Wiki Sudden Loss Of Range With 2019.16.x Software

[yobigd20]

I just bought an adapter and odb2 and should have those delivered in 2 weeks or so. I’m at 199,865 miles and have been bitching about terrible range for years. Even though my max charge SAYS 230 on old software (been denying updates for a very long time), I can barely get 160 real world miles with no heat or ac on with the battery finished charging/warmed right before I leave and cruise control set to 70mph and I’m practically the slowest person on the road.

Gonna use the scan my Tesla to log data for a few months then possibly update to show the range drop then request a battery replacement under warranty. Driving anywhere takes 50% longer than ICE car due to the limited range and painfully slow supercharging. (Took me 29 hours to drive 1200 miles straight over the summer only charging to 80-85% max each stop, ditto on the reverse path exactly same time). Need to do something about this. I need the range back to get my life back as it’s just wasting away too much of my life sitting at superchargers and waiting.

 

[sorka]

I just bought an adapter and odb2 and should have those delivered in 2 weeks or so. I’m at 199,865 miles and have been bitching about terrible range for years

Just so you know, in case you don't, you can't just plug the OBDII adapter into the ODBII port. There's nothing there. You'll need to use the OBDII to DLC connector cable and plug into the DLC port.

 

[yobigd20]

Just so you know, in case you don't, you can't just plug the OBDII adapter into the ODBII port. There's nothing there. You'll need to use the OBDII to DLC connector cable and plug into the DLC port.

I know, that’s why I said “adapter” “and” “odb2”.

Specifically, I bought the “Tesla Diagnostic Cable Model S 2012-2015 OBD scan my Tesla scanmytesla” adapter cable off of eBay, and then I bought the “OBDLink MX+” adapter off of amazon.

 

[First EV]

I just bought an adapter and odb2 and should have those delivered in 2 weeks or so. I’m at 199,865 miles and have been bitching about terrible range for years. Even though my max charge SAYS 230 on old software (been denying updates for a very long time), I can barely get 160 real world miles with no heat or ac on with the battery finished charging/warmed right before I leave and cruise control set to 70mph and I’m practically the slowest person on the road.

Gonna use the scan my Tesla to log data for a few months then possibly update to show the range drop then request a battery replacement under warranty. Driving anywhere takes 50% longer than ICE car due to the limited range and painfully slow supercharging. (Took me 29 hours to drive 1200 miles straight over the summer only charging to 80-85% max each stop, ditto on the reverse path exactly same time). Need to do something about this. I need the range back to get my life back as it’s just wasting away too much of my life sitting at superchargers and waiting.

What size battery and what year? Something must be wrong since the range indicator is just based on a constant wh/mi and provides a range based on that constant for the kwh the car thinks it has in the battery. Maybe your battery has less capacity then the car recognizes. My 2014 S85 could very rarely meet the range indicator at those speeds during the right weather conditions. Usually the range indicator was over optimistic but never as bad as your reporting. Something must be wrong. If it's so bad as to be the point you just want your life back due to the time being wasted, and I can understand the feeling, then I suggest selling it and buying something else.

 

[gmo43]

Anyone get this update yet? Wondering if it's the update that will give me back my capacity. Because after I got few miles back with previous uodates it's back down to the original theft number. Also if you do the math when car charges it gives me my old full charge number but never actually charges to it.

Edit: deleted an double upload and spell check.

 

[Droschke]

Anyone get this update yet? Wondering if it's the update that will give me back my capacity. Because after I got few miles back with previous uodates it's back down to the original theft number. Also if you do the math when car charges it gives me my old full charge number but never actually charges to it.

Edit: deleted an double upload and spell check.

I do. No change.

 

[Widgeon]

Had my car die today at 12RM left, while I was flooring it. I had scan my Tesla hooked up and I saw one of the modules dipped below the threshold and initiated the shutdown, lowest cell was 2.5v at shutdown, float on the lowest cell after the shutdown was 3.3v. My car is a P85 with 88k miles on it, but my full charge is only 225, used to be 255 at time of purchase @33k miles, 12% degradation. I can clearly see one module failing through the app, what is grounds for warranty replacement regarding modules failing? Do we know under what circumstances battery errors will show, ie a certain internal resistance? I can’t Supercharge over 80kw anymore lol, and at 50% SOC it only supercharges at 40kw.

