were very upbeat about it all.

Tesla re-jigged a production line to produce more LR RWD models just so we could re-order. They wouldn't have done that on a whim. And Tesla legal are very sharp people. This would have been agreed to. It probably just hasn't made it's way down the line yet.

 

[adaptabl]

If you got the email, that's as sure a thing as I need. Why would Tesla go to all that trouble otherwise? And to re-jig an assembly line to provide us LR RWD vehicles that qualify?

These were Ontario ministries you were talking to, right?

I don't think they are re-jigging the assembly line. Stock and rejected/repaired vehicles will be used to fill any orders. The production date on the door will tell the real story.

 

[Tony_YYZ]

Well, at long last I get to post my good news...

-Order Date: Nov 20th, ~4:30pm
-Delivery Date: Monday Dec. 3rd
-RN: xxxxxx7649
-VIN: xxxxxxxxxxxxx6635
-Config: Midnight silver, aero wheels, BLACK interior (oh well), EAP

Seems like there are no white interiors. Had I known that I would have likely gone with red paint...but at least I saved $1,300 and - oh yeah! - I'm getting a TESLA!!!!

You did good. The red is nice but it's not $3,300 nice.

 

[ElectronZoom]

Based on what people answering phones are telling you? I think I'd take what Tesla is saying way above that. They probably haven't been told yet.

Furthermore, I had congratulated a Tesla lawyer in California on this victory who was part of the team that won the original lawsuit and they were very upbeat about it all.

Tesla re-jigged a production line to produce more LR RWD models just so we could re-order. They wouldn't have done that on a whim. And Tesla legal are very sharp people. This would have been agreed to. It probably just hasn't made it's way down the line yet.

I understand your point. But Tesla isn't the one who is supposed to be paying the rebate. The government is. And they're saying I don't qualify.

Speaking of the sharp Tesla legal team, they have made it clear to my DA, who has made it clear to me, that under no circumstances should I assume the rebate will be coming. I was specifically told that on the basis of the legal advice from the Tesla lawyers, any queries about the rebate should be directed to the MTO.

Here's a slightly different question: If Tesla legal has a firm and binding agreement with the government, why not just say so? Why, instead, say "we can't say if you're going to get your rebate" and "we can't say whether there's an agreement" and "if you don't get your rebate, don't look to us"?

 

[dj_gon]

I understand your point. But Tesla isn't the one who is supposed to be paying the rebate. The government is. And they're saying I don't qualify.

Speaking of the sharp Tesla legal team, they have made it clear to my DA, who has made it clear to me, that under no circumstances should I assume the rebate will be coming. I was specifically told that on the basis of the legal advice from the Tesla lawyers, any queries about the rebate should be directed to the MTO.

Here's a slightly different question: If Tesla legal has a firm and binding agreement with the government, why not just say so? Why, instead, say "we can't say if you're going to get your rebate" and "we can't say whether there's an agreement" and "if you don't get your rebate, don't look to us"?

I agree with you. This whole thing sounds a bit sketchy, but I just don't understand how Tesla would come back to us on this if knowing that the rebate is dead... No, even receiving that email from Tesla wouldn't guarantee that we're getting the rebate.

 

[IHartEV]

Hello Everyone,

Like to contribute my ordering info here:

Ordered Nov 22nd
Colour = Midnight Silver
Wheels = 18inch Aero
EAP = Yes
Default Black Interior
RN # = xxxxx8619

No VIN or call back after the initial phone call to let me know I qualify for the rebate on Nov 20th.

Anyone else here that ordered a midnight silver and is still waiting?

Thanks!

 

[felixculpas]

1) I was told by my sales person that about 150 LR RWD's were produced at Tesla to accommodate re-orders. My VIN is very high which would would tend to reinforce this. There are some in inventory which people are grabbing now.
2) Tesla, while having poor communications, tends to get things worked out for the customer. They wouldn't be doing this if there wasn't a legally binding commitment. Are they going to share that information? Of course not. You will never get their legal team to say anything in the public domain.
3) Why would Tesla risk putting out their letter as this in itself would be grounds for a lawsuit regardless of their disclaimers?

I'll try reaching out to their legal but I doubt I'll get a response. Wording it will be very tricky.

 

[Amendale]

I agree, Tesla sending out written confirmation of a promised rebate would be future grounds for lawsuit if people find out it was fake news when their application gets rejected. I recognize that it is a bit of a leap of faith to take Teslas word now, but I would trust their word over a government that is biased against the market. Back in June Ford Nation informed us that the cut off date was June 29. That got changed to July 11, then Sep 10, and now Jan 3. Take what this gov says with a grain of salt...

You can use my Tesla referral link to get six months of free Supercharging on Model S, Model X or Model 3.
Tesla Supercharging Credit and Extended Solar Warranty (alexandre90638)

 

[dj_gon]

I just wonder how many of us are re-ordering the M3? We should press Tesla for some confirmation regarding the rebate. I would be pissed if we are tricked into re-ordering the M3 and don't get the rebate...

 

[linnells]

I just wonder how many of us are re-ordering the M3? We should press Tesla for some confirmation regarding the rebate. I would be pissed if we are tricked into re-ordering the M3 and don't get the rebate...

I'm reordering a M3. I'd also like a little clarity on the situation (as I'm sure everyone would), but clarity of pertinent info hasn't historically been in Tesla's wheelhouse. How do we press?

