From the when new rating of 303 miles, I can easily get 250 miles on a road trip before charging...if I pushed it I'd think 275-290.....so far better than my friends e-tron re both range and getting close to epa estimate....driving with a heavy foot obviously this total is less as with all cars EV and ICE.....
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Wh/km (or mi) / range grossly mis-advertised, if not fraudulent... srsly.
- Thread starter yogi799
- Start date
There's no doubt that the way the EPA calculated range is broken. Range is affected by a lot of factors including HVAC use but the biggest factor is speed. Range should therefore be advertised on a 2 dimensional plot, speed on the x-axis and range on the y-axis.
But OP's complaint is specifically about the way Tesla advertises its range. Note that even if the EPA's methods are broken, nothing is stopping Tesla from going above and beyond and giving us the 2 dimensional plot.
Sounds like someone charging on 120V. There's a lot of reasons why you don't want to do that and this is one of them. Even if the battery doesn't need to be heated, 120V charging losses are on the order of 15-20% from running the car's computer.
To the OP....to understand the expected or advertised range, you have to understand EPA or other testing measures, mad compare apples to apples.
To assume that by driving 70-75mph for example and your going to meet the EPA "highway" mileage is silly. For those that have no clue, the average mph for the EPA highway is approx 48mph. I would almost guarantee that you'll get the advertised range if you maintained 48mph on the highway. IIRC the city average is in the high 20s.
To assume that by driving 70-75mph for example and your going to meet the EPA "highway" mileage is silly. For those that have no clue, the average mph for the EPA highway is approx 48mph. I would almost guarantee that you'll get the advertised range if you maintained 48mph on the highway. IIRC the city average is in the high 20s.
(I haven't read almost all of this thread.)
I've included a bunch of pointers to more info about EPA tests at Car battery: 340 miles. I drove 280. Came home with 5 miles left?.
The Secret Adjustment Factor Tesla Uses to Get Its Big EPA Range Numbers was likely covered in the earlier video someone pointed to.
Agree with most of your comments however, test details tab of Detailed Test Information mentions lab temp of 68 to 86 F for 3 of the test cycles, not specifically 75 F.
I've included a bunch of pointers to more info about EPA tests at Car battery: 340 miles. I drove 280. Came home with 5 miles left?.
The Secret Adjustment Factor Tesla Uses to Get Its Big EPA Range Numbers was likely covered in the earlier video someone pointed to.
Another problem is that the EPA, and auto manufacturers, use the "combined" city + highway mileage to estimate how much range you'll get. For ICE vehicles, which are generally driven until the tank is low on fuel and then refueled, this provides a fairly good estimate of how long you can go before you have to go to the gas station. But for an EV, it's a useless statistic. EVs are charged every night at home and you don't care how many miles they could have gone on a full battery when you are doing every day driving; you generally don't even charge them to 100% for daily use. When you do care about range in an EV an is for road trips, and that's generally the sustained 75-85 mph range. But that's not what's advertised.
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I've heard stories from a lady who sells Ford vehicles. They don't sell many Lightnings, but she said she's seen customers who bought one and tried to return it 2 days later utterly disappointed with the range LOL. Boy do I get their concerns now after owning a tesla in winter since November.
pdx_m3s
Active Member
If you’re so unhappy with the car, maybe it’s not the right car for you? I wouldn’t keep a car if I were as unhappy about it as you seem to be. Teslas and EVs in general aren’t for everyone. Many other good options in that price range.
I've read this post yet again, an again quickly, but I keep taking away that Yogi's more bent that the projects and data don't make sense than he is complaining about whatever range he gets. Not sure I'd blame him much. I can accept hits from cold, wind, driving style, etc.. BUt the darrn thing should be able to give me reasonable estimates, and it should log every erg of power so he has hard data on where it went. My sense is he's telling us nothing adds up..
Maybe not too, I have to admit I'm not going to read it a third time.
Maybe not too, I have to admit I'm not going to read it a third time.
