Stupid TWC install cost question…

[Timspeed]

So; this is going to sound stupid..BUUT
Has anyone paid an electrician to run copper from their TWC to their service panel…when it’s literally right next to it?
I’ve already got the 60amp breaker in the panel (put that in the other day)
I really just need someone to drill a hole in the Sheetrock, “knock-out” a hole in the breaker box, then run the copper (couldn’t be more than 6’ in total)
I’m thinking couldn’t be more than $100 labor? (Obviously the copper will be pricey and a couple bucks for some conduit/fittings.)
I just don’t have a proper wire stripper,
Nor a hole-cutter bit for my drill.

 

[Gauss Guzzler]

Sure. There's a lot more to it than "drilling a hole in sheetrock". You can't just poke wires thru a sheetrock hole into the back of the charger - you either need to run conduit into the top/bottom of the charger or mount the charger over an embedded box.

And your main panel is surely mounted between studs so they'd need to drill thru at least one to get to wherever they're going. Not a simple task when those wall cavities are full of wires!

The copper will only cost a few dollars but $200-$300 would be the minimum labor quote I'd expect.

 

[Timspeed]

Sure. There's a lot more to it than "drilling a hole in sheetrock". You can't just poke wires thru a sheetrock hole into the back of the charger - you either need to run conduit into the top/bottom of the charger or mount the charger over an embedded box.

And your main panel is surely mounted between studs so they'd need to drill thru at least one to get to wherever they're going. Not a simple task when those wall cavities are full of wires!

The copper will only cost a few dollars but $200-$300 would be the minimum labor quote I'd expect.

That’s kinda what I was expecting..which is crazy AF! It literally would take ME (a non-electrian) MAYBE an hour.
I can’t imagine an electrician making MORE than $100 an hour. (If so, *sugar* it thought a software engineer was the highest paid job!)

 

[ferdboyce]

That’s kinda what I was expecting..which is crazy AF! It literally would take ME (a non-electrian) MAYBE an hour.
I can’t imagine an electrician making MORE than $100 an hour. (If so, *sugar* it thought a software engineer was the highest paid job!)

Well, I suppose you could take your sheetrock wall and main panel to his shop, so he wouldn't have to charge you for travel time. That might save you an hour's labor right there.

 

[Timspeed]

Well, I suppose you could take your sheetrock wall and main panel to his shop, so he wouldn't have to charge you for travel time. That might save you an hour's labor right there.

IRS issues standard mileage rates for 2021 | Internal Revenue Service

IR-2020-279, December 22, 2020 — The IRS today issued the 2021 optional standard mileage rates used to calculate the deductible costs of operating an automobile for business, charitable, medical or moving purposes.

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I'd say getting 56c a mile is pretty generous already.

 

[Sophias_dad]

IRS issues standard mileage rates for 2021 | Internal Revenue Service

IR-2020-279, December 22, 2020 — The IRS today issued the 2021 optional standard mileage rates used to calculate the deductible costs of operating an automobile for business, charitable, medical or moving purposes.

www.irs.gov

I'd say getting 56c a mile is pretty generous already.

It sure is, if you are driving an EV!

BTW, I'm not convinced you actually need an electrical box directly behind your HPWC. The rear fittings(at least of a Gen2) are threaded to take a 3/4"(or was it 1"?) cable clamp, so it seems they expect you to use one. If you have a cable clamp there, you don't really need a box to do the clamping. Even though the Gen3 doesn't have a threaded spot, they expect you to drill a largish hole appropriate for a cable clamp in the baseplate, and then you would still be able to use a cable clamp, albeit with it's locknut.

As far as stripping of #4 AWG (required if you aren't using conduit), while there may be a specific tool for it, I think it's commonly stripped with a razor knife held at such an angle that it won't take chunks of copper out with it. Surprisingly, it might actually be better to use a duller razer blade, one that would cut insulation but not conductor.

 

[Jeremy3292]

That’s kinda what I was expecting..which is crazy AF! It literally would take ME (a non-electrian) MAYBE an hour.
I can’t imagine an electrician making MORE than $100 an hour. (If so, *sugar* it thought a software engineer was the highest paid job!)

It always blows my mind when people say things like this lol. If it would only take you an hour then why not just do it yourself? A hole saw and wire cutter are $20 from Lowes. Probably bc you are not a licensed electrician and you don't really know what you are doing, otherwise you would just do it yourself.

Businesses have overhead - licensing fees, insurance, taxes, trucks, supplies, depreciation, etc. - and they also have to drive to your house and time is money. Feel free to get multiple quotes; I imagine they will all be similar.

Don't pay $50,000+ for a car and then try to save a few hundred dollars on installing a charger...get it done right and safely.

 

[Scrannel]

Self installed a 14-50 with 6 AWG that is about four feet from my panel. Total cost: about $80.00 (I threw in the labor). However, in Los Angeles Country a home owner is allowed to do this -- and then get it signed off. That cost me another $100.00. If you don't know what you're doing... then don't do it.

 

[KenC]

I ran 8' of 6 gauge wire to a NEMA 14-50 Eaton box, I installed. With conduit and breaker, etc., I spent $85. Material cost is minimal, if you have a short-run, cause mostly copper wire is expensive. Labor and permitting can be pricy. I didn't need a permit, and my childhood licensed-electrician friend came over to check my work.

Since you seem to know enough to put in the breakers, you might know enough to do the rest. Do you have an electrician buddy who can look over your work?

 

[dmurphy]

That’s kinda what I was expecting..which is crazy AF! It literally would take ME (a non-electrian) MAYBE an hour.
I can’t imagine an electrician making MORE than $100 an hour. (If so, *sugar* it thought a software engineer was the highest paid job!)

