Tesla Model 3 in Australia

[Vostok]

the opinion of some rich kid in sydney unfortunately does not really count - you need to make EVs available for the masses, not for a few selected rich people in sydney with their solar, powerwall 2 and 100% green power with their achieved 85% self consumption blablabla.

There was a time when flatscreen TVs cost $20,000 and were the plaything of very rich people. How much do they cost now? How many houses don’t have one?

The point of my tale is that it proves the narrative wrong that it’s not possible to live a modern lifestyle on renewables and that EVs run on coal. And that is a truly beautiful thing.

And you missed the point that these things are getting cheaper. 24% of Australian households now have solar on their roof - the highest proportion in the world. And postcodes with lower median incomes actually have higher penetration of solar than postcodes with higher incomes. So it’s not a “rich kid” thing at all. Battery storage will become more compelling too, either at a household or community level. So even if a relatively small proportion can almost go off-grid now, that percentage will only increase.

Keep dreaming that none of this is happening.

 

[Random206]

@Random206 great job . Just added my 2c data to the spreadsheet. A suggestion to improve the data usefulness - Are you an existing Tesla owner? I'm not, but going by what others say and Tesla's normal practice, it's likely to play a part in 3 delivery.

Boom! Added, good thought!

 

[Priit]

You guys with smaller brakes (P3-) may have serious issues nationwide though because Tesla’s registration on the federal RVTS system only includes two variants SR+ with regular brakes and the P3+ with big brakes.

https://rvcs.infrastructure.gov.au/perl/50079_1307746_RVD_16May2019083200.cmd

That is not entirely true, Tesla has updated that registration and now there are 4 variants:
https://rvcs.infrastructure.gov.au/perl/50079_1316046_RVD_19Jul2019083223.cmd

 

[paulp]

You cannot put sufficient PV solar on your roof to cover your EV power consumption in North Queensland?!?

That's interesting!

I havnt seen the roof in question, however not every roof can fit sufficient PV for self-suffiency.

 

[1st in Line]

Coal in the ground and sun in the air are both free. The difference is that the workers for the mining industry all get money and pay their taxes which is a significant boost to the economy unlike a few lonely engineers who look after solar plants.

Burning coal kills people and this planet.

The rest of society and future generations pay the price for the current [perhaps the final] generation of coal mining jobs.

There are more blue collar jobs in renewable energy than "a few lonely engineers" - at least according to Forbes:

Renewable Energy Job Boom Creates Economic Opportunity As Coal Industry Slumps

For Australia, it looks like there are also more jobs in renewable energy than in the coal industry:

Booming sector to offer 60,000 new jobs

For PV solar, there are jobs in:

R&D
Manufacture and processing
Wholesale Sales
Distribution
Retail sales
System design
Installation
System optimisation and maintenance

There are jobs in coal as well, but how many of those are going to be lost to automation going forward?

Coal is history. I can understand how we used coal when we did not know any better and had no cleaner and cheaper alternatives, but in this day and age, it is clear that the only sustainable future is with renewable energy. Every action that does not move us towards this sustainable future is a wasted opportunity and comes at a cost to society.

 

[meowsers]

That is not entirely true, Tesla has updated that registration and now there are 4 variants:
https://rvcs.infrastructure.gov.au/perl/50079_1316046_RVD_19Jul2019083223.cmd

Yeah but they forgot to include the bigger brakes in the engine variants. They still only list 2 options. The vehicle standards unit pointed this out to me and they will not issue an approval for engine type C until this is rectified..... Thankfully I got the P+ so I don't need to encounter this issue, but depending on your state, and how your VIN is coded this will cause issues.

 

[JayTee]

There was a time when flatscreen TVs cost $20,000 and were the plaything of very rich people. How much do they cost now? How many houses don’t have one?

The point of my tale is that it proves the narrative wrong that it’s not possible to live a modern lifestyle on renewables and that EVs run on coal. And that is a truly beautiful thing.

And you missed the point that these things are getting cheaper. 24% of Australian households now have solar on their roof - the highest proportion in the world. And postcodes with lower median incomes actually have higher penetration of solar than postcodes with higher incomes. So it’s not a “rich kid” thing at all. Battery storage will become more compelling too, either at a household or community level. So even if a relatively small proportion can almost go off-grid now, that percentage will only increase.