 

[Newscutter]

Most of the speculation about slower Supercharging has been connected to battery temps being too high.
With the recent software updates, it seems that regenerative braking is severely limited now in even moderately cool weather -- if it's present at all. (And yes, I've had this car for 5+ years, so I know it's more than just seasonal changes.)

Could the new limits on regen be connected to whatever else is (apparently) going wrong with our batteries? It sounds like the entire fleet got the regen change though, not just older cars... at least, from what I've seen.

 

[MP3Mike]

what is grounds for warranty replacement regarding modules failing?

For the S&X when the module fails Tesla will repair/replace the pack. Failure is when it will no longer charge or drive the car. (At least that is what we have seen from other people in similar situations.)

 

[Chaserr]

Regen limits are definitely connected to batterygate/chargegate. In Tesla's own words the day they released the capping firmware: "As we continue our investigation of the root cause, out of an abundance of caution, we are revising charge and thermal management settings on Model S and Model X vehicles via an over-the-air software update that will begin rolling out today"

This has always been about the fires that all happened at once earlier this year. They're nuking the problem from orbit and I think @Ferrycraigs is right in that they don't have the slightest clue how many cars are impacted for real.

The NHTSA is poring over their data; if Tesla didn't falsify everything sent to the federal investigators we should have a recall announcement in the next month or two. Hopefully by then Tesla has a grasp on a real "small number" of cars so they can appear to be cooperative when the hammer comes down.

 

[Droschke]

Could the new limits on regen be connected to whatever else is (apparently) going wrong with our batteries?

Yes. They are all somehow connected. Aggressive regen limits, voltage capping, 36kw charging at 50% Soc and loss of power, all point to one direction: these batteries are not holding up as they were supposed to.

 

[Gixx1300R]

Back in November my car would not fully charge (only to 98%) I scheduled a service appointment and this is what they sent and canceled the appointment. I drained the battery down to 10%-20% and 30% to rebalance the pack by slow charging and also supercharging. The pack will no longer charge to 98% and it is getting worse( now only to 95%). Slow supercharging, capped capacity, no longer charging to 100%

 

[lightningltd]

Perhaps this is because the battery is charging so gently (low charge rate) from 90-100% that it has time to cool down enough that the pumps/fans are no longer required?

No, I mean I SET it to 100% but unplugged at 90%

 

[lightningltd]

So a bit of good news sort of. The tech actually showed me the specific alert that came up and it explains why I don't have any symptoms related to battery hardware failures.

The error is actually BMS error 159 "WOT Cycles Exceeded". It's the WOT counter that triggered because I've gone over the limit.

The tech said that they've rarely seen this and the newer firmware simply ignores the count. In the past, this has been grounds for replacement but they've decided now that it's not an automatic replacement event.

He unstaged V10 and told me I was good to drive it with the error.

What do they mean by WOT Cycles exceeded?? In a Gas cat WOT is Wide Open Throttle. Not relevant to an EV since the motor and battery shouldn't care.

 

[Chaserr]

What do they mean by WOT Cycles exceeded?? In a Gas cat WOT is Wide Open Throttle. Not relevant to an EV since the motor and battery shouldn't care.

They mean he ran into one of their previous class action problems: Ludicrous Limiting. Tesla was caught limiting Ludicrous use a few years ago too. Sorka found another aspect of older Tesla malfeasance by using the product he bought as intended.

 

[lightningltd]

Had my car die today at 12RM left, while I was flooring it. I had scan my Tesla hooked up and I saw one of the modules dipped below the threshold and initiated the shutdown, lowest cell was 2.5v at shutdown, float on the lowest cell after the shutdown was 3.3v. My car is a P85 with 88k miles on it, but my full charge is only 225, used to be 255 at time of purchase @33k miles, 12% degradation. I can clearly see one module failing through the app, what is grounds for warranty replacement regarding modules failing? Do we know under what circumstances battery errors will show, ie a certain internal resistance? I can’t Supercharge over 80kw anymore lol, and at 50% SOC it only supercharges at 40kw.

