Tesla Supercharger network

[scaesare]

Scaesare,

1st off, have to say I appreciate the thoughtful discourse going on here - it's nice to have a discussion without worrying about people *@#! on you cause you are voicing a different opinion.

Agreed... I appreciate it as well... especially in a forum setting where electronic communication can easily be misconstrued.

Now that said :smile:, the reason Tesla really doesn't have the right (maybe the wrong way to say it, but I hope to get my meaning) to go behind closed doors is because we all are, in effect, providing them a loan. We gave them money, they promised us a future feature - access to Super Chargers that will make long distance travel possible. Since we invested money in that effort, it would be responsible of Tesla to show how that effort is proceeding.

I think I get your drift... but much of what i'm trying to get across in this thread (among others) is that Tesla appears to be doing the best it can at novel new things,and at the same time seems to honestly be interested in balancing customer best interests with it's own.

As a result, we are getting information in a much more rapid, and "raw" format than typical for a $2bil company. We are getting maps with future plans, short term and long. We are getting updates as things change. They are accepting nominations for suggested locations.

It doesn't have to be that way. Take Nissan for example.. there's some small blurbs that tell us they are planning on putting in 100 Chademo stations, but very little insight as to where, what the progression will be along the way, etc... despite the fact that Nissan charged customers for the DC fast charge option, and recently it's been suggested that 90% of Leaf owners may have opted for it.

All of which is to say: Tesla could fulfill the "obligation" you refer to by simply saying, "Coming soon: 100 charging stations in 2014!" and that's it.

And I'm afraid that if we don't realistically recognize this is a ground-breaking (literally!) effort and react accordingly with good will, eventually it won't be worth their time to interact with us accordingly.

Now, the "Tesla is saying to hell with us" statement I believe is a bit out of context. My interpretation of said statement is;

Tesla charged a flat fee to buy into the Super Charger game - yet my money is being valued less than someone elses. People in CA are enjoying the benefits of promised feature now, and locations that would have allowed me to enjoy it were removed. And to make matters worse, Telsa's priority seems to be about a publicity stunt - rather than fulfilling thier promise to people who have already given them thier money. BTW: aren't they having trouble keeping up with demand anyways???

And I see that as a knee-jerk reaction that imputes ill motive and doesn't allow for the possibility that this whole roll-out is a work in progress. Don't forget, Neroden's post earlier said " Tesla isn't even trying any more..." as if they are simply giving up on the whole idea and that the supercharger roll-out is some token effort all of the sudden.

If he wanted to express his concern that he will have coverage in his region, then they've offered methods to communicate that. If he instead wants to assume motive that he can't possibly be in a position to know for sure, then as far as I'm concerned he's just grousing.

I'm going to do my best to provide a counterpoint in as constructive a manner as possible to meet my desires. And in this thread I'm trying to provide some perspective in the hopes others will do the same.

I'll point out that Tesla's subsequent mea culpa on the map error and quick update to include more supercharger sites indicates to me that my confidence was not naive or misplaced thus far. Interestingly I haven't seen a lot in the way of retractions from the likes of the more vocal complainers once the updated map came out...

 

[SFOTurtle]

People in CA are enjoying the benefits of promised feature now, and locations that would have allowed me to enjoy it were removed.

Have you contacted Tesla directly to determine whether those locations that disappeared from the revised map are actually no longer in the rollout plan?

 

[scaesare]

Yes , but that was after I had already responded to Brianman admitting that my statement about firing was an exaggeration for drama and brevity (e.g. instead of typing "should be reprimanded or have his/her performance rating downgraded" or the like).

Perhaps you missed the point where I was addressing exactly "how they could go through the effort of re planning and publishing new maps and then immediately say "oops that was a mistake". I'll quote it again for you:

I'll give you option #3: things are moving fast and furious within Tesla and there was a fumble between teams.


I've been in IT for nearly 25 years. If you think that it's unreasonable to EVER deploy the wrong file from source control, power up the wrong system, accidentally copy the wrong file, aim at the development DB rather than the production DB, etc... then you must be a fun guy to work with.

That addressed the potential reason behind the botched update... not your call for firings, which you later admitted was dramatic.

The people doing the map likely aren't also dealing with the NHTSA, negotiating with local authorities etc. They could best help the cause and their struggling colleagues by ensuring their work is error-free or as close to it as possible. If nothing else, that would reduce the number of emails and calls that their Ownership colleagues have to deal with. But enough on this already.

Yeah, but I bet the people who are managing the supercharger rollout are communicating with people in the field talking to county boards. And the bean-counters. And the engineering folks. And the production folks. And they are providing feedback to Elon and the executive team. And incorporating the executive feedback in to the revised plans. And those updated plans given to the web team. And the marketing folks. And they are coordinating with the database team. And then they actually deploy some content update.

