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Wow! I really like Tesla and am very serious / very close to buying a model S...I was thinking some time in Q4. But the more I read the posts in this forum the more I second-guess my thought process. Is it really that bad out there? I hear about how terrible navigation is. I hear about how there's really truly been no meaningful updates in the last few years (aside from facelift). I hear about the lack of compatibility with our mobile phones. I hear about the poor quality of materials used in the cars. I hear about how terrible service is. I hear about empty promises. I hear about cars that cost tens of thousands of dollars less yet are even better equipped and more advanced in some ways. I hear about the severe lack of creature comforts...The list kind of goes on and on. To add salt to my wounds - one of my friends works for a Tesla supplier and says the same thing AmpedRealtor said in his post (hence the reason I copied his post; I however am not trying to single out this particular individual). So...what am I missing here? Why do (seemingly) most of you all have Teslas? Am I (and other potential buyers) making a mistake? Would you buy a Tesla again? Sorry...had to vent. Which apparently this forum is great for that :(
If you want a true picture of what car to buy look at real statistics - not the forum. Despite our bitching there is still no other car I'd buy. People complain about the lack of progress, yes - but the fact is other cars have not advanced either in any meaningful way. Go drive a 7 series, an S class and a Tesla (rent each for a week) and then make a decision. For my money there is still nothing else that competes in overall pleasure and relaxation.
 
@T_E_S_L_A

my 2c .. today .. it makes ZERO sense to buy AP2 or AP2.5 over AP1.

With all due respect I completely disagree with you. If you had to take one of my Teslas away I would keep the AP2 car without hesitation. AP1 is a dead end (though a very good dead end) - AP2/2.5 is Tesla's future and they are continuously and furiously working on its code and its learning. AP1 and AP2 are close enough that I would choose to drive my AP2 car simply for vented seats and air springs right now. Make the cars equal, take one away and it's AP2 all day long because a) its present is very close to AP1 and b) its future holds much potential. Again AP1 is a dead end. If you buy some high mileage highly depreciated AP1 car and then swap later - maybe that's the most optimal optimal move. But if its one car now for several years - AP2 no question.
 
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To add salt to my wounds

Wait, what?

You got wounded?

I thought you were just reading stuff about Tesla online.

Technically, other peoples' opinions about Tesla online.

So here's a thought: Put down the noisy Internet, book a test drive and make up your own mind.

Or if angst, drama and uncertainty make you feel more alive/solvent than fast cars then keep reading/posting. ;)

TMC is a bit of a theatre/soap opera TBH.

Whilst it's true that Tesla are not as good at communication as traditional dealerships (oh, the irony), much of the stuff on here could be written in Caps Lock and read out in falsetto.

ETA: New site motto, right there. :D
 
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Wow! I really like Tesla and am very serious / very close to buying a model S...I was thinking some time in Q4. But the more I read the posts in this forum the more I second-guess my thought process. Is it really that bad out there?

It is good that you are getting information and adding it to your thought process. What you do with that information, in the end, is of course your choice.

I hear about how terrible navigation is.

Yes, it is actually a running joke in my family "the Tesla navigation". They openly mock it because it is that bad. But it gets the job done, usually, with a minor detour or two.

I hear about how there's really truly been no meaningful updates in the last few years (aside from facelift).

Tesla has been regressing in many areas, removing features from their cars, and not adding much. So this is true. That said, Model 3 was just released and I would expect maybe Q1-Q2/2018 is the time when many of those have rolled onto Model S/X. Wait a bit. Don't buy in Q4. Maybe something useful comes.

I hear about the lack of compatibility with our mobile phones.

Well, the Model S/X compability with mobile phones is on the 2009 level. So you get Bluetooth and you get a traditional charging cable. No wireless charging, no Android Auto, no Apple Carplay, no USB-C even.

I hear about the poor quality of materials used in the cars.

This is true. Some of it is rather atrocious. That said, many like the simple interior design scheme nevertheless.

I hear about how terrible service is.

Especially be prepared for long delays - and even more so if you crash. Months and months of waiting for parts is normal.

I hear about empty promises.

Basically any forward-looking statement from Tesla, well, don't trust it.

