Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[Steve m]

On the subject of Tesla selling more shares and diluting current shareholders percentage of ownership.

If tesla did so just to sit on cash I would be hesitant. But if Tesla does so because the added cash grows the company value by more then the injected cash then I am all for it.

So what if my slice of the cake is a smaller percentage of the cake if my slice gets bigger at the same time.

 

[Oil4AsphaultOnly]

I have purchased thousands of N95 masks online from China and single use isolation gowns and DONATED them to local hospital where the staff were reusing the same mask for a week and using trash bags as protective gowns as well as donated to U.S. Hunger Relief Organization | Feeding America

So yes. There IS something you can do.

Telling yourself you can't do anything to help doesn't make it true

(To be clear, I think private individuals donating to for privately run hospitals to protect their workers - and by extension other patients and the community at large - is a terrible paradigm. But that's just where we are today)

Also, I could have had twice as many masks by now id the stupid FDA would allow KN95s. But if you aren't in America you could probably get your hands on some pretty easily.

Coronavirus: US Won't Allow Imports Of Millions Of KN95 Masks

When you privately buy N95 masks, you're actively participating in the mask shortage for the hospitals and healthcare workers! This is how this nation wound up with a toilet paper and rice shortage, because people were buying up what little supply there was, even though they didn't need it!

The CDC specifically asked people NOT to buy the N95 masks (whether or not it's for personal use doesn't change the fact that it's unavailable for medical staff to acquire). And yes, not allowing KN95's is dumb! Which is why effort needs to be expended to solving these ancillary problems that are NOT covid-19 related.

 

[Rammstein]

Some excellent analysis by @DaveT . Sounds very likely that some people knew about the GS note last week, and profited $100M+ off of short term call options.

God how can we find out next time someone buys that many short term calls.

 

[Scuttlebutt]

You may be right, and frankly I don't much care where the next USA factory goes. But I don't think Joplin would be impossible. One difference between Joplin and Reno is that Joplin is surrounded by larger cities, while Reno is kind of in the middle of nowhere. Reno would have to pull workers in from California, while Joplin could attract workers moving in from nearby cities all around it: Memphis, Oklahoma City, Kansas City, St Louis, and other smaller places. It's too far to commute: they'd have to move for the job. But plenty of people moved to Detroit for jobs, back in the day.

My vote for a new factory would be the Minneapolis/St Paul area or perhaps Duluth. The area has Rail and Great Lakes transport options and a central (but Northerly) location. Add in Tesla's engineering presence in Minnesota from a previous acquisition of PERBIX Robotics. Ford had the Ranger plant here for many years before it was shut down so automotive production is not unknown.

 

[Artful Dodger]

Monty Python - Four Yorkshiremen (Thirty years ago)

I’m willing to hold for years

You try to tell that to young people today, and they won't believe you:

OT:

Spoiler: Monty Python - Four Yorkshiremen

 

[Green Pete]

When you privately buy N95 masks, you're actively participating in the mask shortage for the hospitals and healthcare workers! This is how this nation wound up with a toilet paper and rice shortage, because people were buying up what little supply there was, even though they didn't need it!

The CDC specifically asked people NOT to buy the N95 masks (whether or not it's for personal use doesn't change the fact that it's unavailable for medical staff to acquire). And yes, not allowing KN95's is dumb! Which is why effort needs to be expended to solving these ancillary problems that are NOT covid-19 related.

That assumes a functioning market. I have friends and family who are healthcare workers. And the hospital doesn't have the supply chain knowledge to aquire these. Others have attempted to sell these masks for outrageous prices. The hospital system has been thankful for the support. The whole supply chain is broken. Hospitals in china had excess they no long need.

And if you disagree, you can still donate to food programs. So your assertion there is nothing you can do is wrong at least on one level, but in my opinio multiple levels.

If you think I'm hurting someone by seeing nurses wearing trash bags and reusing facemasks for a week for weeks and deciding to make a purchase to get them properly supplied in less than 5 days you are nuts.

 

[MC3OZ]

On the subject of Tesla selling more shares and diluting current shareholders percentage of ownership.

If tesla did so just to sit on cash I would be hesitant. But if Tesla does so because the added cash grows the company value by more then the injected cash then I am all for it.

So what if my slice of the cake is a smaller percentage of the cake if my slice gets bigger at the same time.

I'm in favour of all convertible notes converting, this does dilute current shareholders, but reduces debt, which in turn supports the share price, and lower interest payments also help.

That also frees up the cash they have on hand for expansion/survival IMO they have sufficient cash to fund both, unless expansion is more aggressive than I anticipate.

So if they are selling more shares because expansion is more aggressive than i anticipate, that is a good thing, provided they can handle that rate of expansion efficiently.

I'm sure the opportunities are there, judging how fast to expand, and expanding efficiently is not trivial, they already have some good expansions in place, I fully support of all of them.

Any major expansion that requires even more capital, would probably be battery related, if they are doing that, I expect them to make a strong case.

 

[ggr]

They moved it from an auto analyst to a tech analyst.


Adam Jonas is an auto analyst.. just saying..

Jonas is Morgan Stanley. But I understand, they all look the same to me...

 

[FrankSG]

I’m willing to hold for years

How much do you think TSLA will be worth at that point in a few years?