No chance for a missed communication there.

 

[Nathan Smith]

SFOTurtle,

That statement was purely my attempt to interpret neroden's comment back on 2360...

Bleah.

So the new map confirms that the "Fall 2013" and "Winter 2013" maps are simply not going to be achieved, and that Tesla isn't even trying any more, by abandoning most of the planned Superchargers on them, including ALL the ones which would be useful to me. Some of these are gone *permanently* (nothing in Ann Arbor/Jackson any more). The rest are now expected in "2014", for which I'll read December 31, 2014, which I think is optimistic based on Tesla's past history.

It appears that the company is going to do their best to make Elon's road trip possible, and to hell with everyone else until that's done; not really a great way to do planning, IMHO.

And even in the 2015 plan, it still won't be reliable to drive west from Ithaca into Ohio in midwinter, due to the Buffalo-Cleveland gap being dangerously large for cold-weather range, and lacking even low-speed chargers. (And being a massive detour to start with.)

So we'll have to ask Neroden that question, since my mind reading capabiity didn't get to which sites he was referring to.

 

[jvonbokel]

So there has to be another dot between Rapid City and Mitchell, SD. I-90 in that region is pretty empty. How about Murdo, SD; it looks pretty close to the dot on the Tesla Supercharger Page. See Rapid City, SD to Mitchell, SD - Google Maps for details.

There's also a place in Murdo called Pioneer Auto Museum, which is apparently part diner and part museum. That would make for a great place to stop on the way through that area. And it's right next to a Pilot Travel Center which is open 24/7.

 

[Tyl]

Gilroy California this afternoon… The NEW superchargers are humming! …. that's gotta be a good sign:biggrin: ..and great signage too!!

…. and LED Christmas lights use almost no energy so solar, even in winter, gives me free lights {kWh} too!! Easy to add a few more!!

 

[Sgt Barone]

Thanks for the update on Gilroy, Tyl! And your Christmas lights look beautiful!

 

[Zythryn]

Mitchell SD is now showing in the onboard navigation with the latest minor firmware update (x.xx.25).

 

[napabill]

Recent email I sent to TM:
Wanted to go on record that the Quartzsite SC location is wonderful, but worthless without something in the Cabazon/Indio area to the west and Buckeye/Gila Bend to the east. Very frustrating to those of us that need to get from NorCal to PHX/TUC. I talked my wife into spending the night at a KOA campground last spring, but she has indicated that that will be the last time for her. Please tell me something will be open by the end of the year!

Thanks, and keep up the good work.

...Bill (P83)

TM Response:
Hi Bill,
Thank you for your email. We are in the process of developing the LA to Phoenix corridor and indeed have sites planned for the Indio and Buckeye areas. We are targeting completion by very early 2014. Please continue to monitor our website for updates.

We appreciate your enthusiasm and support of Tesla and our Supercharger technology.

Thanks,
Tesla Supercharger Team

 

[scaesare]

Ahhh... that response confirms what several of us have been saying here: Tesla is likely still actively developing the supercharger infrastructure plan. Just because the interim map updates have removed some sites, it doesn't mean that Tesla is not actively working to fill those gaps... and it certainly doesn't mean that they've "given up and said 'to hell with us'".

The having been said, I'd encourage people to consider hwo they phrase things... keep it constructive. Instead of "This location is great but worthless without...", consider "I appreciate the site in XXX that just opened, however it is difficult to reach on the East and West corridors as it now stands. If you don't already have plans for those locations, might I suggest considering the following sites...."

Certianly professionalism in Tesla's part dictates that they should provide a courteous response regardless of the tone of the customer msg... but why not keep it positive wherever possible encourage them to continue to foster a "working relationship" with us?

 

[napabill]

Ahhh... that response confirms what several of us have been saying here: Tesla is likely still actively developing the supercharger infrastructure plan. Just because the interim map updates have removed some sites, it doesn't mean that Tesla is not actively working to fill those gaps... and it certainly doesn't mean that they've "given up and said 'to hell with us'".

The having been said, I'd encourage people to consider hwo they phrase things... keep it constructive. Instead of "This location is great but worthless without...", consider "I appreciate the site in XXX that just opened, however it is difficult to reach on the East and West corridors as it now stands. If you don't already have plans for those locations, might I suggest considering the following sites...."

Certianly professionalism in Tesla's part dictates that they should provide a courteous response regardless of the tone of the customer msg... but why not keep it positive wherever possible encourage them to continue to foster a "working relationship" with us?

Appreciate your comments, however verbosity, IMHO, should be avoided whenever possible. Your approach uses 41 words, mine 7. And I disagree that my response was discourteous, as the last sentence, "Thanks, and keep up the good work." would indicate.

