Porsche Mission E

[aus]

Lets keep in mind that Porsche is part of VW/Audi/Bently/Lambo. They could set up a network over time for the entire brand. They may not all charge at 400kW, but the VW family has a huge network of dealers as a starting point for chargers.

Tesla better get their act together in regards to the interior, because Porsche interiors are pretty nice, and if there's a Porsche Mission E, that means there's going to be a 4 door Audi E-Tron and Bently electric vehicle on the same chassis as well. VW has already said it plans on electric versions for all its cars.
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[mmd]

Not sure if they can actually pull it off but Porsche already had a 350kwh prototype.

Porsche installs first ultra-fast 350 kW EV charging station

This one in Baker, CA; was supposed to be ready by June. Who could be using these now?
EVgo Installing First 350 kW Ultra Fast Public Charging Station In The US

This coming next April, may be.
Tritium's First 350-kW DC Fast Chargers Coming To U.S. In April

 

[zambono]

Not sure if you've ordered a Porsche before but those options add up quickly, and it's still unclear about the charging infrastructure. How much automation they will provide, and if they will support over the air updates. Though I'm glad there is going to be actually competition that's always good. I don't think the bolt and the leaf are really direct competitors. It also seems like Faraday and lucid are struggling, and most others have vapor ware or bolting electric drive trains to ICE vehicles.

The only leg up I see is the Supercharger network. One could argue that Tesla has more experience with electric drive trains, but the other automakers have an advantage in quality manufacturing. I am aware of the options list, let's say $110k for a GTS version. I'm game, eventually high speed chargers using CCS will outnumber super chargers.

 

[zambono]

"Mission E to start at $85k"

What is your source for that?

Somebody else put the link to the story, couple responses back

 

[whitex]

From the article, it's not slated to go into production until late '19 and final design of the car has not even been set. I find it suspect that they can set a starting price for then car so early in the design phase.

Tesla announced Model 3 will start at $35K as much ahead, did you find it suspect too?

 

[whitex]

It depends on if people would chose it over a Tesla. I know I wouldn't.....Guess Im just biased

I would and definitely will consider it. Maybe I'm unbiased, or maybe just ready for a non-Beta product which actually delivers what it claims it can do. As for autotonomy, Tesla's lane keeping is not particularly useful to me since it requires constant supervision. If Tesla was to deliver what they are promising with FSD, yea, absolutely, advantage Tesla, but until then, it's worth $0 to me (actually, I would be ticked if they enabled EAP for free in it's current state in my wife's car as I would see it as a hazard for my wife who is not a techie and IMO could get hurt using it). Lastly, I would trust specs from Porsche, if they tell me they will deliver X horsepower, I would trust it. With Tesla, I would need to measure it myself as it's likely they'll later tell me how the motors are capable but not the battery that came with the car, or some other bullshit.

 

[whitex]

The only leg up I see is the Supercharger network. One could argue that Tesla has more experience with electric drive trains, but the other automakers have an advantage in quality manufacturing. I am aware of the options list, let's say $110k for a GTS version. I'm game, eventually high speed chargers using CCS will outnumber super chargers.

^ THAT

 

[SuisseDriver]

The only leg up I see is the Supercharger network. One could argue that Tesla has more experience with electric drive trains, but the other automakers have an advantage in quality manufacturing. I am aware of the options list, let's say $110k for a GTS version. I'm game, eventually high speed chargers using CCS will outnumber super chargers.

I think that a lot of those electrical concepts are just vaporware. All the concepts you see in Frankfuhrt this year and also the one before are just to occupy also the ground.
But you see also that almost nobody is announcing a clear price, or clear spec sheet, or clear availability date.

I do not think that the Mission E is vapourware, but all manufacturers are bound to the same constraints that give Tesla again the lead for at least half to a full decade to come:

• huge assets linked to the thermal engine (factories, supply chain, engineering, ...) that needs still to be amortized
• loss of knowledge for electrical aspect of the car: today, manufacturer are all outsourcing most of the components to concentrate only on the design / structure of a car and the engine. So all the electric transmission train is something that traditional manufacturer have to reacquire and it can take quite a long time. Tesla has an indisputable lead on this.
• battery: that is the BIG elephant in the room. Whereas LG, Samsung, Panasonic are capacity constraint and therefore the more battery the manufacturers will buy, the more expensive it will be sold to them, Tesla own fabrication allow them on the opposite to reduce the price of the battery.
  --> this alone is the reason why you will not see any high volume EV from others for many years to come. It will always be low volume production car. This is why you do not see long range EV from others (real one, no concept car) because you should not make an EV proposal to sexy for the buyer. It needs to have limited range or very expensive or ugly so that it still sells in confidential numbers.

Obviously, the Mission E is exactly in this case: very expensive, low volume car, not too high range, with a release in 2019-2020.. Even Porsche is not taking too much of a risk and still let's himself many years to continue selling their thermal car.

A Panamera hybrid is 100k$ and you need to add 20k of option to match the model S equipment so I don't think you will be able to get a Mission E for less than 100k$ minimum but let's see...