Keep dreaming that none of this is happening.

Is it really 24%, that seems high? I live in a fairly affluent part of Sydney and google earth shows bugger all Solar installed near me, less than 10%. Cant really understand why more owners dont do it, I put 8kw on 12 months ago and havent paid a power bill yet, bills were averaging $800 per qtr before. Should pay itself back within 3 to 4 years, great investment.

 

[sczsimos]

The jobs in coal can be fixed pretty easily.

The vested interests in coal don't want to be fixed. Its like any industry on its lifeline. Lots of money being spent on political capture and patently false propaganda. EVs are stealing weekends after all.

 

[paulp]

Burning coal kills people and this planet.

The rest of society and future generations pay the price for the current [perhaps the final] generation of coal mining jobs.

There are more blue collar jobs in renewable energy than "a few lonely engineers" - at least according to Forbes:

Renewable Energy Job Boom Creates Economic Opportunity As Coal Industry Slumps

For Australia, it looks like there are also more jobs in renewable energy than in the coal industry:

Booming sector to offer 60,000 new jobs

For PV solar, there are jobs in:

R&D
Manufacture and processing
Wholesale Sales
Distribution
Retail sales
System design
Installation
System optimisation and maintenance

There are jobs in coal as well, but how many of those are going to be lost to automation going forward?

Coal is history. I can understand how we used coal when we did not know any better and had no cleaner and cheaper alternatives, but in this day and age, it is clear that the only sustainable future is with renewable energy. Every action that does not move us towards this sustainable future is a wasted opportunity and comes at a cost to society.

The installation alone (on your list) has created a significant industry in australia, and although home batteries are questionable financially (but getting close) they are starting another industry sub-group. I know coal miners would need considerable re-training to these new industries, but its easy to see how the employment numbers in renewables is significant.
Similar thing happening with EV’s. Other than the cars, there is a lot of jobs created in designing, installing, and maintaining the public and private charging infrastructure. Its only increasing, and the model 3 shows how a rapid scale-up will be needed.

 

[1st in Line]

Think of all those poor tradies who'll no longer be able to make a living by doing oil changes, cleaning out spark plugs, topping up the radiator, and the gearbox oil! How will they be able to afford a good weekend away when that's all gone?

Unfortunately, technological change results in job losses in certain industries. For example, the Internet was the death of many small scale retailers and traditional media. However, we can not stop the internet nor can we turn back time.

I am actually most excited about the future FSD capability of my Model 3. I am not sure if this is going to happen within 12 months, but I am almost certain that it will not happen later than in 10 years time - i.e. well within the lifetime of my future car.

With autonomous cars I see massive job losses in traditional transport based professions. Even the aged-care sector could collapse, as elderly people will be able to stay in their own homes for longer, as they can maintain their independence with the assistance of autonomous cars for a little bit longer than without them. There is inevitably going to be a short-term overcapacity in this capital hungry industry [imho].

I do not think that there is anything I or anyone else here can do to stop this change from happening, as it will be driven by autonomous EV cars being an order of magnitude cheaper to run than traditional transportation services.

However, what we as a society should be doing, is to prepare for the coming change.

I see very little evidence of this happening.

 

[1st in Line]

I havnt seen the roof in question, however not every roof can fit sufficient PV for self-suffiency.

I havnt seen the roof in question, however not every roof can fit sufficient PV for self-suffiency.

Candleflame did not refer to any specific roof as far as I can tell, but made the rather categoric statement that you "Cannot in North Queensland".

 

[paulp]

Unfortunately, technological change results in job losses in certain industries. For example, the Internet was the death of many small scale retailers and traditional media. However, we can not stop the internet nor can we turn back time.

I am actually most excited about the future FSD capability of my Model 3. I am not sure if this is going to happen within 12 months, but I am almost certain that it will not happen later than in 10 years time - i.e. well within the lifetime of my future car.

With autonomous cars I see massive job losses in traditional transport based professions. Even the aged-care sector could collapse, as elderly people will be able to stay in their own homes for longer, as they can maintain their independence with the assistance of autonomous cars for a little bit longer than without them. There is inevitably going to be a short-term overcapacity in this capital hungry industry [imho].