They will probably cancel the appointment and give you the boilerplate answer:
"Blah Blah, tested and everything is fine. Blah Blah don't let it fall below 15 miles, blah blah."

 

[DJRas]

Regen limits are definitely connected to batterygate/chargegate. In Tesla's own words the day they released the capping firmware: "As we continue our investigation of the root cause, out of an abundance of caution, we are revising charge and thermal management settings on Model S and Model X vehicles via an over-the-air software update that will begin rolling out today"

This has always been about the fires that all happened at once earlier this year. They're nuking the problem from orbit and I think @Ferrycraigs is right in that they don't have the slightest clue how many cars are impacted for real.

The NHTSA is poring over their data; if Tesla didn't falsify everything sent to the federal investigators we should have a recall announcement in the next month or two. Hopefully by then Tesla has a grasp on a real "small number" of cars so they can appear to be cooperative when the hammer comes down.

I KNOW that Tesla asked for more time to produce all the docs requested by the NHTSA. But, they had been ordered to produce what they could by the Nov 28 deadline. I do not know what they did produce.
But, it is highly optimistic to expect a response in a month or two.

 

[Az_Rael]

Could the new limits on regen be connected to whatever else is (apparently) going wrong with our batteries? It sounds like the entire fleet got the regen change though, not just older cars... at least, from what I've seen.

Yes. They are all somehow connected. Aggressive regen limits, voltage capping, 36kw charging at 50% Soc and loss of power, all point to one direction: these batteries are not holding up as they were supposed to.

The new regen stuff applies to the 3 as well. Pulled out of my garage the other day with a garage temp of 64 degrees at 90% and was regen limited pretty significantly for a good 10/15 minutes. It is normally masked by the new departure charging, but this time we were starting with a "cold" battery if 64 degrees is cold.

Our S does that now too, when previously we wouldn't see temperature based regen limits until below 50ish.

So the regen stuff appears to be fleet wide.

 

[Ferrycraigs]

View attachment 488795 View attachment 488796 Back in November my car would not fully charge (only to 98%) I scheduled a service appointment and this is what they sent and canceled the appointment. I drained the battery down to 10%-20% and 30% to rebalance the pack by slow charging and also supercharging. The pack will no longer charge to 98% and it is getting worse( now only to 95%). Slow supercharging, capped capacity, no longer charging to 100%View attachment 488795

This seems to be a standard Template reply. I have seen this almost word for word elsewhere. I have had several similar instances. For the past 6 months I have had 2 months worth of emails (40) back and forward, and submitted 2 Formal Written Grievances. I must have explained on about 10 separate occasions that my complaint was Battery Capping, not Loss of Range. I can’t count the number of times they have ignored that and rejected my complaint on the basis of Loss of Range is not covered under the Warranty. They appear to wilfully ignore my emails saying I agree Loss of Range is not covered, despite me repeating the issue is Capping. They can’t defend capping so ALWAYS reply Loss of Range is not covered. I also get repeated replies with the 'for the longevity of the battery' or 'a small percentage of owners...' or 'we are working on mitigating the effect' rubbish. They are not interested in engaging in any form of dialogue or discussion. Probably because their position is indefensible. They have shown a determination to simply say NO, No fault found, go away.

 

[eye.surgeon]

I submitted a service request through the app complaining about slow supercharging (I'm a chargegate victim, 2014 S85 that wont supecharge over 60 kwh any more) . I am sure I will get the canned denial back from them. But i want them to know we are aware and it is unacceptable.

UPDATE- took them 20 minutes to call me and cancel the appointment saying there was nothing they could do. I asked the tech about the chargegate situation but he wasn't interested in discussing it. Honestly of all the issues and scandals that Tesla has gone through, most of which I felt was no big deal or overblown, this issue could be the one that brings them down. If people know that the car they buy today with the capabilities stated on the window sticker can be neutered at any time by Tesla with a software update, they will think twice. I know I am.