 

[ions]

Trust the specs of Porsche? Really? After they built an entire diesel segment industry out of lies?

 

[jelloslug]

Tesla announced Model 3 will start at $35K as much ahead, did you find it suspect too?

Not considering that they showed real functioning cars that were 90% true to the finished form. Currently, the Mission E is just a concept car.

 

[Burnt Toast]

No way a Mission E will start at $85k. This is a bullshit rumour.

 

[schonelucht]

I wonder how they're planning to compete with the Supercharger network.

Not sure about the US but in Europe the private market is taking this up through independent fast charging network operators. There are several fast charging networks, all with plans to expand to at least 100kW by 2018. On top of that in Porsche's home market, the government is now providing incentives to these operators to roll out more aggressively. For example Fastned bagged a 4M EUR German government grant to install 25 locations with multiple 150kW chargers at each location by first quarter next year. There is likely EU money to be had for the same purposes as well. By the time this car rolls out, major parts of Western Europe will be covered sufficiently well that the supercharger network is less of a decisive advantage.

 

[svp6]

Trust the specs of Porsche? Really? After they built an entire diesel segment industry out of lies?

You need to read a little more about Porsche before making flat statements. Diesel arrived very late in their lineup, and none of their iconic models has a diesel version.

Design of the Model E is fabulous, and I will consider it when it arrives. The more offers of EVs, the better for all of us.

 

[ecarfan]

The $85,000, Fully-Electric Porsche Mission E Will Arrive in 2019

That article states "the car will start at $85,000" based on another article at Porsche Mission E: the full lowdown on the first all-electric Porsche

That article doesn't give a price but says that according to "Chairman Oliver Blume", quote "Porsche Mission E 'priced like entry-level Panamera". Except the article doesn't show that statement in quotes.

I believe that in the US the Panamera base price is about $78,000

Bottom line is we really don't know what the Mission E base price will be or what features the base model will include. The Mission E was shown as a concept car two years ago. It is about two years away from going on sale. It is not a direct competitor to the Model S but it will likely be a competitive choice for some buyers.

Where will Tesla be two years from now? If recent history is any guide, Tesla will be offering high battery capacities and more standard features than we currently have. It is certain that the Tesla Supercharger network will be far larger than it is now. There will likely be some high speed DC charging locations that the Mission E can take advantage of but it seems certain to me that they will only be a small fraction of what Tesla will have.

I am glad Porsche finally appears to be getting serious about EVs. But they have a lot of catching up to do.

 

[Herolad]

The only leg up I see is the Supercharger network. One could argue that Tesla has more experience with electric drive trains, but the other automakers have an advantage in quality manufacturing. I am aware of the options list, let's say $110k for a GTS version. I'm game, eventually high speed chargers using CCS will outnumber super chargers.

There's no way you would be able to get a GTS for 110k... Maybe base but by the time you add everything up your probably looking at 140k at least. That's assuming they structure the pricing similar to the Panamera. Which has the same starting base price so I would think they would add up very similarly. Though 4S start at 110k so I doubt they will price it lower than a Panamera or out perform it at a lower price point with the mission E. They can't kill their other segments just like they do with Caymans they limit their performance so it doesn't but up against the 911s.

 

[RobertF]

We've owned a number of Porsche's. One thing they all had in common. High maintenance costs.

 

[ions]

I have porsche diesel and know porsche quite well. Everyone has different experiences and biases. Nothing wrong with that.
Anyway rooting for more EV options because they do drive better.

 

[Reciprocity]

Not sure if they can actually pull it off but Porsche already had a 350kwh prototype.

Porsche installs first ultra-fast 350 kW EV charging station

Sure they can pull it off. There are trade offs. Battery degradation is the big one. I would make sure they have a very good guarantee on the battery before buying that car. Also, where is the charging network for that at 350KW charging?

 

[WarpedOne]

People here own large luxury electric cars so the industry 'growth' hotspot isn't as relevant as a legitimate model S competitor. Which is what the mission e is.

This must be some new usage of present tense that I wasn't aware off.

 

[JonathanD]

Thank you Porsche for validating Tesla's entire business.

Much more than a Tesla competitor, Mission E is really a competitor for their own gasoline vehicles, which they've invested many billions of Euros and many decades of time refining and iterating upon. This signals the beginning to the end of that piece of the core DNA of Porsche.

Will future prospective buyers of Model S consider the Mission E as well? Sure, why not. Porsche has a great reputation for building high quality cars. But by then there will be hundreds of thousands of Model 3 on the road, Model Y will be in the works, new roadster on the horizon, probably unveil of the pickup at some point, not to mention the solar/powerwall ecosystem and vastly expanded supercharger network. Hopefully they will also be much closer to FSD as well which will ultimately disrupt the entire industry. Oh shoot and why not disrupt long haul trucking with the Semi. Long story short, Tesla is aiming to be much more than a manufacturer of premium electric sedans in this price range. By the time this Porsche hits the road, I am sure it is Tesla's intention that revenue from Model S is a relatively small part of their business. I consider it an honor to have been able to own and drive one of the cars that started this avalanche of change.