TMC is an independent, primarily volunteer organization that relies on ad revenue to cover its operating costs. Please consider whitelisting TMC on your ad blocker or making a Paypal contribution here: paypal.me/SupportTMC

Why I almost never use Tesla's navigation

Discussion in 'Model S: User Interface' started by David99, Mar 19, 2015.

  1. David99

    David99 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2014
    Messages:
    2,048
    Location:
    Brea, Orange County
    Some might feel it's a dead horse, others feel there is no issue with the on board navigation. I have been frustrated with it since day one. I hoped for updates, but one year and 40k miles later, I'm still frustrated.

    Here are some of the issues that make me use Waze almost all the time.

    - The on board maps are outdated. On my way to work is a major, 2 year construction. Tesla's navigation always leads me in the dead end where the road is closed and has been close for over a year now. Waze knows about the construction and finds a way around it. This is just one example. But since this is a route I drive every day, it is wrong every day!

    - Tesla's navigation is unaware of HOV and express lanes. In California, the Model S can use the HOV lanes even when driving alone and I have a FastTrack Transponder. Tesla's navi tries to avoid busy freeways while Waze knows the difference in the lanes and finds a much faster route. Especially in heavy traffic the difference is significant.

    - Waze has reports of road hazards and police and other things. Those reports have helped me many times.

    - Tesla's navi has no alternative routes I can pick from. Waze calculates 2 other alternatives. I often look at them and sometimes decide if I prefer a shorter route to save energy even when it's a few minutes longer.

    - Tesla's navi doesn't allow me to tap on a point on the map and use that as a favorite or destination. This is very annoying. I see exactly where it is on the map, but I can't tell it to go there.

    - Tesla's navi only has one destination, no waypoints.

    There are other issues. For example on a road I use a lot there is a left turn possible where Tesla's navi doesn't think there is. It always tries to route me in a way to come from the other side of the road to make it a right turn, creating an unnecessary detour. While some issues are not a big deal, especially the HOV and toll lanes are a major problem navigating through Los Angeles traffic. I don't expect Tesla to fix it all. There really is no need to re-invent the wheel over and over. It could be solved by allowing third party apps and having Waze (or your favorite navigation app) run like it does on every phone.

    And while we are at navigation: there is no excuse for the lack of a data base of public chargers. Elon sais he is not in it for just Tesla, but for a global change. Having a database of public chargers integrated into the navigation system is frankly a no-brainer for any EV. Yes the reliability and accessibility of public chargers is an issue, but there are simple ways to make it work as we can see with PlugShare. I was hoping that would be the update Elon was talking about recently, but it seems the database of chargers is Only Tesla's own chargers and those you visited. That's counter productive and misses the point. When I go on a trip I am very likely to go in an area where I don't know where chargers are.
     
  2. dirkhh

    dirkhh Middle-aged Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2013
    Messages:
    3,645
    Location:
    Portland, OR, USA
    In summary: Tesla's navigation is fine.
    It's just no match for Waze. And I believe that is true for every single commercially available navigation system.
    Waze is unbelievably good. That's why my car has a phone holder that puts the (tiny looking) iPhone 6 plus right next to the big screen.
    And weirdly (I know), I tend to use both at the same time :)
     
  3. Blu Zap

    Blu Zap Grinning member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2014
    Messages:
    437
    Location:
    San Rafael, CA
    @David99 Good tip on Waze. I have wondered about the carpool lane routes vis a vis traffic congestion. I figured the firmware update would not consider that. Of course Google Maps doesn't either. if Waze can do it, that means the sensor data is available for that routing. Thanks.
     
  4. David99

    David99 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2014
    Messages:
    2,048
    Location:
    Brea, Orange County
    Google owns Waze so Google maps should be able to have the info.
    The HOV lane thing is a setting in Waze, It doesn't have accurate enough info which lane you are in. Just just tells you to use it and then assumes you do.
     