 

[scaesare]

... verbosity, IMHO, should be avoided whenever possible.

Disagreed. :wink:

 

[Kevin Harney]

Disagreed. :wink:

Well said. You catch more flies with honey !!

 

[napabill]

Well said. You catch more flies with honey !!

I prefer a fly swatter!:wink:

 

[SFOTurtle]

I prefer a fly swatter!:wink:

However the communication is made with Tesla, it is clear that Tesla is listening and also clear that they have not curtailed or scaled back the rollout of Superchargers as has been speculated by some on this thread over the past week. For anyone who isn't happy with the current and ever-changing map on Tesla's website, write to Tesla to voice your concerns!!

 

[Cottonwood]

Recent email I sent to TM:
Wanted to go on record that the Quartzsite SC location is wonderful, but worthless without something in the Cabazon/Indio area to the west and Buckeye/Gila Bend to the east. Very frustrating to those of us that need to get from NorCal to PHX/TUC. I talked my wife into spending the night at a KOA campground last spring, but she has indicated that that will be the last time for her. Please tell me something will be open by the end of the year!

Thanks, and keep up the good work.

...Bill (P83)

TM Response:
Hi Bill,
Thank you for your email. We are in the process of developing the LA to Phoenix corridor and indeed have sites planned for the Indio and Buckeye areas. We are targeting completion by very early 2014. Please continue to monitor our website for updates.

We appreciate your enthusiasm and support of Tesla and our Supercharger technology.

Thanks,
Tesla Supercharger Team

It very nice to see the individualized responses and candor in these replies from Tesla. :smile:

 

[RDoc]

Recent email I sent to TM:
Wanted to go on record that the Quartzsite SC location is wonderful, but worthless without something in the Cabazon/Indio area to the west and Buckeye/Gila Bend to the east. Very frustrating to those of us that need to get from NorCal to PHX/TUC. I talked my wife into spending the night at a KOA campground last spring, but she has indicated that that will be the last time for her. Please tell me something will be open by the end of the year!

Thanks, and keep up the good work.

...Bill (P83)

TM Response:
Hi Bill,
Thank you for your email. We are in the process of developing the LA to Phoenix corridor and indeed have sites planned for the Indio and Buckeye areas. We are targeting completion by very early 2014. Please continue to monitor our website for updates.

We appreciate your enthusiasm and support of Tesla and our Supercharger technology.

Thanks,
Tesla Supercharger Team

Were those Superchargers just re-added? They're on the posted Supercharger map aren't they?

 

[Cottonwood]

Mitchell SD is now showing in the onboard navigation with the latest minor firmware update (x.xx.25).

Mitchell showed up on my Nav screen today with version 5.6 in my MS. I believe that Supercharger locations are downloaded over the air independently of software versions. I did not have Mitchell yesterday and I do today without any SW upgrade. Mitchell is not on the Supercharger | Tesla Motors page yet, either as text or on the "Today" version of the map.

 

[Gear]

It looks like there's been a decent amount of talk about future sites being removed from the supercharger website. One I was really looking forward to seems to have been removed as well, which appeared to be between San Diego and Barstow along the 215. It was originally on there for "Fall 2013" but is gone now. I live in the mountains between there and a trip home from San Diego on a full charge would be cutting it pretty close because of the elevation change (I live at 6000'), so I was looking forward to being able to add a bit in the San Bernardino/Riverside area to be able to make it home more easily, but now that site seems to have been removed altogether. Furthermore, it'd be nice for the San Diego to Las Vegas trip so you don't have to divert through LA, and driving that route to my home from San Diego (through LA) would probably add a couple hours to the trip. Nobody would want to join me for that, lol.

PS, I apologize if this has already been discussed, but I couldn't read all 248 pages.

 

[markb1]

It looks like there's been a decent amount of talk about future sites being removed from the supercharger website. One I was really looking forward to seems to have been removed as well, which appeared to be between San Diego and Barstow along the 215. It was originally on there for "Fall 2013" but is gone now. I live in the mountains between there and a trip home from San Diego on a full charge would be cutting it pretty close because of the elevation change (I live at 6000'), so I was looking forward to being able to add a bit in the San Bernardino/Riverside area to be able to make it home more easily, but now that site seems to have been removed altogether. Furthermore, it'd be nice for the San Diego to Las Vegas trip so you don't have to divert through LA, and driving that route to my home from San Diego (through LA) would probably add a couple hours to the trip. Nobody would want to join me for that, lol.

PS, I apologize if this has already been discussed, but I couldn't read all 248 pages.

I emailed them about this one, as well as the Primm site. All I got was a canned response. But you should email them, too.