I do not think that there is anything I or anyone else here can do to stop this change from happening, as it will be driven by autonomous EV cars being an order of magnitude cheaper to run than traditional transportation services.

However, what we as a society should be doing, is to prepare for the coming change.

I see very little evidence of this happening.

You wont see FSD that is human free on any current tesla (this is my opinion only), however I agree it should be with us within 10 years. Tesla will likely offer expanded assisted driving in the next 2-3 years.
As for aged care, mobility is not what causes people to have to leave the family home. Autonomous cars will have no impact on aged care. The medical industry, the design of detection systems, and adaptable house design are the factors of influence there. A solid review of statistics and demographics shows the age care sector will go into decline once the baby boomers have all passed through. In the meantime its a bigger gold mine than any coal mine.

 

[1st in Line]

The installation alone (on your list) has created a significant industry in australia, and although home batteries are questionable financially (but getting close) they are starting another industry sub-group. I know coal miners would need considerable re-training to these new industries, but its easy to see how the employment numbers in renewables is significant.
Similar thing happening with EV’s. Other than the cars, there is a lot of jobs created in designing, installing, and maintaining the public and private charging infrastructure. Its only increasing, and the model 3 shows how a rapid scale-up will be needed.

I could not agree more with you paulp. We need to urgently look at re-training coal miners.

However, we also need to start thinking about all the jobs that are going to be lost in transportation over the next couple of decades once autonomous cars are on the roads. I imagine the current jobs in the coal industry pale into insignificance when compared to all taxi and uber drivers, all delivery and truck drivers, bus drivers, etc.

With the current rate of progress, it is only a matter of time - short time - before these jobs are all under threat.

What is the plan in Australia for dealing with that?

 

[meowsers]

The other interesting thing I just noticed is that the engine b and c option have 10kw difference. I'm not sure how these are allocated so it's either the LR AWD or the P-. They don't break it down any further. I would imagine the P3+ and - are both 360kw and the LR AWD is 350? No idea. But the weight difference and towing ratings are different.

1 is the SR
2 is the performance + only (500kg!! towing capacity, prob due to wheels)
3 is the Long range AWD?
4 is the performance -

Because 2 is the performance 1856 tare mass , so 4 must be the performance - with the same mass.

IF we are thinking the LR AWD is number 3, it weighs a bit more than the SR and a bit less than the performance. Very weird. Wheels cant be the defining factor because 2 and 4 weigh the same even though they have different wheels.

 

[paulp]

The real question though is this;
Will we get a full page of this forum without a theory on which boat or truck M3 is on?

 

[hatrack]

Guys - Irish based poster here, I’ve read last few pages. Has anyone in Australia or New Zealand gotten a final invoice in their account yet or received a delivery window?

 

[meowsers]

But looking at this if those numbers are right, the performance + and - have different "engines" or power outputs. not sure what to make of this.

The S means Standard and the N means not-available, O would mean optional.

 

[paulp]

I could not agree more with you paulp. We need to urgently look at re-training coal miners.

However, we also need to start thinking about all the jobs that are going to be lost in transportation over the next couple of decades once autonomous cars are on the roads. I imagine the current jobs in the coal industry pale into insignificance when compared to all taxi and uber drivers, all delivery and truck drivers, bus drivers, etc.

With the current rate of progress, it is only a matter of time - short time - before these jobs are all under threat.

What is the plan in Australia for dealing with that?

I have a hunch that it will mostly happen organically. There is no overnight switch that will change everything. As you suggest its a couple of decades, so our younger people will stop seeing those jobs as attractive. They will be drawn to new jobs that we dont even know exist yet, just as we didnt know home battery installers were a thing until tesla made them mainstream.

 

[paulp]

Candleflame did not refer to any specific roof as far as I can tell, but made the rather categoric statement that you "Cannot in North Queensland".

Maybe there are too many coconut trees

 

[qiSun]

the opinion of some rich kid in sydney unfortunately does not really count - you need to make EVs available for the masses, not for a few selected rich people in sydney with their solar, powerwall 2 and 100% green power with their achieved 85% self consumption blablabla.

Back to basic maths, the masses is starting with 1 then 2 then ...
I'm one in the masses. If I wait, one day it will be my turn then I thank the masses for bringing the cost down. Everybody is