  5. Brass Guy

    Brass Guy Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2014
    Messages:
    505
    Location:
    Stoughton, MA
    Very often I prefer to select a point on the map for a destination. It's often quicker than typing in an address, especially so with the big screen. Occasionally I don't have the address but know where it is - one commuter lot that's designated as a meeting point is on "unnamed road," so doesn't seem to even have an address but is easy to spot on the screen.
    IMO lack of waypoints easily takes second place.
    I can see both of these issues (and more) resolved over the years with updates, but I've had my car over 18 months and none of these features have been added. No, I still don't miss the tech package at all.
     
  6. eco5280

    eco5280 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2014
    Messages:
    620
    Location:
    Country
    I disagree because it doesn't let you avoid toll roads. I live near one and every route puts me on the toll road. So navigation is seriously borderline useless.
     
  7. Lump

    Lump Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2013
    Messages:
    2,101
    Location:
    So. Cal.
    I go in for service tomorrow so I am going to look for those feature request forms Jerome mentioned & just write WAZE.
     
  8. mknox

    mknox Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2012
    Messages:
    8,552
    Location:
    Toronto, ON
    Yep, same here. Even a basic TomTom or Garmin has better routing features than the Tesla app. Folks on these forums have been telling me for 2 years it will get better with updates, but with no route options, no waypoints and lack of construction/accident awareness it hasn't gotten a whole lot better for me anyway. I don't have to use it that often, and for very basic Point A to Point B it's okay, especially if I'm already vaguely familiar with the area since I can route myself around tolls or construction and let it put me back on course. Unfortunately it was a big part of my decision to order the Tech Package. (and don't get me started on iPod integration...)
     
  9. Brass Guy

    Brass Guy Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2014
    Messages:
    505
    Location:
    Stoughton, MA
    That was the main reason I considered it at all, but could not justify it.
     
  10. iadbound

    iadbound Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2014
    Messages:
    637
    Location:
    No. VA
    I haven't used the navigation much. I travel the same route to work, etc. and I've lived in my area for 25+ years. Thus, I can usually puzzle out where I'm headed. Generally, I'm looking for last mile guidance, and I think the Tesla nav does just fine in those circumstances.

    That being said, I find it frustrating that Tesla is putting so much work into improving the navigation system to alleviate so-called range anxiety, but it doesn't seem to be making improvements in the basic functionality and routing logic, which updates would surely help reduce energy usage.

    One question arises in that regard: can Tesla even change the routing logic elements itself since it buys that system from a vendor (can't remember which one).?
     
  11. JohnQ

    JohnQ Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2012
    Messages:
    1,585
    Location:
    Redding, CT
    Navigon is the vendor and has the capability to display multiple routes, incorporate waypoints, exclude toll roads, highways, ferries, etc. Tesla just didn't incorporate that functionality into their implementation. I have Navigon on my phone, perhaps I'll compare the primary routing that Navigon gives me to what's recommended by Tesla to see if there are discrepancies.
     
  12. David99

    David99 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2014
    Messages:
    2,048
    Location:
    Brea, Orange County
    Some good points made here. I never thought about avoiding toll roads, but it a very important feature that Tesla's navi is also missing. For an EV having the route calculated as 'most energy efficient' would be a very useful option as well.

    Navigation isn't just a convenience feature. In major cities with lots of traffic it really helps diverting traffic and thus overall helps utilize the roads better. It helps redirect traffic around blocked roads and accidents in real time avoiding grid locks. It gives you heads up of hazards. It shows you arrival times that you can share with the people that are waiting for you. It helps the car managing energy usage when it's aware how far you have to go. It can detect a driving pattern and predict traffic in a certain time and tell you it might be better to leave a little earlier or later. There are many advantages that go far beyond getting basic directs from A to B. That's why I use it all the time even if I know the route in and out. It's in everyone's interest to have a very good navigation system in your car.
     
  13. donv

    donv Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2013
    Messages:
    567
    Location:
    Lake Jeanclia, OR
    I also use both. I have a commute which allows me to use several possible routes, depending on traffic, so I use them every day to figure out which is best.