Indeed it should. I have driven my Hyundai quite a lot this winter and the displaid range figures are accurate and in line with or better than the claimed range even in cold weather. Turning on the cabin heater for example immediately reflects in the range display. The MS R on the other hand displays a pretty fictitious mileage figure the only purpose of which seems to be to show some alignment with rated range.
sleepydoc
Well-Known Member
I just posted a thread on an article that tested the highway range of EVs driving 70 MPH. The short answer is range estimates among the cars tested were anywhere from 20% over to 20% under what they achieved. Teslas were on average 10% under. Also note that’s driving 70 MPH which causes significantly more drag from wind resistance.
Personally, I routinely get <240 Wh/mi in my 2020 MYLR when the weather is nice so I can confidently that the estimates are achievable if you drive conservatively in the right conditions. Exactly like they are with an ICE car.
teslamotorsclub.com
Personally, I routinely get <240 Wh/mi in my 2020 MYLR when the weather is nice so I can confidently that the estimates are achievable if you drive conservatively in the right conditions. Exactly like they are with an ICE car.
Real World Highway Range
I saw this article on InsideEVs just now comparing the highway range of EVs driving 70 MPH. It’s a nice comparison in as controlled a test as one can hope for. Not surprisingly the Luicid came out on top. Part of it’s from the sizable 118 kWh battery but it also managed to achieve an impressive...
teslamotorsclub.com
I think i have said countless times that the car drives amazing. so what? accept garbage range estimates because the car drives so well. why not COMMENT, COMPLAIN, and the get the company to FIX THE DARN ESTIMATES and strive to make a perfect vehicle?
Thanks brotha, so tired of having to explain the post. Yes, so many posters confirmed range estimates are garbage. Car is a dream to drive otherwise.
thanks bro. Yes, their intent seems so unclear. So fake. So .... They have the technology to estimate it well , including LEARNING that some of us love to drive real fast... Google maps has learned my style long ago and gives me amazing ETA estimates. Tesla is stuck in the stone age for some unexplained reasons.
Do y'all not use the built in navigation? It takes many factors into account, including elevation change, weather, speed limits, and traffic, and is usually shockingly accurate at telling you how much charge you'll arrive at your destination with. From most reviews and comparisons I've seen, it's one of the most accurate systems out there. If you don't want to put your destination into navigation, there's also the energy app that can show you a range estimate based on your last 5, 15, or 30 miles driven. Personally, I don't want the range remaining shown in the app and on the main screen to be making wild predictions... it has no idea where I'll be driving, when I'll be driving, or anything. I just set that one to show percent, because it's meant to be like a fuel gauge, not a range predictor... the navigation and energy apps are for range prediction.
TesslaBull
Member
Just as another data point, my car is usually within <1% variance in terms of energy usage/battery SOC when I reach my destination. I use the cars navigation. For example, when I leave home to go to work, I am normally at around 54% state of charge. Navigation predicts ~45% upon arrival and is usually right on the money. Same for driving home. The amount I charge matches displayed energy used. Only thing I have *not* done is measure the actual amount of electricity I use to put the 14 or so kW of daily usage back into the car to account for charging losses. I have a dumb charger so I'm going to look into putting a sensor on my charging circuit to track, just out of curiosity.
Yes, just use navigation and energy graph. It is very good and shows exactly where you are at energy wise.
My repeated point that doesn't disagree with OP is why not make the range display by default a more useful, intelligence based figure? It could easily link to driver profile too and would also work even if a route isn't set.
For gross vs net energy, need external meter or 3rd party app AFAIK.
pdx_m3s
Active Member
Wish Tesla would make % the default, with the option for remaining miles as a secondary statistic based on trailing 30-mile usage as opposed to EPA rated. EPA rated doesn't add much value to the driver unless one is driving in ideal conditions. It really shouldn't be an option to select from.
Also would be nice to have an easy to access battery health percentage like Apple iPhones do.
Also would be nice to have an easy to access battery health percentage like Apple iPhones do.
sleepydoc
Well-Known Member
pdx_m3s
Active Member
sleepydoc
Well-Known Member
yup- you wanted Tesla to list the battery percentage by default. mine's set to do that.
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