I hear about cars that cost tens of thousands of dollars less yet are even better equipped and more advanced in some ways.

High-end Teslas are expensive, yet do not offer really anything much extra than 0-60 acceleration (which is, of course, phenomenal). Buy a low-end Tesla and the value is a bit better.

I hear about the severe lack of creature comforts...

Depends on where you are coming from. I came from an Audi A8, I certainly lost a lot of creature comforts. Tesla's these days don't even have ventilated seats anymore.

The list kind of goes on and on. To add salt to my wounds - one of my friends works for a Tesla supplier and says the same thing AmpedRealtor said in his post (hence the reason I copied his post; I however am not trying to single out this particular individual).

AmpedRealtor is a long-time, trusted member on TMC and absolutely correct IMO.

So...what am I missing here? Why do (seemingly) most of you all have Teslas?

Two reasons: Tesla was a better company earlier on. They seemed to be on a better track up to around mid-2014. Then the horrors started. As for why most here have Teslas, well, one reason is some bought early and have only later become frustrated, the other is Tesla is the only large-battery BEV on the market. Having a large-battery BEV is great.

Am I (and other potential buyers) making a mistake

IMO anyone buying a Tesla today is making a mistake, if there is not a super-pressing reason to buy. Wait until 2018 and see what Tesla is like (because Model 3 upgrades are bound to roll over to S/X) and whether the competitive alternatives from Audi and Jaguar might be more for you (first non-Tesla large-battery BEVs - other than exotics - coming in 2018). Then make up your mind, is what I think.

Would you buy a Tesla again?

No company is perfect. If a comprehensive research would pinpoint a Tesla as the best compromise out of all, I would. At the moment it seems more likely that my next BEV is a Jaguar, though, or perhaps an Audi. I expect to replace an ICE with it, the Model X I will probably keep longer.
 
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If you want a true picture of what car to buy look at real statistics - not the forum.

Terrible advice. Don't take it, @T_E_S_L_A, IMO.

Statistics don't tell you what the best choice is for YOU. Read all the info and opinion, make up your own mind based on what you value. Buying based on statistics only work if you are a statistic and not an individual.
 
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"Routinely" is an understatement. You have posted 5,363 times in the last 1,538 days (3.5 posts a day). I looked at your recent post history and it is difficult to find a non-negative post. We get it. You don't like the company/autopilot/exterior/interior/driving exp/service center/elon's mom/tesla employees/etc...

Just... don't.

@AmpedRealtor is a long-time forum member, a trusted Tesla owner, with a long and varied history of opinion and ownership. You reducing him to some caricature is not accurate.

His negative thoughts are reflective of how his experience with Tesla has grown over time. I'm sorry to say, he is not the only one. Some of us came to Tesla with high enthusiasm and hopes years ago, only to be quite a bit less enthusiastic after following the company and the product closely over many years.

@T_E_S_L_A is making the right observation, asking the right question - there are a lot of owners disappointed in Tesla (especially Tesla the company) and that has been starting to show in the recommendations and opinions they pass forward. What @T_E_S_L_A decides to do with that info, though, of course is his/her choice.
 
Just... don't.

@AmpedRealtor is a long-time forum member, a trusted Tesla owner, with a long and varied history of opinion and ownership. You reducing him to some caricature is not accurate.

His negative thoughts are reflective of how his experience with Tesla has grown over time. I'm sorry to say, he is not the only one. Some of us came to Tesla with high enthusiasm and hopes years ago, only to be quite a bit less enthusiastic after following the company and the product closely over many years.

@T_E_S_L_A is making the right observation, asking the right question - there are a lot of owners disappointed in Tesla (especially Tesla the company) and that has been starting to show in the recommendations and opinions they pass forward. What @T_E_S_L_A decides to do with that info, though, of course is his/her choice.

