Supercharger Event 2012/9/24

[Citizen-T]

No, they're vertically integrated and they're going to use the Supercharger to protect their position as the practical luxury BEV maker. 30 minutes for 150 miles is still too slow to support a large volume.

Agree, people have been saying for a long time that the big autos can just step in and take Tesla's lunch whenever they so please. Elon just placed yet another multi-year engineering chasm between Tesla and other EVs coming onto the market. They can't use Tesla's infrastructure, and unless Nissan or GM has been working on something similar in secret for a long time, they aren't going to have their own.

 

[Trnsl8r]

So this morning I drove a Perf in Santana Row, and made my final decisions on color selections. I was planning to finalize my fully loaded P85 order tomorrow morning after flying home to Pittsburgh, provided the Supercharger announcement was good news. Unfortunately this news leaves me utterly dejected. Even if the red dot stations were live tomorrow, they are almost unusable for all of my required inter-city trips out of Pittsburgh, to eastern PA, upstate NY, and west to Indianapolis (this is the only one that might work, depending on which side of Columbus gets the SC). Looks like instead of finalizing tomorrow, I will be delaying indefinitely, maybe even canceling and reconsidering options come 2015, when there really is a network. I am so utterly disappointed...was really hoping for a "every Walmart in the US will have an SC by end of 2013" type announcement. Perhaps I was being overly optimistic, but I need to travel between cities for work, rather than a daily commuter.

I guess I'm easily impressed. Considering where TM is financially, I had expected an announcement along the lines of them having one station somewhere between San Francisco and LA coming online later this year or something. That they had six stations already live blew me away, and the expansion plans look really aggressive.

 

[bbmertz]

Also, since the Supercharger page does not mention limiting your use of the Supercharger, then I would guess that there will either be some fine print somewhere about the effects, or hopefully, the fact that they are limiting it to only charge half the battery at a time preserves the life of the battery with no ill effect.

I attended today's event and spoke with a Tesla technician to clarify this issue regarding potential adverse effects of supercharging on battery life. He explained that frequent supercharging actually causes NO degradation of battery life if the vehicle is set in Standard charging mode. It is only Range charging which causes degradation. He also mentioned that the 85kWh battery will reach ~80% charge after 45 minutes after which the rate of supercharging slows to protect the battery.

It was great to see Elon and George in person, and to witness the evolution of the electric vehicle industry. I am looking forward to taking delivery of my S in December (?) and enjoying living vicariously through the Signature owners as they receive their cars in the meantime!

 

[doug]

You can watch it on the site again now.

Where is it on the site?

You can see it here:
Supercharger unveiling event - Blogs - Tesla Motors Club - Enthusiasts & Owners Forum

 

[olanmills]

@bbmertz Awesome! That's the information everyone has been waiting to see.

Obviously, it will be reassuring to see it in writing somewhere, but it sounds very plausible to me. After all, if frequent supercharging was an issue, then I would assume that it would be mentioned somewhere on the fact page now that the cat is out of the bag, and especially because there are actually current owners who are eligible to start using the superchargers right now.

 

[jstoneman]

I couldn't help thinking as I was watching the video....so this is what will replace gas stations. A HOME RUN! Well done everybody at Tesla! No tell us how many Model S's are out of the factory!

 

[smorgasbord]

...Pittsburgh, to eastern PA, upstate NY, and west to Indianapolis (this is the only one that might work, depending on which side of Columbus gets the SC).

Hmm, looks to me list there's one in Pittsburg, Albany, Philly, and close to Williamsport. I guess if you're going to Syracuse or Rochester you're not doing well, though. Maybe time to start suggesting something to Tesla.

 

[spatterso911]

Also attended the event tonight. Finer points learned from my many questions to Elon and George and JB...

1. The superchargers will produce more energy than can be used by charging the car. They are connected to the grid, thus will contribute energy to the grid. Solar City is providing the installation of the PV panels.
2. The large monolith IS functional and contains the hardware and components used by the supercharging system. In some locations, due to local ordinances, they cannot build the monolith, so it will be placed in non-descript boxes near the charging station. It may not be the final design, and looked significantly different 3 days ago. Apparently Elon's space alien idea got shot down in favor of the "rocket ship".
3. Batteries are used to store energy (same or similar to Model S) and are also located near the charging stations. They are NOT located in the roof of the station due to weight.
4. There will be 2+ stalls per station. They will calculate based upon population density of Model S/X/Gen III units sold in that area, increase the number in areas with greater population.
5. The superchargers do not affect battery life according to one of the supercharger engineers. They will charge in standard mode, ramping the charge down as the battery exceeds 50% charge so that the battery is protected.
6. The supercharging stations have a single on/off button on them, which, when pressed, reveals the charging cable (same Tesla connector). Pressing the charger handle button opens the charge door on the car exactly like the standard charging cable. Once you dock the cable after charging, there is a pause, and then the door closes, hiding the charging cable. I have video and pictures of this in action.
7. 100-150 miles is a reasonable separation distance. This is how they plan to distribute the supercharging stations.
8. It is a DC supercharger.
9. Roadster owners will not be able to use the superchargers. Some owners were very upset to learn this and requested that 70 A charging stations be installed at the supercharging stations. They suggested placing inverters with the charging stations so that the DC current can be converted for the roadsters. George stated that they will consider this, but made no promises.
10. The superchargers will remain absolutely free to any Tesla vehicle with the appropriate charging hardware. This means that 60 kWh equipped with supercharger hardware, and 85 kWh vehicles will be able to freely charge anywhere within the network of superchargers. The superchargers will not work for vehicles not equipped with the supercharger hardware. I'm sorry I didn't ask if any previously built vehicle can be outfitted later with supercharger hardware for a fee.