If TSLA is currently less than that, buy as long as its within your risk tolerance (e.g. if already 25% of your portfolio is TSLA, for some people that might be the maximum they're willing to put in 1 company).

If TSLA is currently equal to or above that, don't buy and sell if you hold any.

 

[StealthP3D]

The "inverters" that interface to the drive motors are not so much inverters as switched DC devices (probably driving multi phase windings on the motors). A true inverter that converts battery power to AC power will switch at a particular fixed voltage and fixed frequency, and would interface to the single phase load through a transformer. The motor drivers do none of this and are not really adaptable to the task. They are likely wired directly to the motors, and are not likely usable for power conversion besides direct motor drive that they are designed for.

[me: electrical engineer, studied this kind of thing in college but not in professional life.]

The motor inverters in EVs are software controlled variable-frequency inverters. Why do you think there is something preventing them from operating at a fixed frequency?

You say the inverters are likely wired directly to the motors and this is true in existing models, none of which have AC outlets. But we are speaking of the ability of new Tesla models like the Cybertruck being able to dual-purpose their drive inverters to create useable AC power while parked.

 

[gerebgraus]

source? Otherwise it's conjecture stated as fact.

Wrong conjecture. You can see Mongo's reply to my post.

 

[adiggs]

You may be right, and frankly I don't much care where the next USA factory goes. But I don't think Joplin would be impossible. One difference between Joplin and Reno is that Joplin is surrounded by larger cities, while Reno is kind of in the middle of nowhere. Reno would have to pull workers in from California, while Joplin could attract workers moving in from nearby cities all around it: Memphis, Oklahoma City, Kansas City, St Louis, and other smaller places. It's too far to commute: they'd have to move for the job. But plenty of people moved to Detroit for jobs, back in the day.

Joplin might be better than I initially thought. It's 60 miles from Bentonville (headquarters for Wal Mart and Tyson, two of the biggest companies in the country) and 90 miles from where I grew up (Eureka Springs, AR). Ok the latter bit doesn't make a difference, but the first one leads to a reasonably large base of technical people and other office types to draw from. Not Silicon Valley by any stretch, but also not an area where you need to import everyone.

And as somebody that grew up in the area, I can also attest to how livable and affordable it is. Even Bentonville where you'll find all those relatively well paid Wal Mart and Tyson IT and management folks is amazingly affordable. Anybody moving there from California will think there's a mistake in the pricing on houses there. $300-$500k will provide you a wide variety of choices for a 3,000 sq foot house on 1+ acres.

And the Ozarks make for some spectacular scenery and all sorts of outdoors activities.

It's also an area, at least where I grew up, where labor will be affordable and available of all kinds.

 

[LJS22]

TSLA is at 758 USD in Frankfurt currently

 

[Drumheller]

Probably because the last analyst was bought off by oil interests. Nobody is that stupid.

 

[heltok]

Tesla China Received Newly Business Licenses For Telecommunication & More

On April 15th 2020, Tesla (Shanghai) Co., Ltd. has added new business licenses to its business scope. The newly added business licenses are telecommunication, machinery rental, non-residential real estate leasing and car rental.
Quoting myself from 2019:

Could it be that NextMove vs Tesla drama hints about Elon/Tesla considering starting their own rental service? Compared to NextMove it seems that Tesla has quite a few advantages. Better brand recognition, cheaper service, cheaper software upgrades, better possibilities to stalk their customers, maybe better insurance etc. Sitting on a few appreciating rental Model 3s bringing in $1500/months seems like a nice business plan for them. And Tesla have access to the capital markets.

I for one would love to rent a Tesla a few months of the year from Tesla rather than doing it through NextMove. Just a thought. Anything preventing this?

 

[saniflash]

God how can we find out next time someone buys that many short term calls.

If this is a serious question, there are tools out there that give you real-time insight into the options order flow. e.g. LiveVol by CBOE (costs $99 per month)

(I am not affiliated with CBOE in any way)

 

[Quesder]

TSLA is at 758 USD in Frankfurt currently

Now is 12:23 am. How do you have Frankfurt tsla price 27 min who?

 

[FrankSG]

Now is 12:23 am. How do you have Frankfurt tsla price 27 min who?

Currently @ €689.3 -> $754.93

Just Google for "tsl0 stock"

 

[Eugene Ash]

Did the 13 day shorting limit rule expiring have an effect on that? I only have know what I'm talking about. Beware!

But, hopefully someone who knows will quote this and make sense of this mess of a comment.

Through previous inquiries, cover-short-exempt-within-13-days rule did not stop anyone from manipulating in recent past (only observing from late January).

Sold 105 shares at 573 on Friday, confident that I would be able to pick them up 30 or 40 dollars cheaper after the weekend.

LOL f**#ing rocket ship. ....

On at least 2 occasions @StealthP3D warned about it and even used rocketry-related terminology.

Study the blade, will you?

 

[bhtooefr]

That's not the point: the price has now been set for getting a Gigafactory in your State. Miniumum bid: $1,000,000,001.00

Cheers!

Well, no. You have to deliver more value than Joplin's bid.

That doesn't necessarily mean $1B+1 in incentives - if you have more and/or higher quality labor, better access to transportation infrastructure, better geographic positioning for Tesla's distribution requirements, lower risk of severe weather events, etc., etc., you can potentially deliver that value without incentives or with reduced incentives.