It's not crazy at all. I'd say the minimum it would cost to roll a truck would be $100-$150, just to get to your house. Vehicle cost, maintenance, insurance, licensure, tools, training, office staff, billing costs -- all those things roll up into a small business. Not to mention missed opportunity cost, by working a small job vs. a larger, more lucrative one. You're in California; the requirements for a Master Electrician license includes at least 4 years of experience as a journeyman, plus passing several exams. They need to recoup that cost at some point, too.

It's like the story of the woman who called a plumber for a clogged pipe. The plumber comes in, looks at the pipe, whacks it with his fist, and it drains immediately. He hands the woman a bill for $150. She balks and says, "All you did was hit the pipe! I'll only pay you $5!" So he re-wrote the bill... "Hitting pipe with hand: $5. Knowing where: $145."

Unfortunately, the cost of doing business is high, and small jobs suffer. There's a base cost to each job, and unfortunately it's really noticeable on smaller jobs. Larger jobs of course can absorb those sunk costs.

So -- that said -- if you have any other electrical work that you've been putting off, it very well might make sense to do it at the same time. The sunk cost is the sunk cost - adding other odds-and-ends work to the task at hand is probably a cost savings vs. having them come out at a later date.

Just a thought; I did something similar recently with a plumber - had them out for a fairly minor issue but added on 3 other things that I've been nursing along for a while. Made sense while they were here - amortize the sunk cost across all 4 tasks ...

 

[jjrandorin]

That’s kinda what I was expecting..which is crazy AF! It literally would take ME (a non-electrian) MAYBE an hour.
I can’t imagine an electrician making MORE than $100 an hour. (If so, *sugar* it thought a software engineer was the highest paid job!)

A journeyman electrician is no less a professional occupation than a software engineer, so I have no idea why you think ones time is worth more than anothers. Also, in general, one gets paid by the job, and the other tends to be an occupation that works for a company (unless self employed).

Frankly, I get pretty annoyed at people basically denigrating someones time because "it doesnt take that long, so why does it cost X"? They place zero value on that persons knowledge and expect it to be done "for cost" for some reason.

If you want it done "for cost" you should either do it yourself, or have an electrician friend you know do it for you. Any electrician will have costs that are more than just the wire and the breaker and the time to install. They will have the costs inherent in running their business.

If you think you are being overcharged, get a few quotes. What you should not do, however, is assume that "the cost of the copper and breaker is the cost of the job".

 

[Rocky_H]

Not to mention missed opportunity cost, by working a small job vs. a larger, more lucrative one.

Yes, and people seem to forget all of the wasted overhead time cost in shuffling between jobs. When someone says, "It should take maybe an hour!", that's because you live there and are standing right there in your garage looking at it already, so your travel time is zero. It's not just the drive time for the electricians too. There is churn in the schedule between jobs of when this one finishes, based on that estimate, before you get to go to the next one, so there is lost time there, versus something they get to work on for 6 or 7 hours straight.

 

[Timspeed]

I see..so the BUSINESS owner gets the $300; the actual ELECTRICIAN gets maybe $50…I don’t support that racket.

 

[dmurphy]

I see..so the BUSINESS owner gets the $300; the actual ELECTRICIAN gets maybe $50…I don’t support that racket.

You mean the guy who pays for the trucks, and pays the income taxes, and payroll taxes, and liability insurance and workman’s comp insurance and pays for the office and billing and fuel and tools and training and materials and uniforms and licenses? That guy?

Yeah; he’s got a few costs to cover in this thing, too. Those things aren’t free. He might even make a few dollars of profit so his family can eat, if he’s lucky.

 

[jjrandorin]

I see..so the BUSINESS owner gets the $300; the actual ELECTRICIAN gets maybe $50…I don’t support that racket.

Then do it yourself /shrug.

A lot of electricians own their own business so they are the "actual electrician". There is no other way to spin this other than you "dont think their time or knowledge is worth what they are charging". If thats the case, do it yourself.

I guess at this point, since it sounds like I am "pro gouging" or something (which is likely how this would be attempted to be spun), I have to say that I am not an electrician, nor a business owner. I work in IT. I just value peoples experience when they are performing work, regardless of what that work is.

 

[Jeremy3292]

I see..so the BUSINESS owner gets the $300; the actual ELECTRICIAN gets maybe $50…I don’t support that racket.

I don't think you understand how businesses work lol...

 

[jboy210]

So; this is going to sound stupid..BUUT
Has anyone paid an electrician to run copper from their TWC to their service panel…when it’s literally right next to it?
I’ve already got the 60amp breaker in the panel (put that in the other day)
I really just need someone to drill a hole in the Sheetrock, “knock-out” a hole in the breaker box, then run the copper (couldn’t be more than 6’ in total)
I’m thinking couldn’t be more than $100 labor? (Obviously the copper will be pricey and a couple bucks for some conduit/fittings.)
I just don’t have a proper wire stripper,
Nor a hole-cutter bit for my drill.

I paid about $150 to have a NEMA 14-50 outlet installed next to my panel. No wallboard was cut, the socket was added with a 3-inch piece of conduit to the side of the panel to a surface mounted box containing the outlet. I plugged in the charging adapter that came with the car to charge.

Later I got a Tesla wall charger and paid about $800 to have it installed 10 feet away. This included cable from the existing breaker up into the ceiling, running it through 8 or so ceiling joists, and down an existing post. This did not include fixing the drywall which probably ran another $400 or so, but was not priced separately from other drywall work being done at the same time.