Some tidbits which are off-topic but I'm dying to share with you...

1. Elon stated that the P85 badge will be available for all MSP vehicles, and the P85 on his car (Vin#2) is the badge, not the original badge on Jurvetson's car (Vin#1).
2. Tow hitches will be available for the Model X
3. Model X will be more expensive than a comparably equipped Model S.
4. Model X deliveries apparently will be in mid 2013 as opposed to the start of 2013. Not fully confirmed in a follow up question, but I heard it straight from the guy who knows the answers.
5. Service center construction will be phased in and located based upon the population density of owners.

Hope this helps. I'm tired, so pics will be posted in the AM.

 

[efusco]

Thanks for the great post Spatters...
Seems there are some minor points that we're hearing different things on e.g. on-site batteries vs not, # of charging stations, etc.
Interesting to get confirmation from a 2nd source of "no harm" to the battery w/ supercharging--that's different than what Elon's been saying previously and different than conventional thought.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

Thanks for the great post Spatters...
Seems there are some minor points that we're hearing different things on e.g. on-site batteries vs not, # of charging stations, etc.
Interesting to get confirmation from a 2nd source of "no harm" to the battery w/ supercharging--that's different than what Elon's been saying previously and different than conventional thought.

Well, the charging rate isn't quite the rate Elon was talking about originally. Maybe they backed off to preserve the pack.

 

[GSP]

Is a video of last night's presentation available?

GSP

 

[EV_QC]

Is a video of last night's presentation available?

GSP

Tesla Motors Supercharger Event on Vimeo

 

[scole04]

Thanks for the great post Spatters...
Seems there are some minor points that we're hearing different things on e.g. on-site batteries vs not, # of charging stations, etc.
Interesting to get confirmation from a 2nd source of "no harm" to the battery w/ supercharging--that's different than what Elon's been saying previously and different than conventional thought.

+1 yah no harm to the battery is a game changer. I do seem to remember Elon speaking of an even more robust charging rate in distant past when speaking of possible degredation to the battery cells. For ppl living near these stations i would honestly just use these superchargers for normal charging.

 

[GSP]

Tesla Motors Supercharger Event on Vimeo

Thanks!

GSP

 

[efusco]

+1 yah no harm to the battery is a game changer. I do seem to remember Elon speaking of an even more robust charging rate in distant past when speaking of possible degredation to the battery cells. For ppl living near these stations i would honestly just use these superchargers for normal charging.

Absolutely...free, no CO2 (more than I can say for the electricity at my home), convenient--put it at a coffee house and I'll become a regular customer! But I sure want to be absolutely certain that Tesla will back me up if the battery starts showing premature depletion.

 

[AnOutsider]

4. Model X deliveries apparently will be in mid 2013 as opposed to the start of 2013. Not fully confirmed in a follow up question, but I heard it straight from the guy who knows the answers.

Surely you mean 2014? Otherwise, my bank account will not be happy, but I would.

 

[spatterso911]

Surely you mean 2014? Otherwise, my bank account will not be happy, but I would.

Right! Chalk it up to late night posting and an exhausted brain after driving back from LA. Mid-2014 it is!

 

[JakeP]

Hmm, looks to me list there's one in Pittsburg, Albany, Philly, and close to Williamsport. I guess if you're going to Syracuse or Rochester you're not doing well, though. Maybe time to start suggesting something to Tesla.

Yes, I am going to call them this morning to get more details on specific locations and timing...it doesn't make sense to me that the chargers would be at endpoint cities of Pittsburgh and Philly, which are separated by 300 miles. Obviously they need one (or more) between the major cities, along the interstates. And there is a perfect rest area that is midway between the two, that services both directions of travel for the PA turnpike...I was shocked to see no dot there. It would cover all E-W PA travel, as well as traffic up from DC.

And if I can barely reach some of these stations with an 85kWh, what does that mean for a 60kWh? I can understand they are basing this on customer density, but if they skimp on the travel corridors in the NE, they will be vastly restricting the future density. But maybe I am the outlier, needing the inter-city trips for work frequently, I dunno. My gut tells me the American everyman needs a solid network at least every 100 miles on the interstate system, before he will bite...even on free "gas".

 

[adric22]

10. The superchargers will remain absolutely free to any Tesla vehicle with the appropriate charging hardware. This means that 60 kWh equipped with supercharger hardware, and 85 kWh vehicles will be able to freely charge anywhere within the network of superchargers. The superchargers will not work for vehicles not equipped with the supercharger hardware. I'm sorry I didn't ask if any previously built vehicle can be outfitted later with supercharger hardware for a fee.

Its a pitty they won't include a standard J1772 for other brands of electric vehicles. It isn't like it would have costed a whole lot extra.

One nice thing, though. Since they are free I bet they will be more reliable since they won't require any sort of card to validate its use.

 

[ElSupreme]

I see lots of upgrades and drop outs for 40 packs ... Net neutral for 40's.

There is certainly a much larger incentive for me to try to get the 60kWh pack.