     
  14. FlasherZ

    FlasherZ Sig Model S + Sig Model X + Model 3 Resv

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2012
    Messages:
    7,019
    #14 FlasherZ, Mar 20, 2015
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2015
    I regularly provide feedback on the navigation system. :)

    Despite having the newest maps, the navigation system doesn't know about the Stan Musial - Veterans Memorial Bridge carrying I-70 over the Mississippi... it opened February, 2014. Tesla reports that it's a Navigon maps issue and has forwarded my feedback for their resolution. Meanwhile, the navigation system freaks out when I take the bridge, wanting me to turn left and right on all sorts of surface streets down below in East St. Louis.

    It also has a horrible habit of wanting me to drive through St. Jacob, IL - a small town with a speed limit of 25 mph. It seems to think that a slow roll through town and then a rural backroad is a faster route to IL-4 from US-40 than just taking US-40 directly to IL-4. I think it gets confused when cars have to sit at the stop sign, and thinks there's a traffic jam there. I can tell you that with the exception of an accident, US-40 to IL-4 will win out compared to 15 blocks at 25 mph in St. Jacob, IL.

    This is nearly always the best and fastest way:

    40-to-4.PNG

    This is the way the Tesla tells me to take 95% of the time:

    ellis-rd.PNG

    (Note that "road construction" really isn't road construction, that ended months ago.
     
  15. SabrToothSqrl

    SabrToothSqrl Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2014
    Messages:
    1,519
    Location:
    PA
    yea, I started a similar theme thread.. Tesla vs. google navigation.

    I'm just glad 6.2 means I don't have to try to use evtripplanner from the dash any more.
     
  16. Cosmacelf

    Cosmacelf Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2013
    Messages:
    3,399
    Location:
    San Diego
    #16 Cosmacelf, Mar 20, 2015
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2015
    I just got my car back from service. While it was there, I complained about a particularly bad route that Tesla nav always gives me for coming back from the Palm Springs area to San Diego. The Tesla way is about 140 miles long and 2h 30m. If I ignore that and go the over the mountain route, it recalcs it to be 110 miles and 2h 10m. Tesla's response in the service notes:

    "Inspected log data, found vehicle routing trip to maintain proximity to charging stations. No repair necessary at this time."

    Which is actually nonsensical since the nav way actually takes more energy.

    ----

    Update: After asking my service advisor if he really meant what was written, he replied:

    "[FONT=&quot]The latest firmware (which we installed onto your vehicle during the curtesy inspection) changed that, and will route you to the most direct route available. The next firmware to be released will be able to give you more control of that. "

    The firmware they applied was [/FONT]
    6.1(2.2.200). So take it for what it's worth...
     
  17. jcaspar

    jcaspar Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2013
    Messages:
    793
    Location:
    Sacramento
    I almost never use it as I almost always know where I'm going! :wink:

    When I do use it it works well but looking forward to 6.2. Usually Waze is a bit better but I have noted several times were Tesla had a better route than Waze. And the Tesla system is much more convenient than Waze on my iPhone 6.
     
  18. Zythryn

    Zythryn MS 70D, MX 90D

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2009
    Messages:
    1,660
    Location:
    Minnesota
    For me, it works great. Better than any other I have used, including Garmin.

    However, I don't have toll roads nearby.
    I've found a number of alternative routes in the area I had never found before, and find I like quite a bit.

    I would like to see improvements, such as a choice of fastest, quickest, Eco routes.

    To those with complaints, if you are complaining and have not sent a notice to Tesla with specifics, I have no sympathy for you.
    Without notice they need to fix something, it won't get fixed.
    To those that have contacted Tesla with specifics, thank you!
     
  19. BillShepp

    BillShepp Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2012
    Messages:
    41
    Location:
    Los Altos, California, United States
    Where is it a setting in Waze? I could neither find it in Waze nor a reference to it online...
     
  20. lphe

    lphe Member

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2015
    Messages:
    108
    Location:
    Eagan, MN
    When I was looking at a Tesla at the dealership yesterday, the map was very slowly painted to the screen, as if it was downloading the map from the internet. Does the car have to fetch the maps from the internet? Or does it have a local map database that it can display. If so, why does it take several seconds to draw the map?
     

Share This Page