After just having an inventory 90D Model S delivered last week, I was amazed at how it drove and having all the attention it got everywhere was exhilarating! I thought maybe it's just a new car excitement that I'm going through now but if I look forward to a year to two from now, I still think the joy of owning a Tesla will never wear off. The recent iPhone release brings up a good comparison between the two companies. Both were not the first to invent a new product in their class but the product they released is a better version that any competitor out there. The simplicity of their products (less luxury and more tech focused with Tesla vs removing headphone jack, home button with Apple), the ease of use of UI, along with powerful technology packed inside are other qualities that both companies share and explain why they both share such high customer satisfaction scores and their owners would purchase the same product again. It's just inevitable that a competitor will release a better BEV down the road but the truth is, owning a Tesla now will not leave you disappointed with buyer's remorse since it is miles better than an ICE ever will be and I'm glad that I can rely on continued support of additional supercharging access in urban areas and software updates that will continue to make my Tesla better no matter how minor or how slow they are. So, it's not surprise that other forward thinking companies are emulating this aspect. However, I have the peace of mind knowing that Tesla will maintain its competitive edge.
 
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I find the Tesla gripes laughable as well. I watch this forum much more than I post, but here goes. Sure, Elon consistently "over-promises", but the car is flat out awesome regardless.

I was hesitant making the leap as I am a traveling salesman....7 months and almost 24k miles later, I couldn't be happier with my decision. No more trips to the dealership every 6 weeks to get my oil changed. I use autopilot for 95% of my driving and it is getting better on local roads - the progress I have witnessed in the system in 7 months is impressive and yes I am running AP 2.0.

NAV? Compared to my '14 Honda Oddysey it is night and day. Didn't even buy the map update after 3 years because the NAV is useless on that car. Tesla NAV is great for me, if I'm running close on time, I will pull up waze on my phone b/c it does a little better with route planning and traffic.

Music and podcast streaming? Awesome, and I didn't upgrade the audio. Very pleased!

Nothing in life is perfect, but in my opinion nothing out there is even close to the Tesla I drive everyday. I didn't even mention the acceleration.
 
Ponzi scheme? Really?

"Routinely" is an understatement. You have posted 5,363 times in the last 1,538 days (3.5 posts a day). I looked at your recent post history and it is difficult to find a non-negative post. We get it. You don't like the company/autopilot/exterior/interior/driving exp/service center/elon's mom/tesla employees/etc...

Wow! That's a lot of investigative research for someone who has posted 56 times in two years. If you had an HW2 vehicle, you might find it difficult to find something positive to post about as well. :eek:
 
Wait, what?

You got wounded?

I thought you were just reading stuff about Tesla online.

Technically, other peoples' opinions about Tesla online.

So here's a thought: Put down the noisy Internet, book a test drive and make up your own mind.

Or if angst, drama and uncertainty make you feel more alive/solvent than fast cars then keep reading/posting. ;)

TMC is a bit of a theatre/soap opera TBH.

Whilst it's true that Tesla are not as good at communication as traditional dealerships (oh, the irony), much of the stuff on here could be written in Caps Lock and read out in falsetto.

ETA: New site motto, right there. :D
Terrible advice. Don't take it, @T_E_S_L_A, IMO.

Statistics don't tell you what the best choice is for YOU. Read all the info and opinion, make up your own mind based on what you value. Buying based on statistics only work if you are a statistic and not an individual.
you know exactly what I meant anxiety.
 
Okay, losing your home/neighborhood to a hurricane - that's a horror.

A lack of features on your current choice of car is an irritation.

Horror was a figure of speech here referring to the negative events in Tesla world compared to the relative bliss of the earlier Tesla days.

I would not compare them to real-world horrors, obviously.
 
@T_E_S_L_A

I bought a 100d in March, and I could not be more thrilled about my purchase. I went through the exact same anxiety as you reading these forums (and keep in mind, AP2 couldn't even work over 35mph back then). It was between a the Model S, or the Audi S7 loaded, and after a weekend of contemplation, I went with the Model S.

I am SUPER HAPPY with my choice. Here is the thing though, if you are buying it because you think it will be some ridiculous fantasy of full self driving, or not have issues like any other car, then maybe not. If you are looking for a car that can revolutionize your drive time unlike any other, be part of the EV revolution, and absolutely revolutionize your well marked freeway commute -- this car will do it unlike any other on the market today. And yeah... instant 0-60 in 4.2s is a huge plus (2.5s in the very expen$$ive P-100D models)

We drove to see the SFGiants last night (50miles), and took our Hybrid Ford Fusion because we fear door dings on the Tesla at the park -- and it was depressing. The whole time all I wished was that I could be int the Tesla, especially on the beautiful highway 280 drive from San Jose to San Francisco. There is no comparison in my book. The Audi "lane assist" is not auto-pilot, and won't drive that stretch for you the way the Tesla does.