The thing is, for me this car is a financial stretch WITH the rebate, and unaffordable without it. I get it that people on this forum may suggest (as they have earlier in this thread to others) that I shouldn't be buying the car if I can't afford it without the rebate, but here I am.

One thing that I was told when I re-ordered (by phone) was that, like before, the $3200 would be refunded if things didn't work out for me. I'm not sure what they meant by that, but it sounded comforting at the time.

 

[felixculpas]

Tesla legal is looking into it. Personally I have ZERO worries. However, some clarifications might now ensue and help re-assure those who are concerned. Hope that helps...

If you have found that it has, my referral code (first time ever posted) is: Tesla Supercharging Credit and Extended Solar Warranty

 

[Amendale]

I'm reordering a M3. I'd also like a little clarity on the situation (as I'm sure everyone would), but clarity of pertinent info hasn't historically been in Tesla's wheelhouse. How do we press?

The thing is, for me this car is a financial stretch WITH the rebate, and unaffordable without it. I get it that people on this forum may suggest (as they have earlier in this thread to others) that I shouldn't be buying the car if I can't afford it without the rebate, but here I am.

One thing that I was told when I re-ordered (by phone) was that, like before, the $3200 would be refunded if things didn't work out for me. I'm not sure what they meant by that, but it sounded comforting at the time.

I am in the same situation, can't afford the car without the rebate, stretch even with the rebate. I think a lot of us in the current situation are in this predicament, otherwise we wouldn't have cancelled after July 11...

I just find it hard to believe that Tesla would have informed us of this decision if it wasn't firm. Regarding the lack of response from MTO and MOF, it feels similar to the communication around July 11. Its almost like the Ford government is not conveying/distributing the information to inflict doubt and dissuade orders...

 

[champion1955]

I'm reordering a M3. I'd also like a little clarity on the situation (as I'm sure everyone would), but clarity of pertinent info hasn't historically been in Tesla's wheelhouse. How do we press?

The thing is, for me this car is a financial stretch WITH the rebate, and unaffordable without it. I get it that people on this forum may suggest (as they have earlier in this thread to others) that I shouldn't be buying the car if I can't afford it without the rebate, but here I am.

One thing that I was told when I re-ordered (by phone) was that, like before, the $3200 would be refunded if things didn't work out for me. I'm not sure what they meant by that, but it sounded comforting at the time.

Thanks for the share and I can totally relate. While I’m relatively comfortable, it’s still a bit of a stretch. Not too mention that I’m trading in a perfectly good gas guzzler that is fairly new. But It’s one step closer to my master plan to become carbon neutral, so here i go. (And yes, for the naysayers, I know it’s probably a lofty goal, but it is what it is and it is as it should be!)

Still, I’m doing it because I believe in the company’s mission. While They have made their share of mistakes (and what company hasn’t!) I believe they have good intentions on something I care about a great deal. Looking at the other EV’s and Hybrids, they all just look like half-assed attempts in comparison. No surprise though for such companies built around a combustion engine.

But anyway, I’m down for the cause and I am happy to support it. You only live once. Do what you love and do what matters to you. I hope it all works out for you man.

And yeah, I also reordered.

 

[Tertulian]

I understand your point. But Tesla isn't the one who is supposed to be paying the rebate. The government is. And they're saying I don't qualify.

Speaking of the sharp Tesla legal team, they have made it clear to my DA, who has made it clear to me, that under no circumstances should I assume the rebate will be coming. I was specifically told that on the basis of the legal advice from the Tesla lawyers, any queries about the rebate should be directed to the MTO.

Here's a slightly different question: If Tesla legal has a firm and binding agreement with the government, why not just say so? Why, instead, say "we can't say if you're going to get your rebate" and "we can't say whether there's an agreement" and "if you don't get your rebate, don't look to us"?

Tesla does not administer the program, they cannot guarantee anyone’s qualification. Period. There are many reasons why one might be denied the rebate that do not relate to the deadline and which are beyond Tesla’s control. They’ve told you what they’re allowed to tell you; the deadline has been extended for people who cancelled after July 11th on account of the (unlawful) cancellation of the rebate program.

As for folks at the MTO and MFO - remember the confusion initially when the program was cancelled; for the first week they’d either refer us back to the other department or tell us that we still qualified. This will undoubtedly take time to be properly communicated to the front line staff.

To be sure, I plan on including a cover letter with my rebate application explaining the situation and attaching my original order agreement (it has the date of my original order), my cancellation email detailing the reason for my cancellation, Tesla’s email explaining the recent events and grounds for re-ordering, and finally (of course) the application itself.

 

[ben1628]

Remember back in July, we were told Tesla wasn't eligible. We called US tesla, same thing, nothing they can do.

Suddenly, Tesla filed a lawsuit and Ford waited until a week before the deadline and said they won't appeal and will let Tesla goes through.

I'm sure between then and a week ago, they settled on an agreement. The letter is actually quite plain and said those who cancelled and re-order will now qualified. Really, if that is fake, they won't send out this email.

The MTO and finance won't know a thing until later. Tesla win a case without too much hard evidence. A letter that we get personally and detail what we have to do to qualify is sufficient evidence that they have an agreement. If they don't, I think Tesla would be on hook.