It is true that Elon gets ahead of himself. If that bothers you, if your purchase is hinged on belief of his drivel (like full self driving - lol, I never believed that), and you tend to believe what manufacturers say to the letter, you may be unhappy. But not because it is not a great car, but only because of some sense of moral justice that makes it too difficult for you to enjoy the car.

Do what is right for you, not what others feel is right based on their belief of the company.

I looked at used... not for me, I want a new car, and I will run it for 10 years. Again, that's me. I have ZERO regrets about my purchase.

(Note: I also had a REUS audio system installed, the biggest factor that caused me to almost go Audi vs. Tesla was the sound system, even the premium one is not great -- so that was an extra >$4k, but worth every penny as audio is very important to ME)
 
But the more I read the posts in this forum the more I second-guess my thought process. Is it really that bad out there?

You pretty much summed it up well. I wish I had done more research, which I normally do with most purchases - large and small. Instead, I succumbed to the hype and dove head first into a murky Tesla pool that was only a few feet deep. Had I spent time on this forum prior to purchase, it is highly probable that I would have purchased something else, perhaps an AP1 CPO at best if Tesla, but likely another brand together.

There are a lot of positives when it comes to Tesla. There are many more negatives in my opinion.

My opinion may be skewed a bit as I am preparing to bring my car in for service for the 6th time since my April delivery. This time to tear off the roof, windshield and liftgate to fix a panel-gap issue. There's also the $4K+ estimate from a Tesla-authorized shop to touch up a dime-sized dent in the front bumper.

If your expectations are properly set, you may end up loving a new Tesla despite a few hiccups, if any. Fact is, there are issues, mostly small ones, but enough for me to be disappointed.

AP2 delays along with its relative poor performance is annoying. The lack of attention to fit and finish is most annoying.
 
If you want a true picture of what car to buy look at real statistics

Statistics will say anything if you beat them hard enough.
Let me pose a question for everyone here,

If Tesla were a child, how much on a scale of 1-5 do you like Tesla?

1 - Casey Anthony
2 -
3 - President Obama
4 -
5 - Michael Jackson

Lets see how many 1's and 5's we get to that question.

You want the real story, ask real owners, who have owned the car for 2-4 years. Or go to the service center early morning to see an owner bitching at Tesla while dropping their car off for the 5th time for the same issue or being charged rip off prices either out of service or what they thought should have been covered under warranty. Or talk to Tesla approved repair shops. Stats are BS.
 
All the complaints, except for the fact that Elon's mouth is bigger than what is delivered, are the same for every other car. Service complaints, recalls, individuals with various issues, "lemons" that make it out, etc. etc. The hyped up negativity on this forum is silly in my view, as others have said, it is the same for all types of cars.

The question isn't whether you can find examples of Tesla having issues, the question is how will your experience be vs. other choices in objective reality. I am so glad I didn't give in to the negativity, I'd be missing out on the experience I am having now as a very happy Tesla owner (who doesn't expect FSD, or local roads AP -- I just wanted AP in my well marked freeway commute, and it delivers!)

Don't buy the car based on what might be promised in the future (again, I'd never do that anyhow), but buy it based on how you will enjoy it. That said, getting a car with over the air updates is pretty darn cool, I must say!

And for those who got a lemon, or have to go to the service center 5 times, or experienced delays... bummer, I am sorry that happened to you, but this is not the normal Tesla owners experience.
 
And for those who got a lemon, or have to go to the service center 5 times, or experienced delays... bummer, I am sorry that happened to you, but this is not the normal Tesla owners experience.

They did a survey in the UK of Model X deliveries, the figures were roughly 2% could t even drive the car away, and 50% required remedial work. It's improved a bit since, but to say issues aren't normal is not something I agree with.